Knee pain.... Patellar tendon?

[Evom1]

First I apologize if this is the wrong spot, second I've searched and cannot find a definite answer

A couple months back I started going heavy on Leg press, wearing knee sleeves, and still staying over 10reps. One day after leaving the gym my knees had a pain right below my knee cap going down stairs.

Since then they intermittently, but frequently hurt. Driving ends up making my right knee kill after a while just below my knee cap from having it bent for a while. If I start with leg press or leg extension I can't handle it cuz it hurts too much. But starting with Squats is ok.

I've been foam rolling the crap out of my legs . Quads Hams Glutes hips and calfs and it does help some but doesn't eliminate it.

Daily I take 6g fish oil, 4g vit c, 6,000iu vit d. Also avoid dairy, gluten, and other inflammatory foods. Yet the problem is still there. Once my knees are really warmed up, they don't hurt. Like I can do Squats, and move on to extensions and they're pretty much fine.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.



One last bit, 2012 I dislocated my right knee. No tears no surgery, but the injury did occur.

 

[superman21]

I used to have the same problem with the Patulla tendons. I noticed that leg press and hack squat was causing the inflammation. I switched to all free weight exercises and the pain eventually went away. When you are performing an exercise that is on a track you tend to push harder and don't have to worry about stabilization, thus causing strain on the tendons. Try staying away from machines and see if that makes a difference. Hope this helps bro.

 

[G.I.Bro]

First I apologize if this is the wrong spot, second I've searched and cannot find a definite answer

A couple months back I started going heavy on Leg press, wearing knee sleeves, and still staying over 10reps. One day after leaving the gym my knees had a pain right below my knee cap going down stairs.

Since then they intermittently, but frequently hurt. Driving ends up making my right knee kill after a while just below my knee cap from having it bent for a while. If I start with leg press or leg extension I can't handle it cuz it hurts too much. But starting with Squats is ok.

I've been foam rolling the crap out of my legs . Quads Hams Glutes hips and calfs and it does help some but doesn't eliminate it.

Daily I take 6g fish oil, 4g vit c, 6,000iu vit d. Also avoid dairy, gluten, and other inflammatory foods. Yet the problem is still there. Once my knees are really warmed up, they don't hurt. Like I can do Squats, and move on to extensions and they're pretty much fine.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.



One last bit, 2012 I dislocated my right knee. No tears no surgery, but the injury did occur.

I have the exact same thing resulting from heavy legs. Basically anytime I drive long distances now, I have knee pain in that right knee. It goes away once I can walk it off or stretch out.

Never any accute injury or event that triggered this. Never any specific time where I noted hurting it during squats or presses. It just slowly snuck up on me but it's just as you describe yours. It's mild pain and I've just ignored it.

I think the above advice is solid. You just need to give their tendon and joint a break. Mine didn't start until I was doing heaving presses on a plane in conjunction with standard squats. You may try regular squats the while because you simply can't put the same stress on the joint and tendon, imo.

 

[Evom1]

Alright guys thank you. Maybe I'll switch up my quad training to strictly squat variations for a few weeks and see if that reduces the pain. Very relieved to hear I'm not the only one with this problem.

 

[ECB]

You likely have some patellar tendinitis going on.

What aggravates pattellar issues tends to be forward knee travel. I would wager when you use the hack squat, leg press etc, your feet are too low on the foot plate, or the foot plate positioning locks you into a shitty movement pattern, causing the knee to come over the toes.

Leg extensions by default put a ton of sheering force across the knee in general, so I would avoid those, for the time being.

Next time you go in, try and move your feet up a bit on the leg press and see how that feels. Make sure your feet are in front of your knees at all times, if they aren't go up higher.

If you are going to leg press or hack squat. Also try and turn your toes out slightly and try and open up the hips especially as you approach the bottom, so it keeps the knees tracking correctly.

How wide do you place your feet on the leg press is another question, and needs to be examined. Too close, and it becomes hard to open the hips, and it puts undue stress on the patella.

If you can start correcting the issues, it should subside without really having to eliminate leg press all together. And on the bright side it means you are squatting with good movement(or not going deep enough ), as this would really get flared up on squats if you weren't.

HTH.
ECB-

 

[addams29]

well, if you describe the pain to be centralized "below" the kneecap, thats not the patellar tendon. The patellar tendon is right above the kneecap, and its what attatches your lower quad muscle to the kneecap. Improper form, heavy weight it sounds like. Same thing happened to me, saw a sports doc, went to physical therapy, 2hrs/day...3X/week...pain in my ass. Then i found out about BPC 157, and i learned that if properly diagnosed by a competent sports doc, you are able to train through the injury. I did, however i stayed away from squats for a while. I did heavy leg presses to failure, heavy leg extension to failure, got back the little bit of muscle i lost, and maintained it. Trick is the BPC 157 CAN BE injected directly into that particular tendon you injured. You might want to study an anatomy chart thoroughly before you attempt this, or ask the sports doc to do it for you? Also what helped me tremendously is i soaked in a hot tub with 2 1/2 cups Epsom salt for weeks on end, it gets toxins out of the body and you need clean blood circulating into that particular area to get the good nutrients it needs to regenerate. I also lived on MSM, and KEY KEY is to keep that area compressed when you are on your feet or at the gym. This makes a world of difference. Then when you train legs, tons of warm ups, DO NOT go as heavy as you did before, and also put knee wraps over your knees on outside when going heavier. My pain was bad, the ace bandage knee wrap under, and during training legs the knee wrap over the pants made all the difference. BPC is truly the shit! Hope this helps...

 

[addams29]

Depending on the specificity of your injury, i did find out with my "strained" Patellar tendon i am able, almost supposed to train through it. Not good to sit around. But your doc will not tell you this because he can give a shit about you, its all about financial liability in case you got injured, legally you would be able to sue him based on the advice he gave you. Pretty sad....thats when my doc tells me NOT to do something...i pretty much do the opposite.

 

[jayl19]

I tore my patella tendon squating and it took 2 years before I could train legs properly, I kept trying to train them and going to heavy too soon and it would flare up, just be smart,

iv been training legs every week now for 5 months, I'll do 6-8 very light sets on leg extension to warm up first, I always wear knee straps now too and wen I squat an leg press I'll start very light and keep building up till I fail on about 10 reps then if I need to I'll bring weight back down and do a few more, if knee starts hurts then Ill stop an try anther exersise or try pointing feet in a slightly different way, only twice have I aborted workout but it's got to be done if your sore, also ice and ibprofen post work helps with the swelling if you have any

 

[GymDudeVA]

First I apologize if this is the wrong spot, second I've searched and cannot find a definite answer

A couple months back I started going heavy on Leg press, wearing knee sleeves, and still staying over 10reps. One day after leaving the gym my knees had a pain right below my knee cap going down stairs.

Since then they intermittently, but frequently hurt. Driving ends up making my right knee kill after a while just below my knee cap from having it bent for a while. If I start with leg press or leg extension I can't handle it cuz it hurts too much. But starting with Squats is ok.

Sounds like chondromalacia (I used to have it). (The pain wile walking downstairs is a big clue).

Instead of regular sleeves, wear a patella strap (even when not in gym). They are found in most sporting goods stores. They keep pressure on the tendon and keep the kneecap tracking correctly. They look like this:

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/McDavid-Jumpers-Knee-Strap/dp/B000LHAY6C"]Amazon.com: McDavid 414 Jumpers Knee Strap: Sports & Outdoors@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/416VArK6B3L.@@AMEPARAM@@416VArK6B3L[/ame]

 

[addams29]

I hear ya Jay, a tear is actually worse than a bad sprain...which was my case. I can see how that would put you out of leg training for so long. Fucks up your symmetry. Have you tried or researched BPC-157? check out some studies on it on Pubmed. Stuff is so amazing it actually was able to re-attatch torn achilles tendons back to the bone. This is unheard of. Be careful, this kind of injury you had is no joke, and when u think you are 100%, you might do a heavy leg workout and re-injure that area...that would be catastrophic. My humble opinion, read some threads here, user results, read some studies, and more importantly proper administration is key, and invest the little bit of cash on BPC 157. you wont regret it. I KEEP 2 bottles in my fridge at all times..

 

[jayl19]

I hear ya Jay, a tear is actually worse than a bad sprain...which was my case. I can see how that would put you out of leg training for so long. Fucks up your symmetry. Have you tried or researched BPC-157? check out some studies on it on Pubmed. Stuff is so amazing it actually was able to re-attatch torn achilles tendons back to the bone. This is unheard of. Be careful, this kind of injury you had is no joke, and when u think you are 100%, you might do a heavy leg workout and re-injure that area...that would be catastrophic. My humble opinion, read some threads here, user results, read some studies, and more importantly proper administration is key, and invest the little bit of cash on BPC 157. you wont regret it. I KEEP 2 bottles in my fridge at all times..

Cheers mate

I'll have to have a good read up on it when I get a few hours spare

Yeah messed up my symmety, my sore leg is thinner then my other leg so with out realising it am pushing with my good leg

My MRI scan shows a scar, if I had the money then maybe surgey would be the way forward but that would probly put me out another year

 

[brutus69]

i get it bad above the kneecaps, to the point that every time i stand up, it feels like a knife in my knees.
i decided to quit heavy leg presses and extensions when i got sick of not being able to hike downhill without pain. fuck it.
so i quit doing heavy legs. i do 200 pound leg presses for 100 reps every week for the last 6 or 7 weeks. thats it. and my legs grew 3/4 inch.
no pain, i can run, run downhill, life is better now.
that fun time for an hour in the guy wasnt worth the rest of the week hobbling in pain.

 

[addams29]

Jay please be careful about surgery. Its not like i hate docs or think they are out to get us, HOWEVER surgery is where a major part of their income comes from.I would go to a few sports docs and get 3 opinions, try and find one that doesnt solely rely on surgery, they are quick to suggest that. One little mistake on their part, and ur fitness goals are over. My particular sports doc used to train college level athletes, and even advertises that 90% of sports injuries DO NOT need surgery. He does things like platelet rich plasma injections, and many other things i forgot. Surgery should b ur 100% last hope. From the research i read, and testimonials from honest bros on like 3 other forums, i believe the BPC157 should be all you need. Now u need to get a muscular anatomy chart showing tendons and ligaments, identify your specific injury, and really study how to inject the BPC into that area. By the way, so far there are no known side effects. Cheers my man..

 

[Zomb131]

well, if you describe the pain to be centralized "below" the kneecap, thats not the patellar tendon. The patellar tendon is right above the kneecap, and its what attatches your lower quad muscle to the kneecap.

SMH, You seriously need to brush up on your anatomy. The patellar tendon (technically a ligament) IS below the "knee cap" (knee cap, usually referring to the patella bone). It attaches to the tibial tuberosity. When a doc does a DTR of the patella, why do they hit the hammer below the knee? The area you described is the quadriceps femoral tendon.

What is a "lower quad muscle?"

 

[addams29]

Thanks for the post Zomb, when i had that particular injury, my sports doc specifically referred me to an anatomy chart that showed all the muscles and tendons. He had one in particular that showed the patellar ligament that i strained, where it was located, and what muscle it was connected to. My specific injury was caused simply, yet painfully by doing heavy squats and my toes were pointed straight instead of slightly out. That did it. Ok with that said and going back to my sports doc, the patellar ligament connects your leg muscle just above the kneecap(is that better description for you?) To the particular tendon i injured, and was shown it was ultimately connected to the kneecap. I know of no patellar tendon connected below the kneecap according to the detailed muscle/tendon chart i saw of the knee area. What anatomy chart are YOU looking at? Im not a doc nor do i claim to know details about anatomy, but i contributed to this specific post because i had a personal experience in this area. I swear some dudes just lurk around waiting to jump on someone for anything. Go hit a heavy bag or sumthin my dude...

 

[tay]

How are you feeling now? What dose of BPC have you done stem cells or PRP?

Thanks for the post Zomb, when i had that particular injury, my sports doc specifically referred me to an anatomy chart that showed all the muscles and tendons. He had one in particular that showed the patellar ligament that i strained, where it was located, and what muscle it was connected to. My specific injury was caused simply, yet painfully by doing heavy squats and my toes were pointed straight instead of slightly out. That did it. Ok with that said and going back to my sports doc, the patellar ligament connects your leg muscle just above the kneecap(is that better description for you?) To the particular tendon i injured, and was shown it was ultimately connected to the kneecap. I know of no patellar tendon connected below the kneecap according to the detailed muscle/tendon chart i saw of the knee area. What anatomy chart are YOU looking at? Im not a doc nor do i claim to know details about anatomy, but i contributed to this specific post because i had a personal experience in this area. I swear some dudes just lurk around waiting to jump on someone for anything. Go hit a heavy bag or sumthin my dude...

 

[addams29]

Evom and Zomb please DISREGARD the entire post i made just above. It is entirely wrong. Zomb as i dug out my documents and anatomy charts of the knee area from that day, i saw i confused tendon and ligament, and Zomb you were actually right.It was late at night when i posted and i was exhausted, and going off of memory, usually this is not my style not to bring accurate facts to the table from sources....which on the most part are impeccable by my standards. With all due respect, i have a few detailed anatomy charts specifically of the knee area and quad muscles. Zomb i simply said "lower quad muscle", because since none of us have PHD's in sports medicine/treatment that i know of, i was simply speaking in Laymen's terms just making a generalization of this area. Very simply speaking it is a lower, NOT UPPER quad muscle, but if you want to be specific, as i look at my paperwork,i for some reason was looking at it backwards, and from bad memory.Yes in fact the Patellar ligament IS in fact below the kneecap, but don't ask me what that connects to as i have no knowledge in that particular area, i was dealing with my specific injury. My apologies for any confusion, but im here now to clear that up. my particular injury was the tendon of the quadriceps femoris muscle, which connects to, as my sports doc showed me on the chart, to the LOWER quadriceps femoris muscle..as was my case. So i was correct in referring to it as a "lower quad muscle", please refer to an accurate anatomy chart...with all due respect. I was simply trying to contribute and help the guy out, but if you prefer anatomically coherent terms when referring to very specific areas, there you have it. Im looking at several detailed charts that were provided to me from my particular sports medicine doctor. Zomb thanks for your service to our beloved country....

 

[addams29]

Tay please oficially disregard my post you highlighted as well, it was premature and inaccurate....please note my current correction. Mistakes are made sometimes,....