My shoulder is a mess

[Hermogenes]

20+ years as an overhead athlete plus 30+ years ;lifting did a number on my shoulder:
arthritis
bursitis (debris in the bursa)
inflammation
impingement
tear
thickening of muscles

My doctor suggested external rotation exercises, shock wave therapy and acupuncture.

When asked about peptides he said that no conclusive evidence is available.

What are your thoughts?

 

[TODouble2]

My shoulders are destroyed also. Impingement, bursitis, arthritis, tendonitis. No tears though as of last MRI’s. Doc said I need shoulder replacements which doesn’t even recommend at my age.. he said just deal with it lol.

All I know is a dose of nandrolone as low as 50-100mg a week took away the majority of my pain. Life changing for me. I stopped it because of heart failure but considering 50mg a week for part of the year to really train pain free.. I believe it’s better than taking pain meds on a regular basis. Maybe others can weigh in on what they think of nandrolone long term for pain

Peptides - of course docs say there’s no conclusive evidence they’re not up on that kind of new stuff yet. That stuff you have to do on your own. I didn’t get relief from peptides much, but if you have a tear it will help heal something like that. I don’t think they do much for arthritis pain and stuff like that. Can’t hurt to try though.

I got zero relief from physical therapy and acupuncture. I did some graston scraping at my chiropractor that provides some temporary relief but far from a cure.

 

[TODouble2]

Here’s a good a video of a doctor talking about out nandrolone for chronic pain. It’s a good channel check him out if you’re not familiar with him.

 

[control]

All those rotational exercises made my shoulders worse. You're just working a muscle that's already inflamed and swollen. Those exercises are for prevention.

What helped my shoulders tremendously is dead hangs from a bar. You have to really commit to it. I was doing them almost every day and my shoulders were about 85% better after a month.

 

[TODouble2]

All those rotational exercises made my shoulders worse. You're just working a muscle that's already inflamed and swollen. Those exercises are for prevention.

What helped my shoulders tremendously is dead hangs from a bar. You have to really commit to it. I was doing them almost every day and my shoulders were about 85% better after a month.

How long did you hang for?

 

[TODouble2]

Another think I’ve realized is I was pressing with my shoulders for years. It’s crazy how I’ve been training for 20 years and still have a hard time isolating my pecs. I have very developed shoulders and weak chest to this day.

 

[control]

My shoulders are destroyed also. Impingement, bursitis, arthritis, tendonitis. No tears though as of last MRI’s. Doc said I need shoulder replacements which doesn’t even recommend at my age.. he said just deal with it lol.

All I know is a dose of nandrolone as low as 50-100mg a week took away the majority of my pain. Life changing for me. I stopped it because of heart failure but considering 50mg a week for part of the year to really train pain free.. I believe it’s better than taking pain meds on a regular basis. Maybe others can weigh in on what they think of nandrolone long term for pain

Peptides - of course docs say there’s no conclusive evidence they’re not up on that kind of new stuff yet. That stuff you have to do on your own. I didn’t get relief from peptides much, but if you have a tear it will help heal something like that. I don’t think they do much for arthritis pain and stuff like that. Can’t hurt to try though.

I got zero relief from physical therapy and acupuncture. I did some graston scraping at my chiropractor that provides some temporary relief but far from a cure.

I would love to take low dose nandrolone like that, but I don't want the dopamine effect, and apparently there's been studies that suggest it causes brain damage?

 

[control]

How long did you hang for?

At first I couldn't do it for very long because my shoulder was in so much pain, so I would just hold as long as I could, like three times. By the end of the month I could go over a minute, and I would do that 3 times after every workout

 

[TODouble2]

I would love to take low dose nandrolone like that, but I don't want the dopamine effect, and apparently there's been studies that suggest it causes brain damage?

Yea it’s not a decision to take lightly,, but I will say that I feel like even after stopping it, it had some lasting effect. So maybe one can utilize it on and off throughout the year at low doses. Take breaks. It’s a cost benefit thing you have to decide if it’s worth it and what it does for you. For me it’s was such relief I’d very much consider it long term if it wasn’t for my heart failure diagnosis. I may add tiny dose in the future though on and off and monitor bloods and echocardiogram to see how I react to that.

 

[control]

Another think I’ve realized is I was pressing with my shoulders for years. It’s crazy how I’ve been training for 20 years and still have a hard time isolating my pecs. I have very developed shoulders and weak chest to this day.

I'm about to stop all pressing movements except dips and various dip machines. I want to see if I can maintain or even improve my chest by focusing on flye movements, and do the same thing for shoulders with raise variations. I'm going to try it for 6 months, starting tomorrow. I was actually thinking of starting a thread about it, but someone's probably tried it before lol

 

[gauge22-v2]

20+ years as an overhead athlete plus 30+ years ;lifting did a number on my shoulder:
arthritis
bursitis (debris in the bursa)
inflammation
impingement
tear
thickening of muscles

My doctor suggested external rotation exercises, shock wave therapy and acupuncture.

When asked about peptides he said that no conclusive evidence is available.

What are your thoughts?

Monovisc injections into the joint provide a great deal of relief for me. It is typically used for knees.

Shockwave was bullshit. I dated a woman who was a therapist and I had dozens of free treatments, nothing.

Try to get a clean out done but vet the surgeon VERY carefully or you might end up like me (cant raise arm above 80 degrees).

 

[Jefe]

All those rotational exercises made my shoulders worse. You're just working a muscle that's already inflamed and swollen. Those exercises are for prevention.

What helped my shoulders tremendously is dead hangs from a bar. You have to really commit to it. I was doing them almost every day and my shoulders were about 85% better after a month.

Same. Rubber band shit just aggravated mine. Surprisingly, doing the palms up and palm down door stretched REALLY help. Five up high, five low. Take my time. Really helps.

 

[Jefe]

If you don’t have 45 minutes to listen to the video:

His knees, shoulders, and lower back are injured.
Both 50mg and 100mg per week of nandrolone gave him 50% pain reduction.
His bloodwork was unaffected.
Opiates are bad, nandrolone is a safer option for pain.
Something about osteopenis pain at the end but I forgot.

 

[fisther69]

20+ years as an overhead athlete plus 30+ years ;lifting did a number on my shoulder:
arthritis
bursitis (debris in the bursa)
inflammation
impingement
tear
thickening of muscles

My doctor suggested external rotation exercises, shock wave therapy and acupuncture.

When asked about peptides he said that no conclusive evidence is available.

What are your thoughts?

My right shoulder has had a total of 4 corrective surgeries..my left has had 3…I have had more surgeries for the whole body than most of the board combined..peptides have never did shit for my shoulder injuries. However, they have worked for other areas.

What I found helps the most with MY shoulders was switching from barbells, dumbbells, and cables and going strictly to rubber bands..the tension is totally different..I started doing super high rep rear delts with a 20lb rubber band every day for a long time and now they stopped requiring surgery and stopped hurting.

 

[Bio]

Calling @buck Your shoulder expertise is needed!

 

[Hermogenes]

Thank you all for your input.
For context, I do not overhead press for at least 5 years, no hanging or overhead pull for at least 2 years (to avoid increasing the size for the tear)
2-3 years of consistent external rotation exercises (think about one I did all variations)
Daily ELDOA, lots of stretching.
2 doctors, 1 physiotherapist.
I believe that I have exhausted all forms of exercise, hence looking for your POV.

Right now I am tempted to do Peptides and researching Nandrolone and Anavar use for injuries.

Yes, I feel like throuwing everything and the kitchen sink full of grenades, as I am frustrated being the good boy who gets punished.

 

[specter]

Monovisc injections into the joint provide a great deal of relief for me. It is typically used for knees.

Shockwave was bullshit. I dated a woman who was a therapist and I had dozens of free treatments, nothing.

Try to get a clean out done but vet the surgeon VERY carefully or you might end up like me (cant raise arm above 80 degrees).

Not true, maybe it did nothing for you but for me it over time removed 8mm calcification from my ligament in the shoulder, had scans done pre and post.

OP
You need to sit down and make a plan not just throwing everything at it at once, i have had all the same issues like you and then some, from different accidents and one injurey from training, my left shoulder is permanently locked in subluxation, so my advice would be as follows.
1. Avoid any axercises that really aggrevates your shoulder
2.Warm up your shoulder extensivly personally i have 3 different exercises that all is only for shoulder and they made a big difference
i had a fysio help and locate where my shoulder had weaknesses.
3. use different supps that lower inflammation
4. HGH has helped me alot !
5.use different kinds of cream, oil what ever to heat up your shoulder pre wo and then post wo ice it down to lower inflammation

All these things helped me along with dry needling so thath within a year i went from doing 0 pressing on flat bench to pressing 315lbs for sets of 11 reps with no pain.

 

[luki7788]

I have acromial impingement syndrome in both shoulders and a lot of calcifications on the tendons and delts muscles. What helps me the most is shock wave treatments and ultrasound. But I also have to admit that I used 100-200 mg of nandrolone for a whole year for a few years and my shoulders practically did not feel pain. For about a year I stopped taking nandrolone completely and I feel pain again so I want to try to go back to it and see if this time it will also bring me improvement

 

[buck]

20+ years as an overhead athlete plus 30+ years ;lifting did a number on my shoulder:
arthritis
bursitis (debris in the bursa)
inflammation
impingement
tear
thickening of muscles

My doctor suggested external rotation exercises, shock wave therapy and acupuncture.

When asked about peptides he said that no conclusive evidence is available.

What are your thoughts?

Short story i have had 1 shoulder rebuilt some after tearing the infraspinatus and supraspinatus off the bone as well as having a ruptured biceps fixed in 1 surgery 25 years ago. There were other lesser issues as well. Had the other shoulder replaced 12 years ago.

If you want to get better without surgery give the rehab a try what can it hurt.

Rotational exercises are to help strengthen muscle imbalance. If you are arthritis/deposits it may be uncomfortable. But so is having the imbalances get worse. And continued lifting will make things worse almost for sure. That is just how it goes. The other therapies may help deal with the pain but i have no experience with them. But on the other side masking pain just makes it easier to do more damage without noticing it. I found John Meadows spider crawls great for keeping my shoulders in a more natural positron. As compared to the rotated forward position the lifting and modern society leads us to having. Working on your weak points can only help you with what ever issue you may have.

Peptides never did a thing for me and i tried them a few times. But it seems your shoulders are in better shape then mine so maybe they may help you healing. But once things are very damaged they just seem to help with discomfort and reduce inflammation from my experience.

Low dose Nandrolone did nothing for me. It was not enough to help deal with the inflammation from the instability from the tears or the bone on bone.

Any tear of any real size will leave things unstable. Which allows wear and tear to happen at a faster rate. My torn labrum is what likley lead to having a replacement.

I quit doing over head presses years before the surgeries and can't say i lost any size. Whenever i throw them back in my shoulders are aching with in a month or 2. Delts can be stimulated well without raising the elbow above shoulder level. Dips are a thing of the past. Rotating the elbow behind the body and putting a load on it is not really what the shoulder was built for from my understanding. Dumbbells, machines that mimic arcing motions lateral raises have been more of a mainstay for me for many years.

But my rebuilt shoulder has gotten down to a little bone on bone and will get replaced one of these years although it causes me no real discomfort. But 40+ years of lifting tends to wear things down from my experience. Especially when decades are spent chasing weights, reps and muscle growth. But i can't complain about the fun i had along the way.

 

[JJT]

I have acromial impingement syndrome in both shoulders and a lot of calcifications on the tendons and delts muscles. What helps me the most is shock wave treatments and ultrasound. But I also have to admit that I used 100-200 mg of nandrolone for a whole year for a few years and my shoulders practically did not feel pain. For about a year I stopped taking nandrolone completely and I feel pain again so I want to try to go back to it and see if this time it will also bring me improvement

Did you every try corticosteroid shots for knees/shoulders?