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Lumbar Fusion: Any Peptides Help After Surgery?

Here is the MRI report. Also she drained 2cc this time and poked holes in the capsule so that anything left would drain. She said that the first time there was a lot more drainage and the 2nd time there was about the same as today.View attachment 122864
Man, on paper yours is way worse that mine. I have pretty serious s- shaped thoracilumbar scoliosis to up the ante though. I’ve had two epidurals in l4-l5 and l5-s1 and they didn’t do anything. I’ve never met anyone who they did help. Into the facet joints is different though. Is your pain mainly in your back, or do you have a bunch of radiating pain in your legs? I would imagine you would have to.
 
Michael Chang eh? If he cancels surgery and just tells you to rub tiger balm on it, there’s a problem.
 
Man, on paper yours is way worse that mine. I have pretty serious s- shaped thoracilumbar scoliosis to up the ante though. I’ve had two epidurals in l4-l5 and l5-s1 and they didn’t do anything. I’ve never met anyone who they did help. Into the facet joints is different though. Is your pain mainly in your back, or do you have a bunch of radiating pain in your legs? I would imagine you would have to.

I have had low back pain for years but I have a very high pain tolerance and always swore I would never get surgery. But the pain that I have had the past 1.5 years, started when I began to do high intensity walking on the treadmill. The faster I would walk, the worse it would be the next day. It has progressed horribly since then and just became excruciating until one day I was in too much pain to even get out of bed. We were treating it as a hip/SI injury for the first year or so because the pain was in multiple spots from the greater trochanter through the SI and basically followed the superior border of the glute; all on the R side only. I was fine laying down and sitting, but standing was intolerable and walking was bad too. I have using a chair in the kitchen to cook and a shower bench to shower and do stuff at the sink. Usually it is completely intolerable for the first 3 hours of the morning but then loosens up to tolerable when I get in the gym and then goes back to intolerable in the early evening. No numbness or tingling. I am not sure about weakness as my quads have felt weak for a number of years and since earlier this year I am not getting much of a pump in either quad; they just feel tired.
 
I have had low back pain for years but I have a very high pain tolerance and always swore I would never get surgery. But the pain that I have had the past 1.5 years, started when I began to do high intensity walking on the treadmill. The faster I would walk, the worse it would be the next day. It has progressed horribly since then and just became excruciating until one day I was in too much pain to even get out of bed. We were treating it as a hip/SI injury for the first year or so because the pain was in multiple spots from the greater trochanter through the SI and basically followed the superior border of the glute; all on the R side only. I was fine laying down and sitting, but standing was intolerable and walking was bad too. I have using a chair in the kitchen to cook and a shower bench to shower and do stuff at the sink. Usually it is completely intolerable for the first 3 hours of the morning but then loosens up to tolerable when I get in the gym and then goes back to intolerable in the early evening. No numbness or tingling. I am not sure about weakness as my quads have felt weak for a number of years and since earlier this year I am not getting much of a pump in either quad; they just feel tired.
That’s interesting that you don’t have worse leg pain. It seems like there should be plenty of nerve root impingement. Is that what they think is causing the hip pain? I guess it doesn’t totally matter. They try to do the best surgery that they think will help your pain, and that’s really the gauge of how bad things are, and if surgery is successful.

Mine started out as lower leg pain only. I had never had back pain and had no idea what was wrong with my leg. Now it’s progressed to sharp pain in both legs, and mixed types of pain in my lower back. I never knew I had scoliosis either, which makes me wonder if it developed over time, as an adult. The doctors I’ve talked to don’t seem to know if it has been there since childhood, or developed along with the rest of the degeneration. My neurosurgeon said it’s focused, or whatever it’s called, at l4-l5, which seems suspicious since that’s where all the action is.
 
Yeah, he said 3-4 wasn't necessary at this point and he was concerned with fusing more than 2 levels resulting in too much stress on the other lumbar levels.

That's crazy you know those guys. You don't happen to know Michael Chang, MD in Tempe/Scottsdale AZ. He is the one doing the surgery? Supposed to be one of the best out here.

I feel great since yesterdays injections. I only have 4 weeks from today until surgery; so praying they last and that covid doesn't interfere with the scheduling. It is being performed at Oasis, which is a orthopedic and spine surgery hospital; so they shouldn't be effected by covid patients.

I mostly only know orthopods and neuro spine guys in nyc, sf and socal. I know radiologists all over though.

Best of luck with the surgery. Some people are on the fence about surgery at times about whether or not they need it...you need it and its pretty straight forward.
 
Yeah, he said 3-4 wasn't necessary at this point and he was concerned with fusing more than 2 levels resulting in too much stress on the other lumbar levels.

That's crazy you know those guys. You don't happen to know Michael Chang, MD in Tempe/Scottsdale AZ. He is the one doing the surgery? Supposed to be one of the best out here.

I feel great since yesterdays injections. I only have 4 weeks from today until surgery; so praying they last and that covid doesn't interfere with the scheduling. It is being performed at Oasis, which is a orthopedic and spine surgery hospital; so they shouldn't be effected by covid patients.

Sounds exactly like what I went through. My surgeon was on the fence about fusing L3-4. He eventually decided not to for the exact same reason your surgeon stated. Going from 2 to 3 levels is a lot. He just let me know that those levels might need to be fused sooner rather than later. For me, so far so good but in 2018 I did have a microdiscectomy/laminectomy on L2-3. That wasn't a bad surgery.

I don't know what you've been told in regards to the fusion surgery but once you begin this process, statistically you'll need the next level or two, above or below, fused in roughly 10 to 12 years depending on the current health of those levels and lifestyle. Not great news but living in agonizing pain isn't acceptable.
 
Sounds exactly like what I went through. My surgeon was on the fence about fusing L3-4. He eventually decided not to for the exact same reason your surgeon stated. Going from 2 to 3 levels is a lot. He just let me know that those levels might need to fused sooner rather than later. For me, so far so good but in 2018 I did have a microdiscectomy/laminectomy on L2-3. That wasn't a bad surgery.

I don't know what you've been told in regards to the fusion surgery but once you begin this process, statistically you'll need the next level or two, above or below, fused in roughly 10 to 12 years depending on the current health of those levels and lifestyle. Not great news but living in agonizing pain isn't acceptable.

Yep, when we discussed the surgery he went through all those statistics on what to expect. He was totally open and honest and just straight forward on what to realistically expect after surgery and in the future. He is one of those rare docs that actually has a good bedside manner and communicates with the patient.
 
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That’s interesting that you don’t have worse leg pain. It seems like there should be plenty of nerve root impingement. Is that what they think is causing the hip pain? I guess it doesn’t totally matter. They try to do the best surgery that they think will help your pain, and that’s really the gauge of how bad things are, and if surgery is successful.

Mine started out as lower leg pain only. I had never had back pain and had no idea what was wrong with my leg. Now it’s progressed to sharp pain in both legs, and mixed types of pain in my lower back. I never knew I had scoliosis either, which makes me wonder if it developed over time, as an adult. The doctors I’ve talked to don’t seem to know if it has been there since childhood, or developed along with the rest of the degeneration. My neurosurgeon said it’s focused, or whatever it’s called, at l4-l5, which seems suspicious since that’s where all the action is.

Yes, we never got any results treating the hip and x-ray, MRI, etc... were all clean with no signs of anything causing the pain. The only thing keeping us focused on the hip was there were trigger points that when pressed were extremely painful in the hip and when you held pressure on them the pain would go away. I could actually stand longer with less pain when holding pressure on certain areas in the hip. The day we did the first epidural on the back, the hip pain was gone. So it was obvious that it was all referred from the back.

You may want to get a 2nd opinion on yours from another neurosurgeon. The bottom line is that if you can't see yourself living with the pain for the rest of your life and you can't find any treatment options that work for you; then you don't really have any other options than surgery. But I would exhaust all non-surgical options first.
 
Yes, we never got any results treating the hip and x-ray, MRI, etc... were all clean with no signs of anything causing the pain. The only thing keeping us focused on the hip was there were trigger points that when pressed were extremely painful in the hip and when you held pressure on them the pain would go away. I could actually stand longer with less pain when holding pressure on certain areas in the hip. The day we did the first epidural on the back, the hip pain was gone. So it was obvious that it was all referred from the back.

You may want to get a 2nd opinion on yours from another neurosurgeon. The bottom line is that if you can't see yourself living with the pain for the rest of your life and you can't find any treatment options that work for you; then you don't really have any other options than surgery. But I would exhaust all non-surgical options first.
Thanks for the advice. I’ve been working with the second surgeon now. I was referred by the first one to get another opinion, and because he has more knowledge/experience with scoliosis. Neither one has pushed, or really wanted to do surgery, which I appreciate, because I’m “still young” and there has still been room to live with it. The pain has gotten a lot worse over the last six months though, and it’s hard to just live life. Sometimes it’s not even the pain as much as the twisted, stooped way I hold my body if I’m not conscious of it, the weakness and fatigue, the fact that I can’t walk right most of the time, etc. I think my body trying to hold up a spine that’s unstable and compromised from all directions has started to put too much strain on my core and my body as a whole. It just seems like it’s all coming together in a way that’s not sustainable.
 

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