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New testosterone study on blood clots

IronLion2

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Before I say anything, my guy you need to worry less about what people say on the interwebs, I worry you have too many knee jerk reactions to things you read.

1) I read this for 10 seconds before fully realizing this author has bias against HRT, not only that but this article feels like it was written by a blogger not a subject expert

"Dennis Thompson—Thompson, a HealthDay senior staff reporter, has been a reporter for about 25 years, working primarily at Gannett newspapers on both coasts of the United States. He also has worked as a freelance health reporter for a decade, writing articles for a variety of online and print news companies. "

So no credentials in health science, tight bro


2) He doesnt even go into the methods of creating the population or the methods of collecting the results
3) There's no mention of control variables in the population, without understanding your population you really cant understand your data
4) Unlike other forms of data analysis in health care, the larger the population is the more complicated things get because of the variances in the human genome.

Study 2/10 though I wouldnt 100% write off the idea that YES androgenic hormones have adverse reactions, we all clearly know that
 

nothuman

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Before I say anything, my guy you need to worry less about what people say on the interwebs, I worry you have too many knee jerk reactions to things you read.
I try to entertain both sides, and feel that everything new that comes out on the topic deserves to be read and understood, before deciding if it has merit. I lean towards agreeing that a high H/H in the absence of high platelets isn't that big of a risk, but there are still many that think it is. Given the fact that it's something myself and many others are dealing with, it would be reckless to not hear the other side too.

1) I read this for 10 seconds before fully realizing this author has bias against HRT, not only that but this article feels like it was written by a blogger not a subject expert

"Dennis Thompson—Thompson, a HealthDay senior staff reporter, has been a reporter for about 25 years, working primarily at Gannett newspapers on both coasts of the United States. He also has worked as a freelance health reporter for a decade, writing articles for a variety of online and print news companies. "

So no credentials in health science, tight bro


2) He doesnt even go into the methods of creating the population or the methods of collecting the results
3) There's no mention of control variables in the population, without understanding your population you really cant understand your data
4) Unlike other forms of data analysis in health care, the larger the population is the more complicated things get because of the variances in the human genome.

Study 2/10 though I wouldnt 100% write off the idea that YES androgenic hormones have adverse reactions, we all clearly know that
Thanks for your input.
 

maldorf

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The study he references is in JAMA, a highly respected medical journal.


You should be able to find it on the website. I'd trust anything in there as being legit. JAMA is a long standing journal, I remember it being an authority back in the 80s when I was in high school and it goes back longer then that I bet.

I'm on HRT and it's another reason besides my clotting disorder that I'm on Coumadin. I've been warning folks of this danger since I had my clot, but many refuse to listen.
 

bad rad

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Flying too long in a plane also increases your chances of a blood clot.
 

maldorf

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Flying too long in a plane also increases your chances of a blood clot.
Yes. I'd say people stuck for a long time in a hospital bed too. They have air inflated cuffs that pump up a patient's lower leg, set to go off at an interval. A family member of mine is friends with a guy that nearly died on a long plane trip from a clot that traveled to his brain.
 

maldorf

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This article mentions another study, over 60% increase in chance for clot.

"The U.S. Food and Drug Administration in June 2014 required that all approved testosterone products carry a warning about VTE risk, researchers said in background notes.

Since then, the FDA has expanded its testosterone warning to include increased risk of heart attacks, personality changes and infertility."



"Within the first six months of testosterone treatment, a man's risk of blood clots increased 63 percent compared to those not taking the hormone, the researchers found.

The study didn't establish a direct cause-and-effect relationship, however.

Nor does it mean there's a significant additional risk of VTE for the average guy, since the risk is low to begin with, Martinez and Creager said. The overall risk increase translates to about one additional case of blood clots for every 1,000 men a year."
 

madg

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Yes. I'd say people stuck for a long time in a hospital bed too. They have air inflated cuffs that pump up a patient's lower leg, set to go off at an interval. A family member of mine is friends with a guy that nearly died on a long plane trip from a clot that traveled to his brain.

My father almost died after traveling 15 years Greece-korea back and forth

He is contractor to build tanker ships that cary oil

Doctor said it was from all this time flying

Sory for bad english
 

maldorf

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My father almost died after traveling 15 years Greece-korea back and forth

He is contractor to build tanker ships that cary oil

Doctor said it was from all this time flying

Sory for bad english
Yeah, when I flew to Italy I made sure to get up at least once every 3 hours or so and walk a bit.
 

madg

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Yeah, when I flew to Italy I made sure to get up at least once every 3 hours or so and walk a bit.
Mal ... offtopic

But i will make a thread for you

Im natural since november after 7 years B&C ..
I did it after reading your thread

Thank you brother 🙏🏻

You save me

Keep up the good work and spread the word around

Much love and respect
 

nothuman

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The study he references is in JAMA, a highly respected medical journal.


You should be able to find it on the website. I'd trust anything in there as being legit. JAMA is a long standing journal, I remember it being an authority back in the 80s when I was in high school and it goes back longer then that I bet.

I'm on HRT and it's another reason besides my clotting disorder that I'm on Coumadin. I've been warning folks of this danger since I had my clot, but many refuse to listen.
Jama is very reputable, I agree. I do think your case is a bit unique due to your Factor V gene. Most people never test to see if they have that though, so they might as well assume they have it until they actually test for it.
 

maldorf

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Jama is very reputable, I agree. I do think your case is a bit unique due to your Factor V gene. Most people never test to see if they have that though, so they might as well assume they have it until they actually test for it.
It is factor 2. There are quite a few I think you can have. The prevalence of mine is 2% of the Caucasian population, so not real rare. Obviously taking testosterone raises your chances of a clot, and the more you take the higher the risk. Other steroids have a similar effect, I think the higher the androgenic effect the worse it is for clots but not sure.
 

nothuman

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It is factor 2. There are quite a few I think you can have. The prevalence of mine is 2% of the Caucasian population, so not real rare. Obviously taking testosterone raises your chances of a clot, and the more you take the higher the risk. Other steroids have a similar effect, I think the higher the androgenic effect the worse it is for clots but not sure.
Oh sorry I thought it was Factor V. I didn't mean to misdiagnose you, lol. I looked back at the ones I was tested for and they were Factor V, HTLV-I/II, and JAK2 V617F. I guess I need to test for Factor 2? Any others?

I tested negative for those but I have one gene variant for hemochromatosis (H63D) according to 23andme. It says I am not likely at risk of getting it but I have to think it could play a role in why I absorb iron so easily. Never had a platelet issue though. It's usually low 200s.
 

Pumped340

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Haven't read it yet, will now.

I will say, I think people on this board are quick to want to dismiss any evidence that comes out against AAS or TRT. The reality is, there likely is some increased risk in my opinion. But again there are so many variables to look at, which many don't.

Are they controlling estrogen? Most don't. Are they using proper doses in proper intervals? Many don't. Hell plenty of docs just give one injection once every 2 weeks and barely do any follow up.

If you're taking TRT and your levels are still physiological, your BP is controlled, you have a good HR, your Hb/Hct are normal, etc then you may still be at some increased risk, but I doubt it is very significant. If, however, now that you're on TRT your SBP is up 10-20 points, your Hb/Hct are up a few points, etc I would bet you are at some increased risk.
 

MethodAir

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Can someone please tell me that is study is flawed and explain why? Please tell me what I want to hear.
As I've stated before, compounds like Anavar can significantly decrease the risk of a blood clot by markedly increasing prothrombin time, ie the length of time it takes for a blood clot to occur. I've personally observed a 4 fold increase in pt time with this compound. Incorrect dosing of coumadin and anavar can very quickly turn you into the equivalent of a hemophiliac.
 

maldorf

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Oh sorry I thought it was Factor V. I didn't mean to misdiagnose you, lol. I looked back at the ones I was tested for and they were Factor V, HTLV-I/II, and JAK2 V617F. I guess I need to test for Factor 2? Any others?

I tested negative for those but I have one gene variant for hemochromatosis (H63D) according to 23andme. It says I am not likely at risk of getting it but I have to think it could play a role in why I absorb iron so easily. Never had a platelet issue though. It's usually low 200s.
No, its a different disorder. https://www.stoptheclot.org/learn_more/prothrombin-g20210a-factor-ii-mutation/

I don't know how many exist, but there are more than enough!
 

emeric delczeg

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Oh sorry I thought it was Factor V. I didn't mean to misdiagnose you, lol. I looked back at the ones I was tested for and they were Factor V, HTLV-I/II, and JAK2 V617F. I guess I need to test for Factor 2? Any others?

I tested negative for those but I have one gene variant for hemochromatosis (H63D) according to 23andme. It says I am not likely at risk of getting it but I have to think it could play a role in why I absorb iron so easily. Never had a platelet issue though. It's usually low 200s.
For those with blood disorders use only 50mg for TRT per week.
 

maldorf

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As I've stated before, compounds like Anavar can significantly decrease the risk of a blood clot by markedly increasing prothrombin time, ie the length of time it takes for a blood clot to occur. I've personally observed a 4 fold increase in pt time with this compound. Incorrect dosing of coumadin and anavar can very quickly turn you into the equivalent of a hemophiliac.
Coumadin is nothing anyone should ever use without a doctor's care. Requires testing ever couple weeks for awhile until you figure your dose. Diet can really throw your INR value off too.

I wouldn't say its safe for a guy to go on Anavar to prevent clots either.
 

emeric delczeg

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Coumadin is nothing anyone should ever use without a doctor's care. Requires testing ever couple weeks for awhile until you figure your dose. Diet can really throw your INR value off too.

I wouldn't say its safe for a guy to go on Anavar to prevent clots either.
I have factor 5, I have been experimenting on my self with TRT dose, with out blood thinners I would suggest no more then 50mg per week.
 

MethodAir

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Coumadin is nothing anyone should ever use without a doctor's care. Requires testing ever couple weeks for awhile until you figure your dose. Diet can really throw your INR value off too.

I wouldn't say its safe for a guy to go on Anavar to prevent clots either.
To illustrate its anti-clotting properties, the addition of 20mg/day anavar can quickly quadruple the effect of a stable coumadin dose, resulting in a 4 fold increase in INR. Then pin yourself and you're likely to swell up like a balloon.
 

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