Rapid fat loss

ripriot · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
Your thermic effect of food is a factor but it doesn’t make much difference on weight loss.
Just like Non-exercise activity thermogenesis (NEAT) , how much of a difference would it make

How does that prove protein is irrelevant? At what point does the deficit become unhealthy?

your type 2 diabetes study doesn’t really make sense. We are talking about healthy individuals that live active lives. Not sedentary diabetes patients.

N.L....M..... · Jul 17, 2021

Effect of protein overfeeding on energy expenditure measured in a metabolic chamber - PubMed

Excess energy, as fat, does not acutely increase 24EE, which rises slowly as body weight increases. Excess energy as protein acutely stimulates 24EE and SleepEE. The strongest relation with change in 24EE was the change in energy expenditure in tissue other than muscle or fat-free mass.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

beastmode121 · Jul 17, 2021

ripriot said:
How does that prove protein is irrelevant? At what point does the deficit become unhealthy?

your type 2 diabetes study doesn’t really make sense. We are talking about healthy individuals that live active lives. Not sedentary diabetes patients.

no Wer not; Wer talking about juice heads who follow high protein diets; find a study about juice heads with high protein diets. Atleast diabetic patients are out of shape and are the perfect example and test subjects. Not bodybuilders with grams of gear

beastmode121 · Jul 17, 2021

N.L....M..... said:
Effect of protein overfeeding on energy expenditure measured in a metabolic chamber - PubMed

Excess energy, as fat, does not acutely increase 24EE, which rises slowly as body weight increases. Excess energy as protein acutely stimulates 24EE and SleepEE. The strongest relation with change in 24EE was the change in energy expenditure in tissue other than muscle or fat-free mass.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Lol you quote studies you don’t read. Atleast read the abstract

Background: Energy expenditure (EE) increases with overfeeding, but it is unclear how rapidly this is related to changes in body composition, increased body weight, or diet.

“UNCLEAR HOW RAPIDLY THIS IS RELATED TO CHANGED IN BODY COMPOSITION.”

no one is arguing the thermic effect of protein

b-boy · Jul 17, 2021

LOL, I made this thread to help some of you out, take the info and use it (very effective) or don't, I don't have the time and patience to argue my point with any of you, you can watch some Ted Naimen videos on YouTube about his P:E diet, if you wish to dig deeper into it.

ripriot · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
no Wer not; Wer talking about juice heads who follow high protein diets; find a study about juice heads with high protein diets. Atleast diabetic patients are out of shape and are the perfect example and test subjects. Not bodybuilders with grams of gear

Diabetics are not perfect examples. Answer the other questions. How is protein irrelevant?

FK86 · Jul 17, 2021

Protein as a source of glucose... - Muscle Mentor -

We cover a topic that is often overlooked in bodybuilding circles… Protein and what happens to the excess that we tend to consume on a bodybuilding diet.

musclementor.net

Dens228 · Jul 17, 2021

b-boy said:
LOL, I made this thread to help some of you out, take the info and use it (very effective) or don't, I don't have the time and patience to argue my point with any of you, you can watch some Ted Naimen videos on YouTube about his P:E diet, if you wish to dig deeper into it.

That's what A LOT of posts become......I took your post for what you meant and find that it has been quite accurate in my experience too. I'll let those that fixate on quoting studies regardless of their own experience battle it out. FWIW you can take pretty much any topic in the world and find studies supporting or contradicting your beliefs.

ripriot · Jul 17, 2021

Isn’t it a form of a ketosis diet? PSMF induces ketosis. So what is all the arguing about?

Matsuo Munefusa · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
I don’t agree with this. The larger your deficit is; the faster you lose fat, protein is irrelevant

But maintenance calories is a moving target dude. Depending on activity level, diet (macros and micros), super supps, etc. so you’re right and they’re right. You’re just forgetting that maintenance changes and therefore on same calories your deficit either shrinks or grows.

beastmode121 · Jul 17, 2021

Matsuo Munefusa said:
But maintenance calories is a moving target dude. Depending on activity level, diet (macros and micros), super supps, etc. so you’re right and they’re right. You’re just forgetting that maintenance changes and therefore on same calories your deficit either shrinks or grows.

I’m lost.. yes, the the more weight you lose; the more deficit you need. Is that what you’re trying to say?

Dens228 · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
I’m lost.. yes, the the more weight you lose; the more deficit you need. Is that what you’re trying to say?

No, he's saying your maintenance calorie amount varies from day to day. So many variables, was it leg day or arm day.........or rest day. Did you walk a lot at work or were you sitting today? Was it cold out or warm out? Were you running errands or watching tv? Were you pissed off about something for several hours or was it a very Zen like day? As you lose weight your calorie needs change but there are MANY more variables and it is constantly changing.
The "I weigh XXX so my maintenance level is XXXX is very misleading.

ripriot · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
I’m lost.. yes, the the more weight you lose; the more deficit you need. Is that what you’re trying to say?

That would be anorexia behaviors not fitness.

N.L....M..... · Jul 17, 2021

Dens228 said:
No, he's saying your maintenance calorie amount varies from day to day. So many variables, was it leg day or arm day.........or rest day. Did you walk a lot at work or were you sitting today? Was it cold out or warm out? Were you running errands or watching tv? Were you pissed off about something for several hours or was it a very Zen like day? As you lose weight your calorie needs change but there are MANY more variables and it is constantly changing.
The "I weigh XXX so my maintenance level is XXXX is very misleading.

So like if you lower carbs or fats and raise protein and you’re on something that increases protein synthesis?

beastmode121 · Jul 17, 2021

ripriot said:
That would be anorexia behaviors not fitness.

it’s called energy expenditure

beastmode121 · Jul 17, 2021

Dens228 said:
No, he's saying your maintenance calorie amount varies from day to day. So many variables, was it leg day or arm day.........or rest day. Did you walk a lot at work or were you sitting today? Was it cold out or warm out? Were you running errands or watching tv? Were you pissed off about something for several hours or was it a very Zen like day? As you lose weight your calorie needs change but there are MANY more variables and it is constantly changing.
The "I weigh XXX so my maintenance level is XXXX is very misleading.

Eh; that what ppl need to figure out BEFORE they figure out their maintenance calories.
It’s like you’re telling me my calorie deficit varies from day to day, then you’re setting yourself up to failure.

Dens228 · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
Eh; that what ppl need to figure out BEFORE they figure out their maintenance calories.
It’s like you’re telling me my calorie deficit varies from day to day, then you’re setting yourself up to failure.

No it's a baseline, that moves...........you should have a rough idea but it's not the be all end all.

Dens228 · Jul 17, 2021

N.L....M..... said:
So like if you lower carbs or fats and raise protein and you’re on something that increases protein synthesis?

I know that for me I can lower carbs and lose weight faster than any other way........as can most. I can eat more protein and be less hungry than if I just lower carbs and lose weight, I can lower calories overall to the same level and keep the percentages of each the same via lowering each macro and NOT lose weight as efficiently.

Dens228 · Jul 17, 2021

beastmode121 said:
Eh; that what ppl need to figure out BEFORE they figure out their maintenance calories.
It’s like you’re telling me my calorie deficit varies from day to day, then you’re setting yourself up to failure.

I can tell you that since the end of May I've lost 15 pounds on purpose. Activity level is pretty much the same as it always is, maybe more fishing though. I haven't counted a single calorie, I just lowered carbs and more lean protein so less fat. But I also added about 100 grams of protein a day via shakes and EAA's.

N.L....M..... · Jul 17, 2021

Dens228 said:
I know that for me I can lower carbs and lose weight faster than any other way........as can most. I can eat more protein and be less hungry than if I just lower carbs and lose weight, I can lower calories overall to the same level and keep the percentages of each the same via lowering each macro and NOT lose weight as efficiently.

Over my years of experimenting with different things one thing that is true for me is I can keep calories the same but lower other macros and raise protein I lose fat faster not just scale weight. I actually diet this way.
Ill lower cals over time until around 2400-2500 and not go any lower. What I’ll do then as fat loss stalls or to speed it up is lower carbs and fats and raise protein. I won’t lose a lot more weight as weight loss isn’t what I want even though it’s something that happens but I’ll lose fat quicker and quicker as I lower carbs and fats and raise protein.
I’ll eventually be on 2400-2500 calories of liquid egg whites and protein isolate.