my blood work after a decade of anabolics

[rAJJIN]

Great post and thanks for sharing.
I'm no expert (actually have no clue! lol) when it comes to reading the results.
From your post though and the replys from the guys that do......
Not to bad of results for a guy thats 39 an used moderate-heavy more on then off for 12 years?? Biggest concern rite now is the Liver testing?

Did you tell your Dr that you have used anabolics,hgh etc?
Just curious how he replied to that. Would something like that go on your permanent health records?

 

[nspaletta]

Thanks for sharing bro and keep us updated if you can. This can become a very informative thread for others to look back on

 

[AnabolicHealthStore]

Great post dude. Just a word here. I also had issues once some years back before AAS use in fact. And I think most bodybuilders might experience the same symptoms with high creatine and protein levels. My doc ran a blood test and found my creatine level far above normal and wanted me to see a specialist. They ran ultra sounds and did a prostate check. All looked normal. After a short discussion about my diet and workout I was asked to cut back on the protein and creatine intake. He informed me that the excessive creatine and protein intake could affect the creatine reading. I reduced my protein and creatine intake amount for 6 weeks and repeated the blood test. All came back to norm. Sometimes the mass amount or extended amount of simple supplements can affect your blood test readings as well.

 

[ridge11]

damn bro, im glad you said this, I was just going to keep quiet as people think im mr. anti-steroid or something??? but that is not HRT dose, but i see a lot of people thinking it is. hell some people think 500mgs is HRT dose my doc told me the same thing as what you posted, that if she ever would put me on HRT therapy that it would be probably anywhere between 100-150mg/wk. and that should put me in the "normal" range.

120mg/wk puts me in the high end of "normal" physiological levels.

 

[doitright]

Great post and thanks for sharing.
I'm no expert (actually have no clue! lol) when it comes to reading the results.
From your post though and the replys from the guys that do......
Not to bad of results for a guy thats 39 an used moderate-heavy more on then off for 12 years?? Biggest concern rite now is the Liver testing?

Did you tell your Dr that you have used anabolics,hgh etc?
Just curious how he replied to that. Would something like that go on your permanent health records?

Lets say you tell your doc and he puts in your records that you are an AAS user. Then sometime down the road you need to apply for new health insurance whether it be due to job change etc. The new insurance provider will request your medical records from your doctors. The way I see it, the new insurance company now knows what you did not want them to know and can do what they feel is best for them at that point. The same goes for life insurance which is even harder to obtain.

I have not experienced this but maybe someone else has and can give some insight.

 

[morepain]

Great post dude. Just a word here. I also had issues once some years back before AAS use in fact. And I think most bodybuilders might experience the same symptoms with high creatine and protein levels. My doc ran a blood test and found my creatine level far above normal and wanted me to see a specialist. They ran ultra sounds and did a prostate check. All looked normal. After a short discussion about my diet and workout I was asked to cut back on the protein and creatine intake. He informed me that the excessive creatine and protein intake could affect the creatine reading. I reduced my protein and creatine intake amount for 6 weeks and repeated the blood test. All came back to norm. Sometimes the mass amount or extended amount of simple supplements can affect your blood test readings as well.

Actually thats your CREATININE level not creatine...it measures among other things msucle cell damage and ANYONE that is in bodybuilding or powerlifting will generally appear at least slightly elevated because of the constant damage and turnover of the muscle cells. Cutting back on creatine intake is not goign to do anything at all...i would suggest a new doctor.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

200mg cyp a week put me at 1500 test level.......

See in my mind....I dont understand why anyone is giving BFU any guff about what he wants to do for a low testosterone weekly dosage.

There has been some literature that leaned towards the higher end (and maybe even slightly over the higher end) of the normal range is where the healthiest human range of testosterone is.

Im not so sure someone couldnt do 300mg a week of testosterone the rest of their life and live longer and healthier than if they did 100mg a week the rest of their life. I really dont know to be honest with you...its not like 300mg is absolutely abusive compared to these guys doing 2000mg a week.

If all bloodwork is fine and their hematocrit and hemaglobin doesnt creep up....more power to a guy if he wants to do 300mg a week of testosterone for the rest of his life....he shouldnt have to live by someone elses rules if his own bloodwork proves out to be fine.

If someone uses 100mg of testosterone a week and it send their hematocrit soaring...well it sucks yes...but thats you that it sucks for. If BFU does 300mg a week and his hematocrit checks out...and all other bloodwork looks fine (PSA etc)...good for him.

IM more interested in the fact that this guy got off everything but testosterone and pretty much cut his test dosage in half and just as I have been telling people "once you have been somewhere (muscle mass wise) for a long time, no matter how you got there....after a while the body acclimates itself and unless you take away all testosterone and go cold turkey......you can keep a good portion of your former self. You wont be as "tren androgen hard" but you will still be a very big boy.

You show me a 5'8" guy in here who has been 250 in reasonably lean shape for a long time with the help of "whatever he had used to accomplish that" and Ill show you a guy who can be 237-240 in reasonably lean shape on 300mg of testosterone a week and a small amount of gh a day....especially if he trains well and eats well.

 

[Magnum]

You show me a 5'8" guy in here who has been 250 in reasonably lean shape for a long time with the help of "whatever he had used to accomplish that" and Ill show you a guy who can be 237-240 in reasonably lean shape on 300mg of testosterone a week and a small amount of gh a day....especially if he trains well and eats well.

I totally agree, I have said before that it takes a lot less drugs to maintain an amount of muscle that may have taken a lot higher doses to build.

 

[VTliftVT]

I totally agree

I just wanted to document this moment....there's a first time for everything! :lightbulb:

 

[b-boy]

damn dante, i don't know what doctors you guys go to but I don't believe there is a doctor in the whole state of ky that will prescribe 300mg/wk of test as HRT.

now if this is some self medicated shit you guys are talking about then yes lets call it a low dose of test and not HRT! as you are not getting your natural test checked and taking a dosage to bring that into "normal" range. you are just taking what you call a low dose of test. he specifically said HRT dose, so i assumed he was going through a qualified medical professional.

 

[taslajrisi]

If someone uses 100mg of testosterone a week and it send their hematocrit soaring...well it sucks yes...but thats you that it sucks for. If BFU does 300mg a week and his hematocrit checks out...and all other bloodwork looks fine (PSA etc)...good for him.

DC, i agree that total test is irrelavant if all else checks out. I was just surprised that only 200mg put me that high. My H/H was creaping up too.

I have a question....does Hemoglobin and Ferritin levels correlate? I mean, when I gave blood last time, they refer to Hemoglobin as "your iron" and it was high end. I have never had my Ferritin levels checked but was wondering if someone is high in one is the other likely to be high also? I do take IP-6 but not sure i really need to and i give blood quarterly. Is it an iron rich diet that makes hemoglobin elevate or high RBC or both? I am trying to do more cardio too.
thanks

 

[maldorf]

200mg cyp a week put me at 1500 test level.......

yeah. anything more than a level of around 800 is out of range.

 

[maldorf]

damn bro, im glad you said this, I was just going to keep quiet as people think im mr. anti-steroid or something??? but that is not HRT dose, but i see a lot of people thinking it is. hell some people think 500mgs is HRT dose my doc told me the same thing as what you posted, that if she ever would put me on HRT therapy that it would be probably anywhere between 100-150mg/wk. and that should put me in the "normal" range.

Yeah, sometimes you feel like you have to bite your tongue. Since my heart attack I dont give a damn anymore and I just speak my mind.

 

[maldorf]

120mg/wk puts me in the high end of "normal" physiological levels.

Yep, im in the low 800s. Im fighting now with my doc to keep my dose at that, he wants to lower it too 100mg/wk.

I just want to make sure that people on here dont think that 250 my/wk is a normal HRT dose and is safe. It is not.

 

[maldorf]

See in my mind....I dont understand why anyone is giving BFU any guff about what he wants to do for a low testosterone weekly dosage.

There has been some literature that leaned towards the higher end (and maybe even slightly over the higher end) of the normal range is where the healthiest human range of testosterone is.

Im not so sure someone couldnt do 300mg a week of testosterone the rest of their life and live longer and healthier than if they did 100mg a week the rest of their life. I really dont know to be honest with you...its not like 300mg is absolutely abusive compared to these guys doing 2000mg a week.

If all bloodwork is fine and their hematocrit and hemaglobin doesnt creep up....more power to a guy if he wants to do 300mg a week of testosterone for the rest of his life....he shouldnt have to live by someone elses rules if his own bloodwork proves out to be fine.

If someone uses 100mg of testosterone a week and it send their hematocrit soaring...well it sucks yes...but thats you that it sucks for. If BFU does 300mg a week and his hematocrit checks out...and all other bloodwork looks fine (PSA etc)...good for him.

IM more interested in the fact that this guy got off everything but testosterone and pretty much cut his test dosage in half and just as I have been telling people "once you have been somewhere (muscle mass wise) for a long time, no matter how you got there....after a while the body acclimates itself and unless you take away all testosterone and go cold turkey......you can keep a good portion of your former self. You wont be as "tren androgen hard" but you will still be a very big boy.

You show me a 5'8" guy in here who has been 250 in reasonably lean shape for a long time with the help of "whatever he had used to accomplish that" and Ill show you a guy who can be 237-240 in reasonably lean shape on 300mg of testosterone a week and a small amount of gh a day....especially if he trains well and eats well.

THE problem I have with it is that young guys come on here and see him taking 300mg/wk and calling that HRT dose and they think its safe for them too to do that indefinitely. Many of those same guys wont hardly ever get any blood work and dont even know what HGB/HCT is and how it relates to test dose. This is the reason why these drugs are by perscription only. Too many folks trying to self medicate.

 

[maldorf]

damn dante, i don't know what doctors you guys go to but I don't believe there is a doctor in the whole state of ky that will prescribe 300mg/wk of test as HRT.

now if this is some self medicated shit you guys are talking about then yes lets call it a low dose of test and not HRT! as you are not getting your natural test checked and taking a dosage to bring that into "normal" range. you are just taking what you call a low dose of test. he specifically said HRT dose, so i assumed he was going through a qualified medical professional.

EXACTLY what I wanted to say :lightbulb:

 

[Magnum]

THE problem I have with it is that young guys come on here and see him taking 300mg/wk and calling that HRT dose and they think its safe for them too to do that indefinitely. Many of those same guys wont hardly ever get any blood work and dont even know what HGB/HCT is and how it relates to test dose. This is the reason why these drugs are by perscription only. Too many folks trying to self medicate.

Yes and also NO ONE ever needs to be on TRT unless their levels are lower than normal. Too many guy are on it because they know that 250 mgs per week is not a normal levels an will build some decent mass legally.

 

[maldorf]

Yes and also NO ONE ever needs to be on TRT unless their levels are lower than normal. Too many guy are on it because they know that 250 mgs per week is not a normal levels an will build some decent mass legally.

Yep. Youll see guys that are 20 yrs old on here asking about going on HRT. Some may medically need it ,but that is a very small minority.

 

[Rex Feral]

I agree the likely cause is iron overload. You want to measure transferrin saturation if he has not ordered it already. Threshold for hemochromatosis is a transferrin saturation of > 50%, with 60% or greater being very specific. Couple this with ferritin levels greater than 300-350 and liver enzyme elevation and you have a pretty definitive diagnosis of hemochromatosis. This is of course a genetic disorder and has nothing to do with your use of AAS. I will actually be surprised if your transferrin sat is not elevated. Its possible that there are other causes for your high ferritin, but @ 884 these things become highly improbable.

I have no idea why people are talking about creatinine, there is no issue there. I had to covert it b/c you have those quirky ass metric measures (are you in the U.S.?), but it is only 1.2 mg/dl Your CKs are from training obviously so also normal. Likely you will have serial/scheduled phlebotomy here shortly as someone else mentioned.

Rex.

 

[maldorf]

I agree the likely cause is iron overload. You want to measure transferrin saturation if he has not ordered it already. Threshold for hemochromatosis is a transferrin saturation of > 50%, with 60% or greater being very specific. Couple this with ferritin levels greater than 300-350 and liver enzyme elevation and you have a pretty definitive diagnosis of hemochromatosis. This is of course a genetic disorder and has nothing to do with your use of AAS. I will actually be surprised if your transferrin sat is not elevated. Its possible that there are other causes for your high ferritin, but @ 884 these things become highly improbable.

I have no idea why people are talking about creatinine, there is no issue there. I had to covert it b/c you have those quirky ass metric measures (are you in the U.S.?), but it is only 1.2 mg/dl Your CKs are from training obviously so also normal. Likely you will have serial/scheduled phlebotomy here shortly as someone else mentioned.

Rex.

Im wondering though how much a phlebotomy would help in this situation since his HGB is normal. If they take too much blood then his HGB will drop too low and he will be anemic?