Popeye arm injury?

[BigDaddy_554]

Why wait?

Why wait for an MRI if it is obviously ruptured? I had this same injury and my doc didn't order an MRI because it was obvious. We merely scheduled the surgery. If I recall properly this has to be reattached with in 7 days or the recovery percentage diminishes drastically. I barely made the 7th day and I was we scheduled the day after it happened.

You will be out of pocket for a while with the recovery and every after my surgery there is still a difference in the shape of my biceps near the insertion into the shoulder. It looks much better than if I hadn't had surgery and my strength/endurance is only a 2-3% less in that bi.

If you merely tore the facia that is different.

 

[muscle96ss]

Wow, you have enough opinions here to confuse and scare the hell out of you. I think the first thing is to find out what the actual injury is before you jump to any conclusions. If it is something that requires surgery you still have time, trust me, an experienced ortho doc can do the repair even a few months down the road. Once you know the extent of the injury, if it does turn out to need surgery please spend the time to find a highly qualified doc who has experience with athletes and that particular surgery. Lastly, talk to the doc who caused all of this and make sure you are fairly compensated.

 

[maldorf]

I'm pretty sure he is talking about a full detachment of the biceps tendon from the bone. It is VERY common for doctors to NOT recommend surgery for this, I know this sounds amazing, but it's true.

.

Wow, it is hard to believe that a doc would recommend that especially if the patient is actively involved in bodybuilding. I'm hoping for Concrete's sake that it was just the fascial covering around the tendon and not the tendon itself that he tore.
Hopefully an MRI will be ordered soon to get confirmation on what the hell happened.

 

[concreteguy]

Wow, it is hard to believe that a doc would recommend that especially if the patient is actively involved in bodybuilding. I'm hoping for Concrete's sake that it was just the fascial covering around the tendon and not the tendon itself that he tore.
Hopefully an MRI will be ordered soon to get confirmation on what the hell happened.

This Monday at 3:00pm I'm having the MRI done.

Question: What protocol's tend to bring on tendon ruptures? To much of this? Not enough of that? Over the last year I have had three different types of muscle failure/partial tares. The first two from deadlifting. Assuming the proper form is being done for the exercise. Could it just be the muscles growing faster than tendons? This is what I have always heard is the cause. Is there a type of protocol that is known to do this? Could I be inadvertently inviting these types of injuries buy doing supps incorrectly??

 

[thebrick]

well...

This Monday at 3:00pm I'm having the MRI done.

Question: What protocol's tend to bring on tendon ruptures? To much of this? Not enough of that? Over the last year I have had three different types of muscle failure/partial tares. The first two from deadlifting. Assuming the proper form is being done for the exercise. Could it just be the muscles growing faster than tendons? This is what I have always heard is the cause. Is there a type of protocol that is known to do this? Could I be inadvertently inviting these types of injuries buy doing supps incorrectly??

I have had my share on tendon tears myself. I have had a partial tear in my left shoulder supraspinatus, a partial tear in my right bicep near the elbow and complete bilateral ruptures in my quad/patella tendons. All of these occurring when I entered my 50's. Looking back, in each case, there were warning signs, but I ignored these and "trained through it". Big mistake on my part. Also, add the super supplements and we are pushing our performance well beyond what is "normal". Now, add the unknown factor of how much some supplements degrade collagen synthesis over time and how some supplements supposedly counteract that process. So, that says to me, its one step back and one step forward on the collagen synthesis, but we are still working the muscle at 150% of "normal"? That still spells overload. Also, there's no doubt that supplements will "mask" what's really going in in there. Let's face it, time in the gym feels great while "on", then come off and damn that shoulder hurts! Right? You are smart to step back and question everything. I'm usually too stubborn.

I sincerely hope it all looks OK for you because I know you love to train, like I do.

 

[maldorf]

I have had my share on tendon tears myself. I have had a partial tear in my left shoulder supraspinatus, a partial tear in my right bicep near the elbow and complete bilateral ruptures in my quad/patella tendons. All of these occurring when I entered my 50's. Looking back, in each case, there were warning signs, but I ignored these and "trained through it". Big mistake on my part. Also, add the super supplements and we are pushing our performance well beyond what is "normal". Now, add the unknown factor of how much some supplements degrade collagen synthesis over time and how some supplements supposedly counteract that process. So, that says to me, its one step back and one step forward on the collagen synthesis, but we are still working the muscle at 150% of "normal"? That still spells overload. Also, there's no doubt that supplements will "mask" what's really going in in there. Let's face it, time in the gym feels great while "on", then come off and damn that shoulder hurts! Right? You are smart to step back and question everything. I'm usually too stubborn.

I sincerely hope it all looks OK for you because I know you love to train, like I do.

Good post. Thats how I feel about the problem too. You can really feel those aches and pains when you get off. I do think that sometimes when you put on strength really fast and start pushing heavier weights too fast it can cause these problems. I know the times when I had my tendon problems it was either because I increased the weight too fast over time or that I lifted heavy for too many consecutive workouts. I think between doing periodization with planned intense perioids/periods to down train and being sure to slowly increase resistance over a longer period of time you can avoid a lot of these injuries. I know that sometimes when I would go on a cycle I would have to hold myself back and let the reps get a little higher than I liked to avoid going too heavy too fast. The times when I would go with the flow and keep lifting heavier weights with each workout I usually ended up tearing something.

 

[maldorf]

This Monday at 3:00pm I'm having the MRI done.

Good luck. Let us know what the verdict is.

 

[concreteguy]

Good post. Thats how I feel about the problem too. You can really feel those aches and pains when you get off. I do think that sometimes when you put on strength really fast and start pushing heavier weights too fast it can cause these problems. I know the times when I had my tendon problems it was either because I increased the weight too fast over time or that I lifted heavy for too many consecutive workouts. I think between doing periodization with planned intense perioids/periods to down train and being sure to slowly increase resistance over a longer period of time you can avoid a lot of these injuries. I know that sometimes when I would go on a cycle I would have to hold myself back and let the reps get a little higher than I liked to avoid going too heavy too fast. The times when I would go with the flow and keep lifting heavier weights with each workout I usually ended up tearing something.

Maldorf, Brick, I really appreciate your feed back! I'm such a fucking block head when it comes to training. I keep putting on the weight and just training through the pain. I go home at night and I'm fucking paralyzed. There are times my knees hurt so bad my wife has to help me up off the sofa.
I'm thinking that I must of had some kind of tear previously for something like this to happen. There are times when my shoulders are killing me after training them.
I think I'm going to just go to a modified type of FST7, just do multiple sets in a row and get a sick mega pump going. Do you think you can grow doing this? If all things are in check?

 

[maldorf]

Maldorf, Brick, I really appreciate your feed back! I'm such a fucking block head when it comes to training. I keep putting on the weight and just training through the pain. I go home at night and I'm fucking paralyzed. There are times my knees hurt so bad my wife has to help me up off the sofa.
I'm thinking that I must of had some kind of tear previously for something like this to happen. There are times when my shoulders are killing me after training them.
I think I'm going to just go to a modified type of FST7, just do multiple sets in a row and get a sick mega pump going. Do you think you can grow doing this? If all things are in check?

I think you have to do some of your lifting plans by feel and instinct. You know when youre knees are killing you, when your shoulder feels like its going to fall off. When those symptoms arise it is time to lessen the load and go with some more volume IMO. I would try higher reps and add in things like drop sets or Phil's staggered reps would be awesome while using a lighter weight than normal. How light? Well to know that youll have to experiment and find a weight that causes no pain while lifting and also no extreme pain 24 hours later. Sometimes just making the weight lighter isnt enough and youll have to change exercises completely. Sometimes not training to failure is also needed. Sometimes you have to detrain for awhile. Dont be afraid to use the lighter weights for awhile. When you come back from your detrain you will be stronger, more enthusiastic, and ready to grow again.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

WOW........

Read what I wrote 4 months ago about this!!!

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...hing-i-have-learned-promuscle.html#post833238

 

[concreteguy]

So now your rewriting previous posts?

Read what I wrote 4 months ago about this!!!

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...hing-i-have-learned-promuscle.html#post833238

Phil, did it EVER cross your mind to try and help? If you had an injury I wouldn't be making jokes about it. I think it's in poor taste.

BTW: Phil, I was the one that showed you how to change copied posts.

 

[The Dude]

Don't beat yourself up over the injury. They happen when you train at this level and for an extended period of time. The best you can hope to do is minimize them. When I have sore joints and tendons I use ultrasound and DMSO. I also train in a way that I have no pain. I do around 20 reps on everything now as I've come to the realization that my connective tissues simply aren't capable of handling the weights my muscles are. I also pre exhaust most bodyparts. I've continued to gain with this approach and have had far fewer injuries and when I do get injured it's simply a minor strain.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

Phil, did it EVER cross your mind to try and help? If you had an injury I wouldn't be making jokes about it. I think it's in poor taste.

BTW: Phil, I was the one that showed you how to change copied posts.

Of course........PM me with anything........I hope I can help

 

[thebrick]

I'm thinking that I must of had some kind of tear previously for something like this to happen. There are times when my shoulders are killing me after training them.

Concrete, that's what my surgeon told me after my bilateral quad ruptures. He felt I had, as he called them, "micro-tears" in the petalla tendons until they had enough and that day day came when I heard that muffled "pop" and I dropped to the ground like dead weight. He asked me if I was using anabolics because he said there was research that indicated that this weakened tendons and my injury was so rare (I denied it). But, I will tell you, I remember my knee pain being terrible ALL the time before that accident happened. It hurt like hell to sit for any length of time, it hurt to get up from a chair, it hurt to walk down stairs, it hurt to squat. I should have listened to the signs, but I kept pushing instead. Was it stupidity on my part? …too much enthusiasm to be in the gym? … me being stubborn? or me in denial? I think it was all of those.

 

[thebrick]

This Monday at 3:00pm I'm having the MRI done.

hey Concrete, when you get the results of the MRI, give us an update.

 

[concreteguy]

GOOD NEWS

hey Concrete, when you get the results of the MRI, give us an update.

I got the MRI done last night and just left my (sports injuries) Ortho's office an hour ago. He told me yes I have an outer proximal bi rupture and no I do not need it repaired. He told me if I were a pro football player and was sitting in front of him he would tell him he is back on the field tonight. My left bi dose look different from the right. But in a much better way. I know this is hard to believe but it looks better than my right. ( install your cheep shot here Phil). I asked him if it will atrophy into looking like shit and he said it may change a little but if I train it it will keep it's size and new shape. I asked him if I'm more prone to brake the inner tie in at the shoulder and he answered. "if you do we will write you up in the New England Journal of Medicine, because you will be the first." He said the only time he has seen that injury is from tramma to the area. I asked "even with an injury like this preexisting?" he said "YES"! He also told me reconnecting doesn't guarantee that your exact original shape will be returned and the recovery is 4 to six months to go back to full tilt training. At my age (50) I don't have that kind of time and lets face it, this is about having fun. I don't have my head in the clouds with my expectations. The idea of going though a surgery and up to six month rehab for something that he is telling me isn't going to effect my motion in any way and my strength buy less than 10 % doesn't sound fun.

As Phil will gladly remind you all, my body is a LLOOOONNNGGG way from perfect.LOL Now it a little farther away. Dr said I can go in and train Bis tonight and that's what I'm going to do!

 

[BigDaddy_554]

Long Head?

So, it sounds like you ruptured the proximal biceps tendon of the long head? Is that correct?

 

[concreteguy]

So, it sounds like you ruptured the proximal biceps tendon of the long head? Is that correct?

Yes. It let go about where the left diagram has the line pointing to it.

 

[thebrick]

Hot damn! Glad to hear that!

I got the MRI done last night and just left my (sports injuries) Ortho's office an hour ago. He told me yes I have an outer proximal bi rupture and no I do not need it repaired. He told me if I were a pro football player and was sitting in front of him he would tell him he is back on the field tonight. My left bi dose look different from the right. But in a much better way. I know this is hard to believe but it looks better than my right. ( install your cheep shot here Phil). I asked him if it will atrophy into looking like shit and he said it may change a little but if I train it it will keep it's size and new shape. I asked him if I'm more prone to brake the inner tie in at the shoulder and he answered. "if you do we will write you up in the New England Journal of Medicine, because you will be the first." He said the only time he has seen that injury is from tramma to the area. I asked "even with an injury like this preexisting?" he said "YES"! He also told me reconnecting doesn't guarantee that your exact original shape will be returned and the recovery is 4 to six months to go back to full tilt training. At my age (50) I don't have that kind of time and lets face it, this is about having fun. I don't have my head in the clouds with my expectations. The idea of going though a surgery and up to six month rehab for something that he is telling me isn't going to effect my motion in any way and my strength buy less than 10 % doesn't sound fun.

As Phil will gladly remind you all, my body is a LLOOOONNNGGG way from perfect.LOL Now it a little farther away. Dr said I can go in and train Bis tonight and that's what I'm going to do!

 

[Kaladryn]

I got the MRI done last night and just left my (sports injuries) Ortho's office an hour ago. He told me yes I have an outer proximal bi rupture and no I do not need it repaired. He told me if I were a pro football player and was sitting in front of him he would tell him he is back on the field tonight. My left bi dose look different from the right. But in a much better way. I know this is hard to believe but it looks better than my right. ( install your cheep shot here Phil). I asked him if it will atrophy into looking like shit and he said it may change a little but if I train it it will keep it's size and new shape. I asked him if I'm more prone to brake the inner tie in at the shoulder and he answered. "if you do we will write you up in the New England Journal of Medicine, because you will be the first." He said the only time he has seen that injury is from tramma to the area. I asked "even with an injury like this preexisting?" he said "YES"! He also told me reconnecting doesn't guarantee that your exact original shape will be returned and the recovery is 4 to six months to go back to full tilt training. At my age (50) I don't have that kind of time and lets face it, this is about having fun. I don't have my head in the clouds with my expectations. The idea of going though a surgery and up to six month rehab for something that he is telling me isn't going to effect my motion in any way and my strength buy less than 10 % doesn't sound fun.

As Phil will gladly remind you all, my body is a LLOOOONNNGGG way from perfect.LOL Now it a little farther away. Dr said I can go in and train Bis tonight and that's what I'm going to do!

Over time it will effect your elbow and your shoulder. I'd definitely have it repaired, it's a simple fix for a good doc. As I stated above, it USED to be the norm not to repair that injury, now it is the norm to repair it. Get a second opinion.

And the rehab is a FULL year, not 6 months, all tendon rupture repairs are around a full year. Even then it will only be 80-90%, probably 1.5 years for 100%.