Keto diet, refeed help!

invain · Sep 30, 2009

Here's the rundown:

I was going keto 5 days a week, with a small refeed on Wednesday and normal refeed on Sunday. Really didn't think I was lean enough to need 2 carb ups a week so I dropped it to 6 days keto and a refeed on Sunday. Seems to be working pretty well so far but this week my energy has been terrible and I'm wondering if my refeeds are enough. I usually take in 500 - 600 grams carbs, keeping my cals around 500 above maintenance. I eat some candy and high gi carbs during most of the day since my refeed is only 12 - 14 hours but I switch to lower gi stuff like oatmeal and whole wheat pasta towards night. I also keep fats pretty low, (50 - 60 grams or less).

I know some people go insane on refeeds, but obviously I'm worried about gaining much back, especially since my deficit during the week isn't very extreme. Do I really need to worry about my cals during my refeed day? Should I shoot for something closer to 1000 grams carbs? I know some people refeed over 2 days, is there much benefit to a longer refeed?

hardcoremt · Oct 1, 2009

invain said:
Here's the rundown:

I was going keto 5 days a week, with a small refeed on Wednesday and normal refeed on Sunday. Really didn't think I was lean enough to need 2 carb ups a week so I dropped it to 6 days keto and a refeed on Sunday. Seems to be working pretty well so far but this week my energy has been terrible and I'm wondering if my refeeds are enough. I usually take in 500 - 600 grams carbs, keeping my cals around 500 above maintenance. I eat some candy and high gi carbs during most of the day since my refeed is only 12 - 14 hours but I switch to lower gi stuff like oatmeal and whole wheat pasta towards night. I also keep fats pretty low, (50 - 60 grams or less).

I know some people go insane on refeeds, but obviously I'm worried about gaining much back, especially since my deficit during the week isn't very extreme. Do I really need to worry about my cals during my refeed day? Should I shoot for something closer to 1000 grams carbs? I know some people refeed over 2 days, is there much benefit to a longer refeed?

Your energy is prolly down because of insufficient Fat intake throughout the week. Not because of your refeed. Post an example of your Diet Day and i can help.

invain · Oct 1, 2009

Normal day for me is 2500 cals, pretty close to 60% from fat 40% from protein. For example, yesterday I had ~160 grams fat and ~250 grams protein. This week I've started dropping the cals slightly to 2300 - 2400, still pretty close to 60/40 with minimal trace carbs.

Right now I'm about 210 fully carbed up and hydrated, somewhere around 12% bf.

Lou · Oct 1, 2009

How much time passed before your first refeed?

invain · Oct 1, 2009

Lou said:
How much time passed before your first refeed?

I don't really understand the question? Do you mean when I first started keto? I'd been following a low carb diet for a month or two before I started keto, I never did go a couple weeks before my first refeed like some people do though.

Dave_19 · Oct 1, 2009

I cannot tell you exactly what to do or how much based on that, but I do use a technique with my keto/CC diet using extended carb up days. Basically you eat about 9 meals/day instead of 6, wake up a couple hours earlier and go to bed a few hours later. (to fit the meals in).

meals 1-6 look like a traditional carb up day, except I start high High GI tapering down to low GI as I near meal 6. So Malto-Dex shake meal 1, maybe brown rice meal 6. Meal 7 depending on the individual may be another carb meal or a 50:50 carb/protein meal in terms of grams.

Meal 8 is usually lean protein and healthy fats 80:20 ratio or around there.

Meal 9 is carb free, high in healthy fats moderate protein. I consider it a fat load. So 10g of fish oil, 1/4c almonds, and 1 Tbsp of coconut oil w/ Casein protein/water would be typical.

A lot of times I will alternate this day and do fasted cardio in the AM before eating, since you are usually in the most depleted state the AM of a high day fasted. This depends on goals and where your body fat sits, if I use fasted cardio on a high day it won't be 9 meals long.

Another variation depending again on goals, and where you're sitting is a depletion style high day. I usually will use this the last few weeks. You would basically work out very early having just a few pieces of fruit to kick your self out of ketosis, and train entire or 1/2 the body (usually upper only, or lower only, of full) I like doing just upper or lower. I won't get into how to do a depletion work out because its very lengthy are already posted up all over the site I'm sure. but PWO instead of Malto <4 weeks out I use Dextrosoe, and >4 weeks out malto. I like a 2:1 ratio PWO of Dextrose:whey, so maybe 150:75g. 90-120mins later you will start on whole foods and continue on your high day. Depletion style high days I like after very prolonged periods in ketosis, you can guage this by monitoring endurance in the gym, paying attention to muscle glycogen. If you burn out quickly but you're not tired deep into a keto state, you are probably in need of a high day.

Last I don't believe 2 high days in a row, almost for no athletes, 1.5 can do the trick, if you need 2 high days in a row I think you should decrease the gap between carb ups instead.