Point of diminishing returns by drug

[ALLEX]

Individually or combined. In your experience, what are some of the points of diminishing returns of each drug or drug protocol you've ever used?

Example:

- Test cyp by itself: 600mg
- Test cyp with deca: 800mg
- Test cyp with HGH 1g

And so on...

You can also include natural substances, fat burners or whatever you have used in the past.

 

[epoxy]

I've only done "higher" doses with some orals, but I think that Anavar above 80-100mg and Anadrol above 150mg are both definitely points of diminishing returns. I've run Anavar @ 150 and Anadrol @ 200 and saw nothing but more sides versus the lower doses.

 

[Marky Boy]

I've only done "higher" doses with some orals, but I think that Anavar above 80-100mg and Anadrol above 150mg are both definitely points of diminishing returns. I've run Anavar @ 150 and Anadrol @ 200 and saw nothing but more sides versus the lower doses.

What's your higher doses

 

[asteelz]

From my experience these are a few that I have noted.

trenbolone at 700 mg was no better than 500mg, only more sides.

Testosterone seems to only get better each time I increase it.

Winstrol at 50 mg is the same as 100 and even 150.

Superdrol 20mg tops, 30 + just adds more sides

 

[MisterB]

it's personals and varies per individual i'm sure but for me test over 750 just made me feel off, i tolerate 700 really well, but at 1000 i get emotional even with AI

tren over 100 mg a day, dont see any benefits

anavar over 80 mg

winny over 100 mg

Nandrolone for me over 600

primo over 800 didnt see a difference at 900

anadrol seems to be great at low doses, 25-50 , over that its a waiste on me

 

[ALLEX]

Very interesting. Thanks guys...

I don't have much experience nor have tried many different drugs.

Test E. above 600mg only brought more bloat and felt a bit unhealthy.
Organon sustanon up to 750mg was really, really good.
EQ above 800mg got me really anxious.
Human grade deca 400mg is great, more than that, not sure.
Human grade drol (hemogenin) at 50mg seems fine. Tried 100mg once and lost appetite.
Phera Plex was optimal at 20mg ED. 30mg brings more size but the sides are weird.
Clenbuterol at the lowest common dose was too much for me.
I only experimented with Saizen HGH years ago at 4iu. Felt great.

 

[Cito33189]

Havent really noticed anything yet. Only one drug I noticed is Anavar. 50mg -100mg no difference.

Other than that The more I have taken the bigger or harder ive gotten.

I just cant afford to take a mega dose so I haven't.

If I could id like to try
1500-2000mg. test
1200 mg. eq
1000 mg. Masteron

8 iu of GH

 

[alfresco]

I have said this before . . .

Paracelsus, sometimes called the father of toxicology, wrote:
"All things are poison and nothing is without poison, only the dose permits something not to be poisonous."

Or . . . more commonly, the dose makes the poison. That is to say, substances considered toxic are harmless
in small doses, and conversely an ordinarily harmless substance can be deadly if over-consumed.

Simply put, in my words . . . it pays to look before you leap.

But then again, I am reminded of a quote which says that you will never know how much is enough until you
have had too much.

Good subject Allex with not enough traffic.

 

[epoxy]

What's your higher doses

1050mg of tren ace a week, bumped up from 700mg for about 3-4 weeks....would say it was not worth it.

 

[Thebigone]

For me personally anything over 600 mg test just causes me to bloat and be lethargic.

600mg NPP did not give better gains than 400 mg just caused increased bloat.

75mg adrol produced more sides and not more gains than 50 mg.

Same thing with Dbol

On 500mg test with pharm grade Adex at .5mg everyday gave me the same E2 levels as every other day.

12.5mg pharm grade aromasin EOD increased my E2 levels 8 points vs pharm adex at .5mg EOD.

 

[GodOfHormones]

test 750
tren 700
deca 600
dbol 50
drol 150

 

[GodOfHormones]

Havent really noticed anything yet. Only one drug I noticed is Anavar. 50mg -100mg no difference.

Other than that The more I have taken the bigger or harder ive gotten.

I just cant afford to take a mega dose so I haven't.

If I could id like to try
1500-2000mg. test
1200 mg. eq
1000 mg. Masteron

8 iu of GH

More drugs isn't always the answer....
Eat more food and take half of your cycle

 

[Pericles]

I think 400mg of test and 200mg deca is plenty.

 

[dantes]

More drugs isn't always the answer....
Eat more food and take half of your cycle

Cito isnt exactly a newb I think he knows the value of food and the role of drugs.....

 

[dantes]

its hard to really find the point of diminshing returns with drugs cause generally more is better in terms of muscle mass. There is a point tho where the sides are so bad its no longer worth it which i guess could be called the point of diminishing returns.

tren 600 max...produces good results but sides are rough i actaully find tren ace to be highly effective as low as 150.

EQ 300....very low i know but anything higher and i get anxiety. 300 produces slows but steady gains for me. I dont use EQ as a staple mass builder just a little something extra to add to the cycle.

Adrol 50...past 50 the sides are heavy and i think insulin resistance is an issue with high adrol doses

masteron 300... near the end of prep 600 is resonable but generally anything past 300 i barelly notice a difference

test 1 gram... if using GH 2 grams

anavar 80 mg...the sides are harsh for me at this dose but the results are great

deca 600...anything higher mostly just bloats me more

 

[method2madness]

More drugs isn't always the answer....
Eat more food and take half of your cycle

Always good advice!

 

[kinglewy]

There is a thread in the articles section I recently read about Duchaine's theory about ultra high dosages causes growth at a level beyond that of the receptors through some other pathway. Which I found interesting because pushing test from 700wk to a gram a week then to 1500 a week I got diminishing returns...very little strength or size gain. Even throwing in 500 of this and 500 of that (mostly tren and mast) I still stayed pretty much the same.

Then experimented with what are to me pretty high dosages going to 4+ grams a week and exploded with new growth....this was roughly 3 years or so ago. The breakdown was basically 2100 mg test, 1 gram tren, 1400mg eq and about 50-100 anadrol a day. i was the heaviest and strongest id ever been (225 with top 4 abs still defined).

Quit after about 8 weeks couldn't handle the lethargy...was a walking zombie even falling asleep on the job site at times. Every joint and tendon in my body ached from getting strong too fast, out of breath all the time.

So I think diminishing returns apply to a point untill one pushes the doses very high....guys always say "when the magic happens"....maybe that relates to what Duchaine was referring to in his theory.

 

[Cito33189]

More drugs isn't always the answer....
Eat more food and take half of your cycle

I just have yet to experience a dose where I have not noticed any additional effect.
Maybe at the doses I outlined would be to much and have no additional benefit. Those were just some hormones and doses I find some day I would like to try and see what happens.

And thank you for the advice.

Obviously you have to eat to grow. I remember I would gorge myself with food. starting at 19 to say 23 I just ate as much as I could of whatever I could. I would say when your younger that might work. But now I don't even think its how much its what you put in your body. like if I were to eat 10 ounces of meat at each serving that's way to much for my body to metabolize. I would just be in the bathroom and waisting money.

6-8 ounces seems just like the perfect amount for me. I notice my body really started growing when I followed more of Palumbos principals. adding almonds or cashews. I love avacodos once I added these fats. all natural peanut butter then my body really took on the look I wanted

 

[Beta]

I just have yet to experience a dose where I have not noticed any additional effect.
Maybe at the doses I outlined would be to much and have no additional benefit. Those were just some hormones and doses I find some day I would like to try and see what happens.

And thank you for the advice.

Obviously you have to eat to grow. I remember I would gorge myself with food. starting at 19 to say 23 I just ate as much as I could of whatever I could. I would say when your younger that might work. But now I don't even think its how much its what you put in your body. like if I were to eat 10 ounces of meat at each serving that's way to much for my body to metabolize. I would just be in the bathroom and waisting money.

6-8 ounces seems just like the perfect amount for me. I notice my body really started growing when I followed more of Palumbos principals. adding almonds or cashews. I love avacodos once I added these fats. all natural peanut butter then my body really took on the look I wanted

My body and overall digestion is much better looking and feeling on moderate carbs and much higher fat (same calories)

 

[need4tren]

Test- been up to 3g. No diminishing returns yet. Haven't ran this dose in awhile but it's coming back up.
Tren- been up to 2100 of ace a day. Insane results. Changes everyday. Haven't gone higher
Deca-been up to 1g. Didn't notice any difference from 600
Npp-600 is all i need. Saw no more from 800 of it.
Eq- up to 3g I have tried. Probably best I looked ever. No sex drive at all tho.
Anadrol-been up to 300 a day. Kept getting better the more I took. No side effects. I just kept getting more full and more veiny. Slowly worked my way up. 100-150 stayed at 150 for awhile then went to 200 then right to 300.
Superdrol 20-30 was the best a few years ago. Tried 30 now. Got nothing much outta it. Went to 60. Got nothing outta it. Compared to years ago
Anavar-been up to 150 loved it.
Winstrol been up to 150. I like it best at 50-75 a day
Halo-80 a day high as I went and love it.
Dbol-60mg i haven't ran dbol in years. I hate the drug.
Mast-350 prop or 400 enth. Ran up to a gram and anything over 400 flattens me out
Primo- ran 1g loved it but it gets out shined to easy
Proviron-100 a day is good. 50 a day for every day use
Cialas-25mg a day is all u need
M1t-30mg a day
Methyltren- 2g is amazing drug.