Keto Diet and the Truth.

[Beti ona]

However in one study by Holt et al. (1997) they showed that the insulin response from beef and bread and fish and rice were very similar. So if insulin secretion caused fat gain it would come from protein as well.

Well, we know that protein can be converted into sugar, but it is a process that spends more calories, so it does not matter if it elevates insulin as rice does. Anyway, that would not keto, if there is fat in the food, the protein will not be used as energy.

On the other hand, until now, we do not know that someone becomes a diabetic because of a high protein intake.

There is a lot to this though and again everyone is different. Your response to certain diets can change over time due to what you have done before, blood markers (thyroid etc), health, stress, training and drugs. Layne Norton has written about keto vs carb diets in great detail so it's worth checking out.

Good point!

 

[Beti ona]

Some top guys don't do keto but very low carb diets all the time in prep. I have seen many top pro's talk about going without carbs for weeks but they are also not consuming tonnes of fat either. Although I am sure they are doing keto at times too.

In my opinion, we must differentiate a keto diet high in fat from a "keto diet" low in carbohydrates. The first option is ideal for the average person who wants to lose fat and stay healthy in 12-14% of BF, while the second option, pro+veggies (and traces of fats/CH) is the way forward for most people who want to get unsustainable and extremely low BF limits.

Pro bodybuilders, well, have nothing to do with most people because of their genetics, much less those who are not using the crazy gear stacks.

 

[Beti ona]

Keto is one way to achieve something I've never seen before.

**broken link removed**

Awesome!!

I found this interesting.

you DO NOT need to keep fats higher than protein. Keto is the absence of carbs and had nothing to do with fat intake. You can eat nothing but protein (PSMF diet) and reach ketosis.

If this is true, then insulin can not be kept high by eating protein (chicken) in the same way that it is raised by eating Carbs (rice).

I just purchased a glucometer and more than 200 strips, so I'll be doing tons of tests with different food combinations.

 

[PYGMY]

The leanest I’ve ever been was while eating 250 grams of carbs a day at a body weight under 200 pounds. I’ve tried Keto a few times and every time I leaned out slower, felt shittier, looked overall worse and dealt with insane cravings from day one of beginning the meal plan.

Everyone is different though. I’m sure it works great for some people. I’m just not one of those people.

 

[jeroendebleser]

I think the ketosis-high does a lot of people in thinking it's a good thing.

 

[Beti ona]

I think the ketosis-high does a lot of people in thinking it's a good thing.

In terms of health and longevity, it is really good, along with IF and calorie restriction.

 

[jeroendebleser]

Has ANY top olympian competitors done keto diets? i am a prett big fan of the sport and foloow it fairly well. i cant name 1 bodybuilder in top 10-15 guys in the world that do a keto diet. but all you low level guys think its best lmao.
can anyone name ONE keto genetic guy that became or is a pro? i cant think of one. jay cutler ate shit ton of carb-s. ronnie did too. :lightbulb:
-F2S

While I agree with Elvia that they aren't the measuring stick, this can't be disregarded entirely neither. I also think the 'Palumboism'-look Palumbo and others had while on keto-diets is largely down to the carbless diets they were on. They produce a run-down, tired look after a while.

 

[jeroendebleser]

In terms of health and longevity, it is really good, along with IF and calorie restriction.

IF and calorie restriction certainly. Keto-diets... not convinced.

 

[Beti ona]

IF and calorie restriction certainly. Keto-diets... not convinced.

https://www.chemistryworld.com/news/the-atkins-hormone/3003927.article

 

[Elvia1023]

In my opinion, we must differentiate a keto diet high in fat from a "keto diet" low in carbohydrates. The first option is ideal for the average person who wants to lose fat and stay healthy in 12-14% of BF, while the second option, pro+veggies (and traces of fats/CH) is the way forward for most people who want to get unsustainable and extremely low BF limits.

Pro bodybuilders, well, have nothing to do with most people because of their genetics, much less those who are not using the crazy gear stacks.

Exactly. Regarding the other post my point was more people only think you get an insulin response from carbs but it's not the case. That study highlights this very well. Although there are other factors such as the body readily using carbs before protein as an energy source. Protein takes much longer to be broken down than carbs. We all know if we just ate protein only it would be near on impossible for many of us to get fat. So sure the potential of fat gain is higher with overeating carbs and/or fats.

Regarding diabetes (type 2) another misconception is it caused by just overeating carbs/sugar but it's weight gain from eating any food. Although carbs generally have the most impact on blood sugar levels so they are the primary macro to keep an eye on. That combined with lack of exercise (etc) and over time your chances can increase of developing type 2 diabetes.

At the end of the day we all try many diets and some guys love keto so there is reason for it. I personally hate not eating carbs.

 

[Elvia1023]

IF and calorie restriction certainly. Keto-diets... not convinced.

I agree. Keto can help with some health conditions. IF and calorie restriction certainly as you state and that could be done with low fat or low carbs. It also depends upon what carbs and fats people are eating. A diet with restricted calories, lean protein, some healthy fats (avocado, evoo, cashews etc), greens and high nutrient dense carbs such as fruit (berries etc) sounds ideal to me.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Elvia hitting the nail on the head, as per usual :headbang:

 

[Beti ona]

I agree. Keto can help with some health conditions. IF and calorie restriction certainly as you state and that could be done with low fat or low carbs. It also depends upon what carbs and fats people are eating. A diet with restricted calories, lean protein, some healthy fats (avocado, evoo, cashews etc), greens and high nutrient dense carbs such as fruit (berries etc) sounds ideal to me.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/15-conditions-benefit-ketogenic-diet

There are very few conditions and situations in which a subject should NOT follow a low in carb/ keto diet. A person without appetite who needs to put on muscle mass, certain elite athletes, and well, bodybuilders with ultra-fast metabolisms and/or want to use slin.

 

[Beti ona]

Regarding diabetes (type 2) another misconception is it caused by just overeating carbs/sugar but it's weight gain from eating any food.

Is it possible to become a diabetic by eating 70% calories from fats and a calorie surplus of 2,000 calories? It would be interesting to see what happens, given that the high consumption of fats will make you stay in ketosis, but excess calories will cause you to accumulate fat, and excess body fat spoils your sensitivity to insulin.

 

[rgrmedic]

As I get older I have found keto works great for me. You feel like shit if you break keto though.. then feel horrible for a few days getting back into it.. once I’m in I feel great and I look even better. Never join a keto Facebook page though.. it’s filled with life long fatty housewives spout terrible “tips” to other life long fatties.. literally hundreds of times a day the same question gets asked “hey guys, I’m 35 375lbs and I’ve been doing keto for the last three days and I have t lost any weight. What can I do to break my stall?”

 

[Chipper Jones78]

As I get older I have found keto works great for me. You feel like shit if you break keto though.. then feel horrible for a few days getting back into it.. once I’m in I feel great and I look even better. Never join a keto Facebook page though.. it’s filled with life long fatty housewives spout terrible “tips” to other life long fatties.. literally hundreds of times a day the same question gets asked “hey guys, I’m 35 375lbs and I’ve been doing keto for the last three days and I have t lost any weight. What can I do to break my stall?”[/QUOTE]

That's awesome made me chuckle

And I know your not joking...I hate lazy people who complain

 

[liquid_c]

As I get older I have found keto works great for me. You feel like shit if you break keto though.. then feel horrible for a few days getting back into it.. once I’m in I feel great and I look even better. Never join a keto Facebook page though.. it’s filled with life long fatty housewives spout terrible “tips” to other life long fatties.. literally hundreds of times a day the same question gets asked “hey guys, I’m 35 375lbs and I’ve been doing keto for the last three days and I have t lost any weight. What can I do to break my stall?”[/QUOTE]

That's awesome made me chuckle

And I know your not joking...I hate lazy people who complain

OMG you're not kidding!! I was on that Dr. Berg group just for laughs for a while when I got kicked off when I commented on a post about bread and butter. The poster said sorry for blaming you butter for making me fat, it was the bread all along. I simply stated that both together have quite a few calories and either or both can make you fat. They seem to be in denial. There are even people on the group that are absolutely convinced fat cannot be stored as fat as long as you keep carbs low.

 

[NY Muscle]

I've been following a ketogenic for decades and then I started to incorporate intermittent fasting with my keto diet 5 years ago.

I'm quite possibly in the best shape of my life because of this at 45 years old.

No one is more pro keto than me, I was doing 'bodyopus" before Dan Duchaine wrote his book... and actually he wrote some my experiences in his book. I'm an old G keto and knew those 1990s gurus..... and we were doing these things way before anyone put it on paper other than Dr Atkins and Dr Depasquale.

I even own a keto brand and LLC. All that being said is just to let you know how Pro keto I am but at the same time I'm anti bullshit.

At the end of the day it's no better than a regular diet .....40 years of science has showed that calories in versus calories out is the main predictor of body fatness.

In a medical ward setting and in studies you'll see there's no difference between low fat and low carb but in real world and after dealing with hundreds upon hundreds of clients over 25 years of training people, without a shadow of a doubt my keto clients have always done better and got leaner than my non keto clients. But that doesn't mean it's a better diet... it just means for certain people it's easier to follow...easier to.."eat less"..

The ketogenic just makes it easier to eat less and actually those who follow a rather higher protein ketogenic diet like me get the natural satiating effect of all that protein

The whole insulin theory-hypothesis of fat loss is utter bullshit. Its #energybalance. Ignore ANYTHING uttered by Dr Fung, Berg etc.

Most of the dipshits in keto Facebook groups are doing therapeutic medical ketosis and stuff themselves with oil and butter and are still fat.. it's not keto for fat loss and body recomposition that I've been following for decades.. I consume 250 +gm of protein (gluconeogenesis is demand driven so please don't fall for that stupid myth either)...carbs under 25 gm and I vary my fat intake between 50 to 125 gm a day and then of course I carb up periodically via ckd

I eat 1 to 2 meals a day max. (IF)

I couldn't imagine any other way of eating..for me...

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[NY Muscle]

Is it possible to become a diabetic by eating 70% calories from fats and a calorie surplus of 2,000 calories? It would be interesting to see what happens, given that the high consumption of fats will make you stay in ketosis, but excess calories will cause you to accumulate fat, and excess body fat spoils your sensitivity to insulin.

Yes. And fatty liver is never a good thing.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[Beti ona]

The underlying reality is that we are not designed to eat tons of food without adversely affecting health. No animal species eats in excess, there is no such possibility in nature.