Lats..Help,tips or tricks on bringing them up.

[rAJJIN]

Im curious what you guys are doing or have done to bring up the Lats?

I can pull Like a Mutha On Rows,Deads etc.. But the Lat machines or pulling straight down are my weakness.
Maybe Im trying to go to heavy? should I lighten the load and try for more sets,reps? What about Chins? are they a must? Maybe start on the sissy
machine or in the Garage at home? Any ideas or suggestions you guys have that maybe helped you?

I read before that DC would strap himself to the Rack and just hang there for as long as possable..Maybe I will give that a shot.

 

[flexmaster]

i have done lat pulldowns maybe 5 times in my life...and my lats are probably my best bodypart. i have always gone super heavy on deads, which really made the high lats explode. but for lat thickness and the lower portion i love bent over db rows. everyone i train to do it my way tells me they can finaly feel their LATS working. here is how i do them...
get into normal bent over db rows position on a flat bench, depending on your size i would go somewhere between 40-60lbs, somewhere aroun 15 reps to start...error on the conservative side(weight wise) because we are trying to use the lats to grow and if you cannot feel them working because you are using too much weight it's over. i keep my back at about a 40-45*angle. now anytime i do back stuff i view my hands as hooks, gripping the bar with my thumb next to my index finger. now, dont let your elbow flare out, keep it right next to your body, and pull the db to just above your hip bone. too many guys pull it up high like to thier arm pit, that works upper back rather than lats. when you get the db to your hip, try and pull your elbow behind your back. it might only go 2-3'' behind you but trust me, try it. also, get a full stretch at the bottom. dont go too fast either, control the weight. also, stretch between sets by grabbing onto a vertical bar, about hip height and relaxing that entire side of your body except for your fingers. again, your hand should be in a hook shape with index finger next to your thumb. hold the stretch for 30-45 sec each side. seriousy, try this and you will feel your lats exploding the next day. here's a pic of my lats/back for proof...19 to 21y/o in this pic.

 

[nandro]

use a seated cable row. lean forward towards the pulley until your chest nearly touches your legs. stay in that postion and pull. don't extend at hips. keep your head down.

 

[rAJJIN]

FlexMaster...
I greatly appreciate you taking the time to write that up!
I think thats been a lot of the problem is Just trying to Move the heavy weight and not concentrating enough on the 'feel' of it. Yes the upper Part is pretty good but the lower sucks... I deffinatley pull it heavy 120+ and to the armpit area... Ill try and Lower the weight..increase reps and pull it lower toward the hip area as you explained.

Nandro... Thanks Buddy
Im going to try them out as well..On lower pully I find myself leaning back..bent knees and Just pulling with all Ive got. Ill try and concentrate
On the way you desrcibe also and keeping the tension on the Lats.
Much appreciated both of you!!

 

[flexmaster]

FlexMaster...
I greatly appreciate you taking the time to write that up!
I think thats been a lot of the problem is Just trying to Move the heavy weight and not concentrating enough on the 'feel' of it. Yes the upper Part is pretty good but the lower sucks... I deffinatley pull it heavy 120+ and to the armpit area... Ill try and Lower the weight..increase reps and pull it lower toward the hip area as you explained.

Nandro... Thanks Buddy
Im going to try them out as well..On lower pully I find myself leaning back..bent knees and Just pulling with all Ive got. Ill try and concentrate
On the way you desrcibe also and keeping the tension on the Lats.
Much appreciated both of you!!

go for the feel in the muscle until you get the form down, then gradually move the weight up. whenever i am starting a new exercise i always do it in the 12-15 rep range the first few times, sometimes even higher like 30, just so i know exactly where i am working. get that mind muscle connection and then once you have the form down blow that shit up. seriously, i promise this will feel great in your lats, i have shown probably 4 to 6 guys this and all of them were amazed because they finally could isolate thier lats. try it and you will thank me i promise.

 

[Big A]

Put your arms in front of your body, with the elbows locked in your sides, and the arms bent at 90'.
Keep your fists touching each other.
Now with your elbows firmly locked into your sides, move your fists as far away from each other as possible. Do you feel it in your back muscles how they contract?
That is exactly what you have to feel when you work back. Every exercise, every rep, you have to feel that contraction and hold it for 1 second. Do them this way and you will get back in no time.
And I like stretching the scapulas as much as possible.

 

[LEX]

I used to start every back workout with 50 pull ups, ussually 3 sets but that seemed to do my sweep alot of good, even working up to do sets of as low as 8 with weight. I don't think that pull downs do half as much as a pull up, maybe try the for a while.

 

[Big A]

I used to start every back workout with 50 pull ups, ussually 3 sets but that seemed to do my sweep alot of good, even working up to do sets of as low as 8 with weight. I don't think that pull downs do half as much as a pull up, maybe try the for a while.

Man, I remember the days when I used to be able to do that. Now I have trouble getting 6 good ones out

 

[Crowler]

I used to start every back workout with 50 pull ups, ussually 3 sets but that seemed to do my sweep alot of good, even working up to do sets of as low as 8 with weight. I don't think that pull downs do half as much as a pull up, maybe try the for a while.

OMG 50 pulls ups I am jealous. How much do you weigh?


CROWLER

 

[LEX]

I would do 50 reps but in 3 sets, first set 20-25 then 15 and 15. at one point before I tore some shit where lats tie into tris, I could do 8 pullups with a 150 db on me. my BW varys 280-265 ish

 

[rAJJIN]

OMG 50 pulls ups I am jealous. How much do you weigh?


CROWLER

ahh Lex is just a little fella
Close to 300Lb!

BigA, it took me minute But I know exactly what your saying
Sounds Like Ive just been at a bit to heavy and 'loose' with my form.
Im deffinatley taking notes And I greatly appreciate everyones help.

Lats I know you read this!!!
They dont call you Lats for no reason hahaha

 

[rAJJIN]

I would do 50 reps but in 3 sets, first set 20-25 then 15 and 15. at one point before I tore some shit where lats tie into tris, I could do 8 pullups with a 150 db on me. my BW varys 280-265 ish

And Ive seen guys do crazy stuff like this so I know its possable...
Only its just not possable for me. Im about afraid and 1/2 embarassed
to try..after 2-3 with no weight I Start to Get the Dog shakes, lol

I think Ill get a chin bar for the House and Maybe a cheat stool or something to get me started. Hopefully with time and some effort Ill work my way up
to pulling my own fatass for some sets Its deffibatley a weak point for me
and again Thanks for the tips.

 

[LEX]

try some pull ups bro! once you get a major pump on them lats then you can sit down at the pull down with a little less weight and really "feel" um

 

[gooey]

ive tried this...

ive done a lot of underhand pull downs leaning back farther then I would if I were doing a normal lat pulldown. Ive also tried doing partial chins, not going all the way up but not coming all the way down. Keeping that tension in the latissimus dorsi and less in the biceps. But I guess I would ask r u looking for lat thickness or lat width? That determines what exercise I would do.
goo

 

[rAJJIN]

Gooey

Deffinatley the width..side to side and the lower Part seem to be My weak area.

I tried stretching last night hahaha
thats something Ive gotta work on also..it was pittiful

 

[Massive G]

Reduce bicep work and use reverse grip chins and pulldowns and bb rows.

Seriously I had wings before I ever picked up a weight and my back always grew no matter what, but my biceps could be stubborn once I got them large after years of training.....when they were stubborn I cut out direct work and only did them 1-2 times a month.

I know this back and stuff but as mentioned above tighter contraction, reduce the tempo and weight a bit, squeeze and pull.

You could also try pre-exhausting lats, pullovers and then immediately chin.

Rack Chins like DC'ers do form and function are important and you need to pull very high chest to the bar or above strict smooth controlled then rest pause.

One of my advanced techniques I love to do (more so for thickness) but don't recommend to anyone unless they are advanced that is-as there is risk to injury if you don't get your form right.

To BB row to failure overhand grip...then on the last rep on the floor set you position and immediately deadlift that weight to failure 5-8 reps..then immediately shrug it for 5-6 reps all same weight without setting it down or resting hold it and drop it.

Sometimes I would have 2 partners slide on an extra 50-100 lbs quickly on the bar for deads and more for shrugs.

This will smoke your back thickness like no other...

Also in my early days training 3 on one off I had a thickness day, and a width day..meaning I'd do primarily 2-3 thickness movements and one width one day, the next work out I'd hit 2-3 width movements and 1 thickness movement to compensate.

 

[vanilla gorilla]

Rajjin,

Hey bro, what are you doing?

When doing pulldowns to the front with the lat bar, grip the bar, but instead of using a monkey grip (thumbs over curve on bar) put the thumbs under the bar and press into the curve upside down. Dexter does this in his dvd. It helped me a lot. Just pull until it comes down to chin level. Try a heavy weight for a couple of weeks until you get 10 reps. Just stop at 10. Don't try to work till failure. Trust me. Get the hang first.

Massive G..uh...G...uh..G..UNIT.... is right. (sorry, trying to copy fitty cent) Try the Dogg Chin. I did these and couldn't wipe my ass for 3 days. No pun intended, but no shit. Seriously.

 

[MikeS]

Back is my best and strongest bodypart. I never do high reps, which I do for all other body parts (after I go heavy/basic).
I always start with PULLDOWNS. Not Chins, but I think this is personal preference. I can get in my own angle and groove with the cable and not on the chins. Although I used to do chins always, years back w/100lbs extra.
I must say that worked too. Im 46YO 5'6" 200lbs. I can pulldown with a partner steadying (not pulling) the bar w/350lb+. I can seated row 350+ no spot. I did rack deadlifts with 7plates (single) and 6plates x 6. So, you know how a 20YO kid puts all that energy and determination into getting a big bench press? You need to incorporate that mentality into you back training. Try to move impossible weights. Train with someone with a sickly strong back. I do lean back on the heavy sets of pulldowns and that doesnt cheat me as the extra pull back and arch in the spine is essential to back contraction. If you arent already, you MUST move the stack on your pulldowns for low reps at least. If the stack is only 250 add weight. Our seated row/pulldown machines at Ballys are 300, that why I dont do back at golds where they are only 200-250.
Somewhat like BigA said-practice flairing/posing your lats. It really teaches that mind/muscle link on how to pop and contract the muscle out.
Pull like hell, bro!!!

 

[rAJJIN]

Reduce bicep work and use reverse grip chins and pulldowns and bb rows.

Seriously I had wings before I ever picked up a weight and my back always grew no matter what, but my biceps could be stubborn once I got them large after years of training.....when they were stubborn I cut out direct work and only did them 1-2 times a month.

I know this back and stuff but as mentioned above tighter contraction, reduce the tempo and weight a bit, squeeze and pull.

You could also try pre-exhausting lats, pullovers and then immediately chin.

Rack Chins like DC'ers do form and function are important and you need to pull very high chest to the bar or above strict smooth controlled then rest pause.

One of my advanced techniques I love to do (more so for thickness) but don't recommend to anyone unless they are advanced that is-as there is risk to injury if you don't get your form right.

To BB row to failure overhand grip...then on the last rep on the floor set you position and immediately deadlift that weight to failure 5-8 reps..then immediately shrug it for 5-6 reps all same weight without setting it down or resting hold it and drop it.

Sometimes I would have 2 partners slide on an extra 50-100 lbs quickly on the bar for deads and more for shrugs.

This will smoke your back thickness like no other...

Also in my early days training 3 on one off I had a thickness day, and a width day..meaning I'd do primarily 2-3 thickness movements and one width one day, the next work out I'd hit 2-3 width movements and 1 thickness movement to compensate.

Thats what Im doing now..2-3 days on 1 day off.
Reverse Grip it is... Ill try it just as youve explained.

Your a GoodMan MassiveG!! Youve been a big help to me latley
and Its Greatly appreciated. Cant say enough about ya...Im greatfull
for all your time and help/

 

[rAJJIN]

Back is my best and strongest bodypart. I never do high reps, which I do for all other body parts (after I go heavy/basic).
I always start with PULLDOWNS. Not Chins, but I think this is personal preference. I can get in my own angle and groove with the cable and not on the chins. Although I used to do chins always, years back w/100lbs extra.
I must say that worked too. Im 46YO 5'6" 200lbs. I can pulldown with a partner steadying (not pulling) the bar w/350lb+. I can seated row 350+ no spot. I did rack deadlifts with 7plates (single) and 6plates x 6. So, you know how a 20YO kid puts all that energy and determination into getting a big bench press? You need to incorporate that mentality into you back training. Try to move impossible weights. Train with someone with a sickly strong back. I do lean back on the heavy sets of pulldowns and that doesnt cheat me as the extra pull back and arch in the spine is essential to back contraction. If you arent already, you MUST move the stack on your pulldowns for low reps at least. If the stack is only 250 add weight. Our seated row/pulldown machines at Ballys are 300, that why I dont do back at golds where they are only 200-250.
Somewhat like BigA said-practice flairing/posing your lats. It really teaches that mind/muscle link on how to pop and contract the muscle out.
Pull like hell, bro!!!

I know what your saying MikeS and Im probably guilty of not giving the Lat pulls as much effort as I put into the bench press (mentally) if Im being honest with myself. Ive been doing the lat pulls for a Long time now and They just dont seem to be improving. Maybe after a few weeks Of Chins Ill be Happy to switch back over to the pulldowns and hit them with more concentration and effort. Thanks.. I appreciate everyones time and help!