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No more DECA or EQ ???

For all you guys saying "I've never had a problem" are you getting brain scans while on deca, brains scans before deca to base changes off of? How do you know deca is not doing damage to your brain?

Just questions. It's kind of like having high blood pressure for 10 years but saying wow I'm shocked cause I always felt fine 😪
That would explain some of Arnold's recent statements.
 
There is a lot of talk now that the EQ lowers the e2 level, but has anyone really noticed it?

I am not convinced by Derek's arguments from YT, after that the blood tests of the people he presented in the material were with high EQ and low testosterone. I have never heard of anyone having problems with too low estrogen using, for example, 1.2g test + 900mg EQ
LLELLWYN said in his book that it aromatizes at 50% rate of TEST...regarding lowering e2 I have never experienced this personally and ran plenty of eq in last decade , I am on it right now, temporal lobe pressure and anxiety :)
 
LLELLWYN said in his book that it aromatizes at 50% rate of TEST...regarding lowering e2 I have never experienced this personally and ran plenty of eq in last decade , I am on it right now, temporal lobe pressure and anxiety :)

Boldenone supposedly has a pronounced effect on gabaergic transmission which would explain the anxiety many experience from it. Although there will be more to it because other steroids (Stanozolol for example) have a similar effect but aren't known as causing the same levels of anxiety. Although it is very dose dependant and higher doses will definitely have someone closer to that line of panic. As I have posted before I get severe anxiety from boldenone, trenbolone and hcg. I have 2 vials of bold now and was contemplating adding it in at a low dose (it's been years) but after having issues with hcg the other night (not had anxiety in ages) I will probably leave it for now. I have no issues on other aas especially when using standard doses.
 
There are 2 schools of thoughts when it comes to anxiety from EQ, i am not sure if either is even correct

1. Christian Thibodeau spoke that EQ strips gaba so in that downstream affect it can cause anxiety in some individuals i forget the podcast but he mentions how to over come this

2. some say its due to EQ raising H/H biomarkers which can increase blood pressure and heart palpitations and cause anxiety.

both of them seem to be an indirect source of anxiety

3. i will add number 3 (since people read about this on so many forums before ever trying EQ or any drug, they are looking out for this side affect mentally and sure enough you will find that which you seek.

at the end of the day who knows there is no side affect free hormone other than trt dose of test probably.
 
Boldenone supposedly has a pronounced effect on gabaergic transmission which would explain the anxiety many experience from it. Although there will be more to it because other steroids (Stanozolol for example) have a similar effect but aren't known as causing the same levels of anxiety. Although it is very dose dependant and higher doses will definitely have someone closer to that line of panic. As I have posted before I get severe anxiety from boldenone, trenbolone and hcg. I have 2 vials of bold now and was contemplating adding it in at a low dose (it's been years) but after having issues with hcg the other night (not had anxiety in ages) I will probably leave it for now. I have no issues on other aas especially when using standard doses.
gabapentin(med) does the opposite for me- I wonder if that acts on the same pathway as bold @gaba, or if there is any parallel or correlation - i may be wrong

i have bad anxiety right now probably on eq. I sweat in my armpits and feet and am in fight or flight 24/7 more now (I have TRPTSD) but its normally under control. I am also on tren ace. and I'm not running hot, only at night, not a core temp thing
 
gabapentin(med) does the opposite for me- I wonder if that acts on the same pathway as bold @gaba, or if there is any parallel or correlation - i may be wrong

i have bad anxiety right now probably on eq. I sweat in my armpits and feet and am in fight or flight 24/7 more now (I have TRPTSD) but its normally under control. I am also on tren ace. and I'm not running hot, only at night, not a core temp thing

Yes it could be worth using when on boldenone as it increases GABA levels significantly and also penetrates the blood-brain barrier. My dog Flex was on gabapentin before he had back surgery. You are on the 2 worst things for anxiety so it could be either or both. I would assume the night temperature is tren and the anxiety is from both.
 
tren is very sympathetic and will drive the CNS so it makes everything worse.
 
There are 2 schools of thoughts when it comes to anxiety from EQ, i am not sure if either is even correct

1. Christian Thibodeau spoke that EQ strips gaba so in that downstream affect it can cause anxiety in some individuals i forget the podcast but he mentions how to over come this

2. some say its due to EQ raising H/H biomarkers which can increase blood pressure and heart palpitations and cause anxiety.

both of them seem to be an indirect source of anxiety

3. i will add number 3 (since people read about this on so many forums before ever trying EQ or any drug, they are looking out for this side affect mentally and sure enough you will find that which you seek.

at the end of the day who knows there is no side affect free hormone other than trt dose of test probably.
As of now, 1 & 2 are not fleshed out enough experimentally enough to say anything particular with respect to Boldenone. From there being no data on its particular haematopoetic properties, to there being no data on its particular GABAergic properties, to only a weak association between postpartum depression-anxiety and haematocrit in the third trimester, this is all really just... wanton supposition.

I have personally experienced tremendous EQ anxiety despite it being before the time of widespread dissemination about this particular effect (and not something I was aware of), ruling out at least for me, 3 as an influence.

So there's some evidence of general AAS effects on the GABA system, but nothing with respect to EQ. There's evidence of AAS effects on haematocrit, but nothing with respect to EQ whatsoever (whether animal, mechanistic, etc. This includes the study I had been looking for and read, that did not analyze EQ). There's some data on a Hct/postpartum depression-anxiety link.
 
Something that has worked for years will continue to work, and now we have times when people want to break out, so they try to come out with something new. And honestly, all the best figures I know are built mainly for the test, eq and nandrolone

Also, are primo and dht derivatives that good? they certainly have a worse effect on the lipid profile than deca or eq and as for the toxic effect on the kidneys, EQ has not been proven in any way and this is only a hypothesis
The comment about primo and lipids surprised me. I’ve run around 800mg/week and my blood work showed that my lipids were normal. I’m getting a little older and more cautious and have moved closer to primo and away from many other compounds. I’m curious what your blood work experience has been with primo.
 
Boldenone and tren are mentally rough on me also.

Some think EQ lowering estrogen is the cause of the anxiety. I’ve seen some blood work on low test high EQ with VERY low E2, high E1…..might be the issue, idk
 
As of now, 1 & 2 are not fleshed out enough experimentally enough to say anything particular with respect to Boldenone. From there being no data on its particular haematopoetic properties, to there being no data on its particular GABAergic properties, to only a weak association between postpartum depression-anxiety and haematocrit in the third trimester, this is all really just... wanton supposition.

I have personally experienced tremendous EQ anxiety despite it being before the time of widespread dissemination about this particular effect (and not something I was aware of), ruling out at least for me, 3 as an influence.

So there's some evidence of general AAS effects on the GABA system, but nothing with respect to EQ. There's evidence of AAS effects on haematocrit, but nothing with respect to EQ whatsoever (whether animal, mechanistic, etc. This includes the study I had been looking for and read, that did not analyze EQ). There's some data on a Hct/postpartum depression-anxiety link.

Would be interested in your take on Deca if you have one and are inclined to share. From what I've heard the study cited as problematic on brain issues excluded or minimized the presence of estradiol which provides neuroprotective properties - when compared to using testosterone this puts deca at a disadvantage in isolation but practically speaking if estradiol is present, as in most cycles, this wouldn't occur or at least to the same degree. If this line of thinking is correct we could extrapolate the particular deca findings to all non or minimally aromatizing compounds. Note that this is just the "bro" stuff I've heard on forums. No idea if any is right and didn't read the main deca source study which everyone is citing. I guess we could call this request for spoon feeding but even if I read it all, I don't feel I'd have an adequate background to form conclusions beyond basic logic (better than nothing but no sort of expertise - brings us back to the Youtuber stuff this thread discusses).

For EQ, I've never used it oddly. Other than DHB/Superdrol/Turinibol this is one of the few compounds I have no experience with. Sitting on 80ml of 300mg/ml. Would love to find a use but was free to me anyway. Might be a healthier add in to test/deca than low dose tren.
 
Would be interested in your take on Deca if you have one and are inclined to share. From what I've heard the study cited as problematic on brain issues excluded or minimized the presence of estradiol which provides neuroprotective properties - when compared to using testosterone this puts deca at a disadvantage in isolation but practically speaking if estradiol is present, as in most cycles, this wouldn't occur or at least to the same degree. If this line of thinking is correct we could extrapolate the particular deca findings to all non or minimally aromatizing compounds. Note that this is just the "bro" stuff I've heard on forums. No idea if any is right and didn't read the main deca source study which everyone is citing. I guess we could call this request for spoon feeding but even if I read it all, I don't feel I'd have an adequate background to form conclusions beyond basic logic (better than nothing but no sort of expertise - brings us back to the Youtuber stuff this thread discusses).

For EQ, I've never used it oddly. Other than DHB/Superdrol/Turinibol this is one of the few compounds I have no experience with. Sitting on 80ml of 300mg/ml. Would love to find a use but was free to me anyway. Might be a healthier add in to test/deca than low dose tren.
Sure, so there is actual human evidence with Deca that it increases dopamine metabolism (breakdown). There's rodent data that it decreases dopamine receptor number, alters gene transcripts of corticotropin releasing factor (CRF) & proopioelanocortin (POMC). Rodent data (often using nandrolone as the model compound) shows effects (broadly applicable to AAS generally) on the dopaminergic as well as the serotonergic systems, GABA, and glutamate systems.

However, I take all rodent data with a massive grain of salt with respect to demonstrating any meaningful psychological harms of AAS in man. It's important to note that Deca is used as the model compound in most of the research on psychological harms of AAS; but it does not follow that it is therefore particularly harmful in any regard. But we do see that it increases dopamine metabolism in man, and this is NOT seen with testosterone. All AAS cross the blood-brain barrier.

The thinking that estradiol impacts the cognitive effects of AAS has some logic: however,
assuming that differential impacts on cognition may originate from differences in the biologically active metabolites, consider that high testosterone enanthate (300mg) producing by far the greatest change in estrogen concentration while not producing any change in HVA (a marker of dopamine metabolism) argues against a role for estrogen alone in dopaminergic activity of androgens. More likely is a dynamic interaction of changing concentrations of estrogen metabolites with nandrolone decanoate (half-life, 8 days) and its metabolite DHN that may be implicated in changes in the number of dopamine receptors that are dependent on the timing of exposure to estrogens and on the presence of other steroid hormones (this comes from Hruska, 1980; Fernandez-Ruiz, et al., 1989).
 
There is a lot of talk now that the EQ lowers the e2 level, but has anyone really noticed it?

I am not convinced by Derek's arguments from YT, after that the blood tests of the people he presented in the material were with high EQ and low testosterone. I have never heard of anyone having problems with too low estrogen using, for example, 1.2g test + 900mg EQ
Don't you love how compounds that have been in common use for almost 50 years are suddenly having all these new effects being discovered since the advent of youtube and reddit....................lol. I wonder what pharmaceutical riddles Tik Tok will unravel................
 
@LATS ....don't you just love when "bros" who don't even know what the victor black model of use is make up their own bastardised version of what he is saying!
Sorry.. just saw this. The idea " against" eq is simple from a risk versus reward .. many pros love eq.. but that does not mean they know the ins and outs of eq. I love Npp.. great gains.. but its not good for me from a side effect standpoint.. now if I were venturing for a pro card I'd suffer through and adapt the best I can.. but I'm not. I want gains but still want to have sex everyday.. life's full of choices. I choose sex everyday..
Eq is no different.. studies show certain risks attributed to eq.. some will justify the risks.. I simply know there is other options out there that will benefit me without taking as big a risk.
So no one is telling you not to take eq.. we are simply saying for 99 percent of you there is compounds out there with less risk versus reward.. if eq is good to you and you want to compete at a high level then there are choices to make.. but for the vast majority eq is not needed and can easily be replaced .. simple..
 

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