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NFL Thread

Biggerp73

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Jameis Winston is a player I like. Lots of potential - still young. Huge arm.
 

cage99

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Jameis Winston is a player I like. Lots of potential - still young. Huge arm.
He shows flashes I agree… But in the larger picture he hasn’t been reliable for either the Bucs or my Saints. I’m hoping that changes, but I’m also a realist too!

Cage
 

psychor

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What do you guys think will happen with Baker? Is his contract too high or risky for a team to take a chance on him? I think he is a decent starting qb, not necessarily elite or in the top tier of qb's but probably as good as or better than about half. I don't think there are many opportunities left for him this year. Maybe he will just sit out this year, who knows at this point? My Panthers could've gone after him, but at the end of the day, the risk/reward of his contract amount was probably the deciding factor as the Browns were not willing to negotiate or take some of his contract price. Adding to the fact that next years draft will be much better and deeper with possible starting qb's. Yes Baker is better imho than Darnold but not worth his asking price. Taking Corral in the 3rd round is not a risky pick either as not much will be expected from him.
 

cage99

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Baker.

#1 - NEEDS a top ten starting offensive line
#2 - HAVE one decent receiver, and two elite

He’ll have a decent shot IF he can land somewhere like that. He also needs to humble himself, and be willing to learn. This experience here where he’s in limbo should do just that. He’s not as good as he thinks he is! He’s young still and needs to mature.

Cage
 

qbkilla

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Bakwr
Baker.

#1 - NEEDS a top ten starting offensive line
#2 - HAVE one decent receiver, and two elite

He’ll have a decent shot IF he can land somewhere like that. He also needs to humble himself, and be willing to learn. This experience here where he’s in limbo should do just that. He’s not as good as he thinks he is! He’s young still and needs to mature.

Cage
Baker and Winston both are bottom 5 NFL starters, just a guy no one that can elevate your team.

When you have this types as starter your always looking for a real franchise QB. Next year with a few good QB coming out they probably won't be top 32 QB so would be a good backup.

But no one starting either should expect playoffs or championship. Both are busts based on draft status. Baker is a little diva.
 

TheOtherOne55

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I honestly have no problem with Baker.

We all have to remember that he has had what, 3 NFL coaches and 4 offensive coordinators since he was drafted.
New scheme after new scheme. And this year he played with a bum shoulder. When he has been healthy (2020) he was a 30 TD 9INT starting QB fora playoff team. I honestly think the OBJ drama is the reason for his bad rep. And honestly, LBJ is a shell of his former Giant self. His last yeas on the Giants were blah, this Browns time was blah too, and he was getting wide open looks in LA because of Cooper. Nothing to do with Baker at all. That Browns offense was a play action offense and if anything, he probably gambled a little bit too much. He has Brett Favre-like tendancies. Throws that amazing you and picks that confuse you. Cleveland management fucked that situation too by bringing Watson in. Any startng QB would be pissed.

I would continue to bet on Baker until he has shown negative seasons as a starting QB fully healthy.
Let's remember that Baker went to the Browns when they were a 1 win team...now they are a middle of the pack 7-10 win team and we are complainng that they aren't better. It's like being angry at 2000s Lions QBs.....its the entire organization, not just 1 draft pick.

Jameis is another story. He just doesnt see certain things until its too late. And that is the worst trait to have as an NFL QB. WAyyyyy too many balls that he just throws up as a hail mary type play.
 

qbkilla

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I honestly have no problem with Baker.

We all have to remember that he has had what, 3 NFL coaches and 4 offensive coordinators since he was drafted.
New scheme after new scheme. And this year he played with a bum shoulder. When he has been healthy (2020) he was a 30 TD 9INT starting QB fora playoff team. I honestly think the OBJ drama is the reason for his bad rep. And honestly, LBJ is a shell of his former Giant self. His last yeas on the Giants were blah, this Browns time was blah too, and he was getting wide open looks in LA because of Cooper. Nothing to do with Baker at all. That Browns offense was a play action offense and if anything, he probably gambled a little bit too much. He has Brett Favre-like tendancies. Throws that amazing you and picks that confuse you. Cleveland management fucked that situation too by bringing Watson in. Any startng QB would be pissed.

I would continue to bet on Baker until he has shown negative seasons as a starting QB fully healthy.
Let's remember that Baker went to the Browns when they were a 1 win team...now they are a middle of the pack 7-10 win team and we are complainng that they aren't better. It's like being angry at 2000s Lions QBs.....its the entire organization, not just 1 draft pick.

Jameis is another story. He just doesnt see certain things until its too late. And that is the worst trait to have as an NFL QB. WAyyyyy too many balls that he just throws up as a hail mary type play.
I agree on Odell but not on baker. Odell is a Sissy, looks and acts like one.

Bakers best year 2020 he didn't put up 30td, looking at the stats he was the 18th best QB, 15th if we Chery pick the best categories stat wise that he had.

I feel like the arguments in favor of him are the same for other QB I called busts early (I'm known among my friends as that mean you that calls qb bust early and doesn't let them develop the fragile baby birds they are lol).

Winston, Mariota, Mitch, baker, Sam, none should be anyone's starting qb. If they are, then your hoping to find a better qb. Cousins, tannenhill, carr are a tier above them.

I think baker has a bad attitude, a chip can be good, but too many people mock and laugh at him that tells me he likely isn't respected by his peers and we do have evidence that he isn't. Him and Odell were both clowns it wasn't ones fault or another's both are douchebags. I don't even see any traits I like in baker they say his arm is elite I don't see it, Allen, carr, maholmes, Rogers, Kyler, flacco, those are guns. Bakers arm isn't tua or Pennington weak just average.

As an athlete he has the dad bod, probably some puffy nips and little belly under the jersey, short, balls batted down, looks awkward moving or getting sacked, I just don't think he has it.

Would be a good backup but I can't see him ever even being tannenhill. I don't think the NFL thinks highly of him hence why they can't get anything for him, Seattle likes lock more Carolina thinks him and darnold are essentially the same guy but darnold doesn't have the Napoleon complex he just sucks lol.
 

TheOtherOne55

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Baker put up 30 & 9 in 17 games in 2020. Stats are always adjusted with playoff numbers.
Bakers best year 2020 he didn't put up 30td, looking at the stats he was the 18th best QB, 15th if we Chery pick the best categories stat wise that he had.
Top 15 (some top 10) in every major QB stat worth noting (QBR, Passer Rating, RAW)

Agree to disagree.
The best version of Baker is a Cousins.
Except he's more of a risk-taker than Cousins is (which can be looked at as a good or bad thing).
I just cant write off a QB after 1 organization. If its a TREND, then I get it.
If you suck at your second place, you run out of chances. Darnold is at that point right now. Just not good enough for 2 diff franchises and no other spot is going to want to take a chance on him.

My favorite new guy is Herbert tho. Feel like he has all the tools to be great. Chargers just need to get over the damn hump lol
Also a big Burrow fan.
 

qbkilla

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Baker put up 30 & 9 in 17 games in 2020. Stats are always adjusted with playoff numbers.

Top 15 (some top 10) in every major QB stat worth noting (QBR, Passer Rating, RAW)

Agree to disagree.
The best version of Baker is a Cousins.
Except he's more of a risk-taker than Cousins is (which can be looked at as a good or bad thing).
I just cant write off a QB after 1 organization. If its a TREND, then I get it.
If you suck at your second place, you run out of chances. Darnold is at that point right now. Just not good enough for 2 diff franchises and no other spot is going to want to take a chance on him.

My favorite new guy is Herbert tho. Feel like he has all the tools to be great. Chargers just need to get over the damn hump lol
Also a big Burrow fan.
Agree on Herbie and burrow. Agree to disagree on baker lol.

I feel like 15 years ago it was ok to develop a QB, give him some slack his first few years. But it seems like latley so many kids come into the NFL and can ball like we didn't see 15 years ago.

Cam, Watson, Herbert, burrow, Russ, rg3, luck. So it leads me to believe that NFL teams expect them to look good early, and you got basically 4 years to decide if your going to pay him 40 a year so no time to let them develop.

Lamar and Goff looked bad their rookie years, but Lamar made big strides year 2 and Goff did with McVeigh before sucking again .

Trevor can't believe he looked bad, I get he has urban, but I thought I'd see more. Wilson and fields didn't look too great but oddly mills did lol

Pickett? Not sure on him I think Dalton is his cieling but Pittsburgh gets lucky with QBs, although I don't trust Tomlin or their OC to develop a QB, Tomlin is a CEO type and the oc sucks so no ken Dorsey type to make Pickett look good.

Who do you like next year? Young and Stroud look the part but damn young is tiny. Rattler has a cannon but a douche, DJ at Clemson and Anthony Richardson could ride into top QBs. Next year's QB class is loaded.
 

sandiego_2008

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I honestly have no problem with Baker.

We all have to remember that he has had what, 3 NFL coaches and 4 offensive coordinators since he was drafted.
New scheme after new scheme. And this year he played with a bum shoulder. When he has been healthy (2020) he was a 30 TD 9INT starting QB fora playoff team. I honestly think the OBJ drama is the reason for his bad rep. And honestly, LBJ is a shell of his former Giant self. His last yeas on the Giants were blah, this Browns time was blah too, and he was getting wide open looks in LA because of Cooper. Nothing to do with Baker at all. That Browns offense was a play action offense and if anything, he probably gambled a little bit too much. He has Brett Favre-like tendancies. Throws that amazing you and picks that confuse you. Cleveland management fucked that situation too by bringing Watson in. Any startng QB would be pissed.

I would continue to bet on Baker until he has shown negative seasons as a starting QB fully healthy.
Let's remember that Baker went to the Browns when they were a 1 win team...now they are a middle of the pack 7-10 win team and we are complainng that they aren't better. It's like being angry at 2000s Lions QBs.....its the entire organization, not just 1 draft pick.

Jameis is another story. He just doesnt see certain things until its too late. And that is the worst trait to have as an NFL QB. WAyyyyy too many balls that he just throws up as a hail mary type play.
As someone who is a life long Browns fan ( miserable i know ) I always will root for Baker. I loved his swag when he came on this garbage team and helped them turn things around. The issue with the OBJ situation was alarming though. I was not a OBJ fan at all but not one teammate came to Bakers defense after that incident. In fact, the majority of the team supported Beckham and wanted him back. I dont know what happened but Mayfield lost the lockerroom and the front office/coaching staff at some point last year.
 

astrosfan123

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lol when i was up in ohio browns fans cracked me up, they loved them some baker and i told them every single time hes not "that dude." If they come up short in a game it will ALWAYS be because of him. I can't stand the dude honestly maybe its the football player in me. He blame deflects to the media and always plays the victim. If you know a guy is not "the guy" and literally has no more potential than what he has shown then its time to get rid of him. Hence jimmy G. As a niners fan that dude has reached his ceiling and there is absolutely no other that he will do to get better. Lol baker is the same. Hes an avg qb at best and if he was anything more teams would have lined up for him.
 

cage99

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As someone who is a life long Browns fan ( miserable i know ) I always will root for Baker. I loved his swag when he came on this garbage team and helped them turn things around. The issue with the OBJ situation was alarming though. I was not a OBJ fan at all but not one teammate came to Bakers defense after that incident. In fact, the majority of the team supported Beckham and wanted him back. I dont know what happened but Mayfield lost the lockerroom and the front office/coaching staff at some point last year.
Y’all just need Bernie Kosar back! HaHa… Think that was the last time they were considered competitive. Maybe Vinny Testaverde too.
Cage
 

qbkilla

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lol when i was up in ohio browns fans cracked me up, they loved them some baker and i told them every single time hes not "that dude." If they come up short in a game it will ALWAYS be because of him. I can't stand the dude honestly maybe its the football player in me. He blame deflects to the media and always plays the victim. If you know a guy is not "the guy" and literally has no more potential than what he has shown then its time to get rid of him. Hence jimmy G. As a niners fan that dude has reached his ceiling and there is absolutely no other that he will do to get better. Lol baker is the same. Hes an avg qb at best and if he was anything more teams would have lined up for him.
Pretty much, baker just has the look of a beta in a job your need an alpha. But they wanted an adult at qb so now they have a guy who can buy a hooker every right of the week but chooses to molest massage therapists and jerk off in towels while they massage him and was stupid enough to get busted, atlesst this child can play.

I can't blame the browns you need a QB to win but they made a deal with the devil, hopefully it doesn't work out and the misery continues.

Tbh, the Bengals are leaps and bounds ahead of ravens, browns, Steelers, they should own that division for the foreseeable future.
 

whacked

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The Baker ~ Dalton comparison is a good/fair one.

Both are decent and can be starters on at least 30% of NFL teams.

Both have their limitations but with a studly supporting cast, will do their part to get it done.

Both took garbage franchises and turned them around in their rookie seasons / early years and took their teams to the playoffs.

Both are inconsistent. They look great in some games and just plain awful in others.

My opinion …..
Both were very unfairly unappreciated (and crucified at times); by the majority of the fan base with utterly insane expectations. They were also scapegoated for every loss and rarely given credit for the wins.

QB’ing in Cincy and Cleveland are not for the faint of heart. These franchises and fans are desperate for a SB win and tired of being embarrassed.
 

qbkilla

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The Baker ~ Dalton comparison is a good/fair one.

Both are decent and can be starters on at least 30% of NFL teams.

Both have their limitations but with a studly supporting cast, will do their part to get it done.

Both took garbage franchises and turned them around in their rookie seasons / early years and took their teams to the playoffs.

Both are inconsistent. They look great in some games and just plain awful in others.

My opinion …..
Both were very unfairly unappreciated (and crucified at times); by the majority of the fan base with utterly insane expectations. They were also scapegoated for every loss and rarely given credit for the wins.

QB’ing in Cincy and Cleveland are not for the faint of heart. These franchises and fans are desperate for a SB win and tired of being embarrassed.
I'm an admitted what time would call "baker hater" which to me just means I think he sucks lol.

I can't compare him to Dalton. Dalton was a second round pick who got a second contact and led his team to the playoffs numerous times .

Baker was a top overall pick who it doesn't appear will finish out his rookie deal on his team and led them to the playoffs once.

I'd have to call Dalton a great pick and baker a bust looking at Allen and Lamar being taken after him.
 

Biggerp73

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Pretty much, baker just has the look of a beta in a job your need an alpha. But they wanted an adult at qb so now they have a guy who can buy a hooker every right of the week but chooses to molest massage therapists and jerk off in towels while they massage him and was stupid enough to get busted, atlesst this child can play.

I can't blame the browns you need a QB to win but they made a deal with the devil, hopefully it doesn't work out and the misery continues.

Tbh, the Bengals are leaps and bounds ahead of ravens, browns, Steelers, they should own that division for the foreseeable future.
I don't think the Browns "made a deal with the devil." I think it's rather obvious that Deshaun was having consensual sex with random IG models who advertised themselves as "massage therapists", who were approached by a shady lawyer and told they could get millions if they turned the scenario into assault. Deshaun was stupid, but not necessarily "evil."

I think the Browns were actually fairly shrewd. They had no chance of getting an elite QB, so they went ahead and just did a fully guaranteed deal and made it happen. In the long run I think this deal makes the Browns a better franchise, or at the least, gives them a chance to be one.
 

qbkilla

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I don't think the Browns "made a deal with the devil." I think it's rather obvious that Deshaun was having consensual sex with random IG models who advertised themselves as "massage therapists", who were approached by a shady lawyer and told they could get millions if they turned the scenario into assault. Deshaun was stupid, but not necessarily "evil."

I think the Browns were actually fairly shrewd. They had no chance of getting an elite QB, so they went ahead and just did a fully guaranteed deal and made it happen. In the long run I think this deal makes the Browns a better franchise, or at the least, gives them a chance to be one.
I dunno all the details and evidence I've seen points to it as they were legit therapists and he was a pervert with a fetish, texts, money exchange, not him hooking up on ig. His mom also wanted him away from Hopkins because he was a bad influence on him hence why O'Brien gave away Hopkins, something to do with Watsons mother reaching out to McNair's wife as she was worried about him. Then Watson got involved with an agent and not to get it into politics but the agent has an agenda and made demands that have to do with race.

But for Cleveland it may work out, they are giving up alot of resources for him in draft picks and cap dollars will be interesting to see the talent they can surround him with in coming years

I do not think Baltimore will pay Lamar that and he could very well get traded, the QB contacts are now out of hand because this contract set the bar
 

TheOtherOne55

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lol when i was up in ohio browns fans cracked me up, they loved them some baker and i told them every single time hes not "that dude." If they come up short in a game it will ALWAYS be because of him. I can't stand the dude honestly maybe its the football player in me. He blame deflects to the media and always plays the victim. If you know a guy is not "the guy" and literally has no more potential than what he has shown then its time to get rid of him. Hence jimmy G. As a niners fan that dude has reached his ceiling and there is absolutely no other that he will do to get better. Lol baker is the same. Hes an avg qb at best and if he was anything more teams would have lined up for him.
There is a massive difference between Jimmy G and Baker.

Jimmy, for one, was thrust into a well-run organization with talent (better than his own) around him.
Yes, he's definitely maxed out his potential. I can agree with that. But Baker has had no stability with coordinators, coaching or staying healthy. IF he had that, i could maybe see similarities. Baker is just an idiot and lost the lockerroom, but i am yet to write him off as shitty non-NFL starter.
I don't think the Browns "made a deal with the devil." I think it's rather obvious that Deshaun was having consensual sex with random IG models who advertised themselves as "massage therapists", who were approached by a shady lawyer and told they could get millions if they turned the scenario into assault. Deshaun was stupid, but not necessarily "evil."

I think the Browns were actually fairly shrewd. They had no chance of getting an elite QB, so they went ahead and just did a fully guaranteed deal and made it happen. In the long run I think this deal makes the Browns a better franchise, or at the least, gives them a chance to be one.

LOL realllly? I can't tell if you're joking here.
I like Watson as a player, freaking badass. But is prettttty obvious that he is a creep. If it were 2, 4, maybe 6 girls saying the same story, I could understand your theory, but 22+ ....that is some Bill Cosby shit lol Thinking its all some plan by a lawyer is conspiracy thinking at its finest.
Im fine with him not being indicted by the grand jury, but its pretty clear he has a unique fetish about "personal masseuses." Weiiird.
 

whacked

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I'm an admitted what time would call "baker hater" which to me just means I think he sucks lol.

I can't compare him to Dalton. Dalton was a second round pick who got a second contact and led his team to the playoffs numerous times .

Baker was a top overall pick who it doesn't appear will finish out his rookie deal on his team and led them to the playoffs once.

I'd have to call Dalton a great pick and baker a bust looking at Allen and Lamar being taken after him.

Those are some fair points as well.
 

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