replacing (part of) protein intake with EAAs?

[grandote]

Just a heads up, and something I have not seen mentioned in the thread, is to look into what eaas the supplement has and the amount of each of them in the product. Since the last year since BCAA supps were supposedly debunked and everybody jumped on to the eaa bandwagon I have seen numerous eaa supps pop up that dont even have all 9 of the essential amino acids in them. Some that do have all 9 have weird ratios of each. I have no idea what the best ratio of them should all be but prefer going with something like the new dymatize product which has a good amount of each of them in it.

Also, I remember reading somewhere that a study suggested taking the eaas closer to when you consumed food. For some reason it showed better results that way.

 

[qbkilla]

Are eaa considered to be superior and more cost effective than bcaa?

 

[Biggerp73]

my personal opinion, unless you are getting them tested yourself, I wouldn't trust supplements, thats just me. they are not regulated
.

There are plenty of supplement companies that voluntarily submit to third party testing and have the certificates to prove it.

It's one reason why I always prefer NOW supplements, because I know they are third party tested. Plus their EAA's are formulated in the exact ratio that is recommended by doctors for wound healing.

 

[Biggerp73]

Are eaa considered to be superior and more cost effective than bcaa?

They are generally more expensive than BCAA's but which one is to be preferred depends on the situation.. if you are already eating excess amounts of protein throughout the day such that your blood stream is always saturated with all the essential aminos, then EAA's probably won't do too much for you. BCAA, or specifically Leucine, might still be advantageous in that situation, however. Not so much as a building block but as a stimulus.

 

[qbkilla]

Good stuff. I plan on trying berkhans intermittent fasting protocol.

Fast, sip bcaa prior to lifting, train fasted at around 4pm, then begin eating after. I just prefer fasted training but I'm going to give the bcaa prior a shot.

Overall I will be in a slight surplus and looking to gain. Given this info, bcaa or eaa?

 

[danieltx]

Overall I will be in a slight surplus and looking to gain.

With a slight surplus, you're probably going to be disappointed with your gains whether you use BCAAs or EAAs.

 

[Biggerp73]

If training fasted i would 100% go with EAAs over BCAAs.

 

[qbkilla]

With a slight surplus, you're probably going to be disappointed with your gains whether you use BCAAs or EAAs.

You mean the bcaa and eaa will have no benefit to me or your saying your not a fan of slow lean gains?

 

[danieltx]

You mean the bcaa and eaa will have no benefit to me or your saying your not a fan of slow lean gains?

The slow, lean gains route usually leaves guys disappointed with the end results because they don't visibly improve their physique the way they thought they would.

Going for slow, lean gains often stems from a fear of getting fat / wanting to be ripped all year. There's nothing wrong with that approach but don't expect to end your gaining phase and / or diet down next time and get comments on how much bigger you are.

If you're truly looking for small gains that's cool, but most guys on here aren't - this is a hardcore bodybuilding forum. I hate seeing guys fall into the trap of slow, lean gains because it prevents them from reaching their potential.

If you want to add size that you notice and others notice, push the food (within reason, no need to lose all vascularity and be a slob), train your ass off, and supplement properly. Suffering and losing fat through a diet is easy compared to the work it takes to become a big guy.

And again, if small gains truly are your goal, there's nothing wrong with that. We're all crafting our own masterpieces.

 

[buzzbomb138]

Just a heads up, and something I have not seen mentioned in the thread, is to look into what eaas the supplement has and the amount of each of them in the product. Since the last year since BCAA supps were supposedly debunked and everybody jumped on to the eaa bandwagon I have seen numerous eaa supps pop up that dont even have all 9 of the essential amino acids in them. Some that do have all 9 have weird ratios of each. I have no idea what the best ratio of them should all be but prefer going with something like the new dymatize product which has a good amount of each of them in it.

Also, I remember reading somewhere that a study suggested taking the eaas closer to when you consumed food. For some reason it showed better results that way.

as stated earlier, ill be using true nutrition's EAAs so i doubt theyd be of low quality or in some kind of undesirable ratio.

as for your second comment, that has been my understanding too. i cant remember why exactly but i think it was the leucine spurs MPS and the body is less likely to use the aminos for gluconeogenesis if whole proteins are consumed soon after. consuming the EAAs 15-20 min before meals is what i read to reap the full benefits out of them.

 

[prodaf]

The slow, lean gains route usually leaves guys disappointed with the end results because they don't visibly improve their physique the way they thought they would.

Going for slow, lean gains often stems from a fear of getting fat / wanting to be ripped all year. There's nothing wrong with that approach but don't expect to end your gaining phase and / or diet down next time and get comments on how much bigger you are.

If you're truly looking for small gains that's cool, but most guys on here aren't - this is a hardcore bodybuilding forum. I hate seeing guys fall into the trap of slow, lean gains because it prevents them from reaching their potential.

If you want to add size that you notice and others notice, push the food (within reason, no need to lose all vascularity and be a slob), train your ass off, and supplement properly. Suffering and losing fat through a diet is easy compared to the work it takes to become a big guy.

And again, if small gains truly are your goal, there's nothing wrong with that. We're all crafting our own masterpieces.

100% agree

 

[qbkilla]

I was doing some research, Alan argon who seems to know his stuff says that bcaa and eaa are absolutely worthless and possibly counterproductive. Studies show that whey actually stimulates protein synthesis more....makes sense as it actually contains all the amines our body needs.

 

[Biggerp73]

I was doing some research, Alan argon who seems to know his stuff says that bcaa and eaa are absolutely worthless and possibly counterproductive. Studies show that whey actually stimulates protein synthesis more....makes sense as it actually contains all the amines our body needs.

The advantage of free form amino acids is that they bypass digestion and flood your blood stream within minutes. The is ideal when training in a fasted state or when you haven't had enough meals in your stomach to have your blood saturated with aminos. Even whey isolate is going to take quite some time to digest and will only release a relatively slow trickle into the blood stream compared to a large bolus of free form amino acids like with EAAs. Of course, this has a limited advantage because one can usually eat enough from meat proteins to keep the blood saturated, but for those of us who train in a basically fasted state the EAAs can be beneficial to elevate the level of blood aminos by bypassing digestion. I usually wake up, eat some chicken breast, and get to the gym and begin working out an hour later. That chicken breast won't really be feesing my blood substantial aminos until about the time my workout is ending, which is too late to prevent catabolism and promote anabolism *during* the workput. Which is why I drink EAAs during my first warm up set (and usually some dextrose too). BCAA on the other hand, are not beneficial in the sense of being used as metabolic building blocks, or protein sparing anti-catabolic nutrients, but more so can be beneficial as a stimuli for protein metabolism in general. And one can probably get the same result using Leucine alone (which is usually cheaper than BCAAs).

 

[buzzbomb138]

I was doing some research, Alan argon who seems to know his stuff says that bcaa and eaa are absolutely worthless and possibly counterproductive. Studies show that whey actually stimulates protein synthesis more....makes sense as it actually contains all the amines our body needs.

link plz?

 

[Elvia1023]

Guys need to just implement a plan and be consistent with it and see if it makes a difference. Too many overcomplicate this stuff and debate with themselves and don't end up doing anything or if they do they half arse it because they are in 2 minds the whole way through.

EAA's are superior to BCAA's. EAA's are BCAA's with the extra essential aminos so they are the same thing with extra. Although guys need to stop acting like bcaa's are bad. Yes they are inferior but they can still be useful in the right circumstances. Guys go on about throwing their money away but they do that with so many things in life.

Me personally I have noticed a good effect from taking in regular eaa's. As posted if you are eating solid/nutritious meals throughout the day you don't need to supplement. However for many they may not be hitting the meals they should be or their protein is low so adding eaa's will only benefit you in regards to muscle recovery/building. Yes whey protein is great as well and you could add that in through the day. However, many seem to have issues with whey but for the ones that don't you could use that instead. Literally just pick one of them and be consistent and then you can judge. Too many judge and they don't even try things or again they half arse it because they are in 2 minds and constantly looking for the best approach.

Right now I am dieting and I am not eating that much. I also train very hard so I have just started having eaa's again. I expect them to assist my goals and help me retain muscle as I diet. Plus I get bored drinking water and I love the taste of my eaa's so actually enjoy drinking them so it enables me to get the water/fluid intake I need as well. Here is what I ate the other day and if I stick with this I will only look better for it...

10g eaa's in water.
Chicken, asian vegetables and rice.
Intra (20g eaa's and 25g carbs).
Synthepure, oats, banana, mixed berries and almond milk.
10g eaa's in water.
Chicken, asian vegetables and rice.
10g eaa's in water.
Cottage cheese, grapes, blueberries and lemon juice.

Obviously everyone has different goals and approaches but just highlighting my current set up. The above is very easy for me to stick to and I enjoy eating/drinking this way.

 

[qbkilla]

link plz?

https://builtwithscience.com/bcaas-benefits/

I believe this was the one I read a few days ago.

 

[buzzbomb138]

I was doing some research, Alan argon who seems to know his stuff says that bcaa and eaa are absolutely worthless and possibly counterproductive. Studies show that whey actually stimulates protein synthesis more....makes sense as it actually contains all the amines our body needs.

https://builtwithscience.com/bcaas-benefits/

I believe this was the one I read a few days ago.

just skimmed it and it wasnt written by alan aragon. plus it was only about BCAAs, which i agree with the author about that.