Peck Tare

weight77 · Mar 7, 2004

Well it finally went yesterday, I was just screwing around with a buddy of mine and went to put him in a head lock and I heard the tendon crack. I got up and thought I had just dislocated my shoulder again, but when I held up my arm there was a large piece missing right in the edge of the shoulder and peck intersection. Went to the ER and they said it was a tare and that they could do nothing. I have to go to my doc on monday and see what I can do. I pretty sure he will tell me the same thing that the er doc told me, which was just rest it and it will heal over time. That may be true but then I am going to have a disformed peck muscle. I am going to opt to have the procedure in hopes that they will be able to replace everything just as it was. The bad thing is I have allready been out of the gym for over 3 weeks, because it was sprained in the first place. I just wish it would have been a tare from day one.

If anybody has had this happen to them please reply and let me know how it tured out. I just hope that this is not going to ruin my peck shape.

Omne · Mar 7, 2004

It's hard to say without knowing more. But it sounds like you have a partial tear, not a full tear. If you had a full tear, the muscle would detach from the insertion point totally, and it would snap back "roll up" just like a stretched cable that suddenly broke. Are you going to have an MRI done? That's probably the best way to estimate the amount and scope of damage.

Several pro's have had pec tears - sometimes it ends their careers, other times it doesn't. Tommi Thorvildsen had a pec tear, and he's still competing and doing damage on the scene.

The healing is not going to be a fast process, so you're going to have to be patient. And I'm sure your doctor will tell you no chest lifting - maybe no lifting at all - for several weeks. Then when you do start back, it'll be really light; rehab weights and lots of stretching. So you might be out of commission for several months - again, hard to know for sure, from your description and lack of information.

Use the time productively. Work on your posing routine. If you've ever wanted to take an extended trip to Mexico (or something like that) but you were afraid to be away from the workouts for that long, then this is your chance to go, guilt free (sort of).

Hope things work out for you, weight77. You gotta promising career as a pro, in my opinion.

PHIL HERNON · Mar 7, 2004

My advice

Take some time off, re evaluate yourself. Get off of everything and lift lighter for a while. You are just trying to force your body to do things that it probably should not be doing. Believe me, you want to be a normal functioning human being when you are 40 years old.

PHIL HERNON · Mar 7, 2004

Promising pro career?

A pro career is probably unrealistic. If you ever do turn pro, then you can compete against Coleman, Cormier, Jackson, etc... Everyone and their mother talks about turning pro and really only 1 or 2 guys are good enough to turn pro each year.THere are a lot of pros, how many of them would call their job fun or promising? It is a heart wrenching, lonely, isolated struggle that doesnt end until you see the big picture. Do this for fun, for yourself. DOnt take it too seriously, or it could ruin your life. Where has it gotten you thus far?

weight77 · Mar 7, 2004

Re: Promising pro career?

PHIL HERNON said:
A pro career is probably unrealistic. If you ever do turn pro, then you can compete against Coleman, Cormier, Jackson, etc... Everyone and their mother talks about turning pro and really only 1 or 2 guys are good enough to turn pro each year.THere are a lot of pros, how many of them would call their job fun or promising? It is a heart wrenching, lonely, isolated struggle that doesnt end until you see the big picture. Do this for fun, for yourself. DOnt take it too seriously, or it could ruin your life. Where has it gotten you thus far?

Phil, I hate you. LOL..But the things you say are so true. Training is my first love, there is nothing I would rather do than go to the gym and train. Yes, the reason I hurt myself in the first place was because I was pushing it too hard on the bench, but if this little mishap had not happened yesterday I was atcually going to start training again full today. But shit happens.

I appreciate what you said Omne, that type of stuff really brings my day up. BBing is all about structure (as phil pointed out to me) I do belive that I had a nice structure (not big bone and wide) but nice asthetic and had good muscle instertion. Who know what I am possible of doing maybe something maybe nothing, but the only way I will be able to find out is if I give it a try and not quit. I was going to start preping for junior nats but now that idea is scrapted. I am shooting for a state show in late august, so with a little luck I will be back in the gym in about 8 weeks from the day of the surgery.

By the way, I just got back from the gym, hit legs but with only 65% of my normal weight. It really made me feel a bit better just getting in the gym.

edge250 · Mar 7, 2004

i suffered the full pec tear, i had it surgically reattached but still have the bunched up look to my pec. it has been 2 years and although i will never go near a flat bench again i am stronger now than ever before and the pec has grown. while the injury itself wasnt that painful maybe cause i was in shock but let me tell ya the surgery about killed me. i was in a modified sling for about 2 months then 12 weeks of pt. the reconnection was so tight when i got my arm out of the sling my armed would not move from my side but slowly you gain flexibility back. when you gain back full flexibility you then start the restrenghtening process. i was using a hammer strength machine with no weight on it and could barely do it. now about a year and half later im moving 400 for reps on the same machine. it takes time do not push. if i could i would have used gh to increase the rate of healing but absolutely no steriod with it just gh. your looking to restrenghten the tendon and gear does nothing for that purpose. for me it was a learning experience like phil mention you were doing something to your body it wasnt excepting, reevaluate your training style, reps, sets, technique and excercise selection. personally i feel absolutely no one should flat bench press, dumbells yes, flat barbell no. it aint worth it

trunksy · Mar 8, 2004

Jeez. I just read last month that your training partner tore his bicep and now this month, you tear your chest up. You and your training buddies must be bummed.

What program are you guys doing in the gym? Do you cheat on your flat bench presses? I'll have to remember not to do it so I can stay injury free. Like Phil said, you want all of your parts working at 40yo. How old are you now?

Best of luck on finding information about getting your pec fixed and trying to make it look the way it did before.

Have you tried PM'ing MiniYates since it looks like he tore his pec too on the same day.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6540

You'll be able to exchange information that each of you has picked up so far.

There's also an old posts that pretty much says to get a second opinion to see if surgery is an option for you after you, possibly after you get an MRI?

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6025&highlight=pec+tear

I don't know if it will help with healing but xcelbeyond mentioned that glucosomine hcl and MSM might help with tendons:

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3921&highlight=pec+tear

There's actually a link to research paper in this thread:

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2512&highlight=pec+tear

I've seen pictures you posted of yourself from teen nationals and you looked good. I was hoping to see more of you in the future but like Phil said, it's all about doing it for yourself.

Heal quickly and let us know about your experience with healing. As mentioned, it's not uncommon for bodybuilders to have injuries so I think it'd be beneficial for everyone to know how to successfully bounce back from it, which, I'm sure you'll do with all the experienced lifters in here that'll cough up info from past experiences.

I know a few guys at the gym that don't train as hard now because they have a bad back but I never really grilled them about it since it's probably embarassing for them. Luckily, I haven't had any tears or back problems yet. Just a hernia. LOL.

weight77 · Mar 8, 2004

My training routine is pretty normal but I do go as heavy and as had as I can with low reps. It seems to work, I got to 240lbs in pretty good shape (2 months after I turend 20). The big mistake I made was trying to move up weight too fast. Guess it caught up with me. All that matters to me is that the operation can correct what is wrong. I am also going to have surgery (about 89% sure) on my other shoulder as well. I had dislocated it a few years back and the peck never grew right ever since. I think it is because it was slightly detached from the tendon. That was a long rehab ,3 months of no training, but I actually went to the gym everyday anyway and trained my good side every day as if nothing had happened. It just help keep my spirits up and when I came back full I trained the left side twice a week to make up for it. It seems stupid but the hardest part of any injury is staying positive and not getting depressed, and that helped me do that.

rippedboy · Mar 8, 2004

edge250 said:
i suffered the full pec tear, i had it surgically reattached but still have the bunched up look to my pec. it has been 2 years and although i will never go near a flat bench again i am stronger now than ever before and the pec has grown. while the injury itself wasnt that painful maybe cause i was in shock but let me tell ya the surgery about killed me. i was in a modified sling for about 2 months then 12 weeks of pt. the reconnection was so tight when i got my arm out of the sling my armed would not move from my side but slowly you gain flexibility back. when you gain back full flexibility you then start the restrenghtening process. i was using a hammer strength machine with no weight on it and could barely do it. now about a year and half later im moving 400 for reps on the same machine. it takes time do not push. if i could i would have used gh to increase the rate of healing but absolutely no steriod with it just gh. your looking to restrenghten the tendon and gear does nothing for that purpose. for me it was a learning experience like phil mention you were doing something to your body it wasnt excepting, reevaluate your training style, reps, sets, technique and excercise selection. personally i feel absolutely no one should flat bench press, dumbells yes, flat barbell no. it aint worth it

im just curious, why would dumbells be safer? i incline bench press and flat dumbell press and then do weighted dips for chest and thats it. i dont flat bench but is there a reason dumbells would make it safer?

Omne · Mar 8, 2004

See if you can do both surgeries at about the same time - you may as well get both of them over with. If you don't do them at the same time, then you'll need twice the recovery time. I mean, three months is three months - may as well be spending 3 months recovering from both surgeries, instead of 3 months for the shoulder, followed by another 3 months for the pec tear.

Another suggestion -- and take this with a grain of salt, depending on whether this would motivate you or bum you out -- you might want to take some pictures of yourself now, while you're still at your highest weight. Because after you finish rehab, you're going to be bummed about the lost weight and strength. So whenever you do finally start back to the gym hard-core, you can use the "before" photos to motivate yourself. I.e., you know you got up to 240 lbs before; there's no reason why you can't do it again. It really shouldn't take you long to re-gain the lost ground anyhow; muscle memory should shorten your re-bulking time considerably.

is "re-bulking" even a word?

Omne · Mar 8, 2004

Re: Re: Promising pro career?

weight77 said:
I appreciate what you said Omne, that type of stuff really brings my day up. BBing is all about structure (as phil pointed out to me) I do belive that I had a nice structure (not big bone and wide) but nice asthetic and had good muscle instertion. Who know what I am possible of doing maybe something maybe nothing, but the only way I will be able to find out is if I give it a try and not quit. I was going to start preping for junior nats but now that idea is scrapted. I am shooting for a state show in late august, so with a little luck I will be back in the gym in about 8 weeks from the day of the surgery.

Well, you should definitely listen to Phil long before you listen to a nobody like me, that's for sure.

Phil's got a prestigious record and a lot of common sense to boot. And at 40 years old, he looks better than damn near any 20 year old out there.

Warning - personal opinions ahead. I think your structure is solid, weight77. You're not built like a power-bodybuilder like Phil or like Mike Francois - both of whom I think were beasts and phenomenal bodybuilders. Instead, you kinda remind me of someone like Dennis Newman in his early days. Dennis had excellent shape and great size, especially in the fullness of his shoulders. But he wasn't thick-waisted, so the visual effect of his v-taper was tremendous. It's just a shame that he got de-railed by the leukemia and all.

weight77 · Mar 8, 2004

thanks omne, and yes I would have both them done at the same time. That is the only reason I would even have the shoulder fixed, if I am gonna be down anyway. I have some pix of myself taken about 3 weeks ago at around 244-246, I did not post them because all the weight after 240 (the pics I posted) is just pretty much fat and water. So not worth posting. I am going to come clean and will see how I do with that. I assume if I keep my cals high I can stay around 210lbs, maybe lower but I am still gonna keep training my legs. I'll post more tomorrow after I get back from the doc.

Omne · Mar 8, 2004

A lot of the frustration right now is caused by just not knowing what the problem is, or how severe it is. Seeing the doctor is gonna help you clear up a lot of that frustration, and it's gonna allow you to get some kind of attack plan together for how to deal with this. Once you have a plan, then you'll feel like you're back in control again.

You posted pics at 240? I guess I must have missed them. Anyhow, good luck with the doc tomorrow.

Conan21 · Mar 8, 2004

sorry to hear bro

Hope everything goes well in the surgery

MiniYates · Mar 8, 2004

Weight77

I also tore my pec (the right one) just awhile ago. I had partitial tear. It´s a piece of the lower pectoral muscle that got torn. It does´nt look too bad and won´t keep me away for that long. If it is partitial you should be able to lift in a matter of days/week. To get some blood in there will only fastening the healing process anyway. Just go with light weight and don´t do anything that hurts.

My injury was two strains over two workouts. I always do Incline benches first, but this day some farmer dude used it - so I went for flat benches instead. Bad move, cause I strained it. The workout after I tore my pec basicly when warming up on the hammar machine after some preexhaustion in the pec deck.

I´ve been able to work out lightly and don´t feel any pain when doing Inclines. Some docs tell you to rest, but it´s always better to work out, just don´t push it.

I´ve been of gear since August and just had some bad luck there. Luckily we have a full body minus one pec (and shoulder for you) to work at for now.

weight77 · Mar 8, 2004

Mini, I don't know how you were able to keep working out, well I guess a partial tear would not be that bad. Mine is hurting so bad I can barley type, I can't cut my food and pretty much anything that involves two hands is a pain for me. I had the second degree sprain in my infra spranatious myo tendo unit which is a little band that runs across my pec and into my shoulder. I think that may be what I tore becaues my shoulder is in alot of pain. The pain is all the way down in the palm of my hand. Also it is not the upper part that has rolled it is the bottom that was rolled. It is pretty swollen right now and it is hard for me to know what is really going on, I know that in the corner of my arm there is only tendon and no muscle. There is no bleeding,(has been around 36 hours since it happened) which in my mind is weird, since when there is a tare the body will rush blood to the area to help the healing. I thought I would be able to see my doctor today, but my mom called my today and said that Monday is the day he is in surgery so he is not back in the office until tuesday. I am sure he won't know exactly what it is and I am gonna have to have another MRI. (2 times in 2 weeks)

MiniYates · Mar 8, 2004

That sounds intense bro, hang in there. Mine only hurt when in flexed position and for just a few days.
But you have not bruised up? I did bruise, had 4 penny like looking marks around my attachment.
It sounds very much that your injury is in the tendon of the muscle and that mine is inside. I really did´nt think that I tore it at first, since the pain was´nt so severe and went away rather quick. The roll-up of the muscle tells it much better though.
A friend of mine tore both his pecs, on diffrent occasions. The first was like mine and he could even train the next day again. It could never be repaired though. His second one was more like yours and that one he had operated, and it looks quite good now. Hopefully the doc can so something about it.
Later

JETHRO TULL · Mar 9, 2004

Weight 77.....I tore my bicep and had it repaired!

I went in to the ER and they told me the same thing...just rest it...Luckily I had read about injuries and had a fellow powerlifter tear his bicep on a deadlift. I drove to a different hospital that same early morning. The difference was....there was an orthopedic surgeon on call. He use to work with the SanDiego Chargers. He did the surgury....the bicep ended up looking better than it did prior to surgury. If I had listened to the first doc...I would have ended up with a deformed weak bicep. I'd get the pec fixed.

weight77 · Mar 9, 2004

Just got back form the doctor. He told me I tore my pec major but no tendon. So I just tore the muscle out of the instertion place. So it was pretty much all bad news. He told me he would rather not try and reattach it because he did not know how sucessful it would be. I am going to see one more doc here where I live and then my parents are going to start looking for clinics out of state. The first place I am going to try is the same clinic in maryland the Kevin went to.

On a good not. I tore my pec in a position that left most of it intact. So instead of my arm being back behind me or something like that it was infront of me in a ball so there was not much stretching.

Jethro where is that doc you went to located at. My parents said they would do everything in there power to get this fixed. So I am happy that they are not just looking at this as a total loss. Also the doc told me that when the pain went away that I could start training again. If you guys know any good clinics or doctors please let me know.thanks.