Revamping my training, how did you know it was time to jump off of the high intensity, train, and go the higher volume route?

[jl9987]

Signs it was time:

• Frequent aches and pains, despite good technique
• Anxiety-inducing loads "having" to be used to progress in the weight x reps sense
• Gains in fullness & roundness not reflecting gains in strength, even in bodybuilding rep ranges
• Poor ratio of muscle-to-fat gain in a surplus, even while progressing in strength
• Coming close to a ceiling on strength...this one has some wiggle room, since you can technically keep adding load and / or reps...but you'll get to a point where you're using as much or more weight than guys who are bigger than you with similar frames.

Probably above all of those is the realization that, no, strength progressions are not the only way to add new muscle - that goes for both new contractile proteins and gains in sarcoplasm, fullness, whatever you want to call it. I think that the stronger you get, the more this is true. When you're only hack squatting 4-5pps for 8-10 reps using a normal ROM and rep tempo, 1-2pps with a fancy tempo, set / rep schemes, intensifiers, etc. might be a waste of time. But when you're handling impressive loads on every movement, scaling things back 20-50% and getting creative is still going to have you handling significant weights in a productive way.

As an aside, I'm extremely glad I've taken a paradigm shift in my training - much of which just involved listening to my wife (phenomenal physical therapist and coach, @danilamartinadpt). Had I just kept hammering away at progressive overload, I'd have probably assumed I likewise had to keep ramping up food and gear - neither of which is really going to improve my look when I'm already taking the "standard" SHW ~2g AAS + 10iu GH and eating 5-6k calories per day in the off-season. I really think we'll see more healthy huge guys if more of us look at training - BIG changes in training - as the variable that can move the needle (pun not intended, lol).

Another edit / aside - more volume in terms of work sets isn't necessarily the answer. It's often a part of this process, but for example I'm still doing 6-8 hard sets for quads per week, spread across leg press, hack, and leg extension. The change is in how I'm executing those sets, along with the use of different intensifiers from what I was using before. With other body parts, the total number of sets definitely is increasing. Just depends on where the needs are.

Dani is amazing!

 

[Duke309]

Any updates from the guys trying out the RP hypertrophy app?

 

[traininsane11]

Any updates from the guys trying out the RP hypertrophy app?

Love it.

I input my own programme into for reference

Pros:
Recommended weight progressions are so far are spot on (potential issue will list in cons)

Volume suggestions seem pretty spot on mind you I only ever follow it when it says do more sets not less cause more is better right

Cons:
It bases pretty much everything off a scaling RIR system which I don’t follow because I’m a man. So it goes down from like 3 RIR to I presume 0 over a set amount of weeks but I do 2-3 sets (out of 3) to failure or very close to failure so I’m expecting the weight jumps to exceed what I can do soon BUT you can change the weight and it will give you a target rep range so it’s not a massive issue

Probably overpriced for what it is but overall I am a fan

 

[Flocci]

Cons:
It bases pretty much everything off a scaling RIR system which I don’t follow because I’m a man.

i laughed out loud at that one

 

[Aikman56]

Love it.

I input my own programme into for reference

Pros:
Recommended weight progressions are so far are spot on (potential issue will list in cons)

Volume suggestions seem pretty spot on mind you I only ever follow it when it says do more sets not less cause more is better right

Cons:
It bases pretty much everything off a scaling RIR system which I don’t follow because I’m a man. So it goes down from like 3 RIR to I presume 0 over a set amount of weeks but I do 2-3 sets (out of 3) to failure or very close to failure so I’m expecting the weight jumps to exceed what I can do soon BUT you can change the weight and it will give you a target rep range so it’s not a massive issue

Probably overpriced for what it is but overall I am a fan

I’ve had the app since February ‘24. So that’s a little over a year and a half now, and I could not have said it better.

I would add that between the programming recommendations that you can pull from the app and alterations that can be made, along with all of the other cool little additions that they’ve made to make it more user-friendly, I really like it very much. Something pretty spectacular would have to come out for me to stop using this. I was a “pen and notebook“ guy from 1991 until I got this app, so when I find something I likeI tend to stick with it!

 

[traininsane11]

I’ve had the app since February ‘24. So that’s a little over a year and a half now, and I could not have said it better.

I would add that between the programming recommendations that you can pull from the app and alterations that can be made, along with all of the other cool little additions that they’ve made to make it more user-friendly, I really like it very much. Something pretty spectacular would have to come out for me to stop using this. I was a “pen and notebook“ guy from 1991 until I got this app, so when I find something I likeI tend to stick with it!

Very much the same! I think if your new it’s a brilliant tool to stop you just spinning your wheels for ages and teaches you in a very effective and easy to understand way the methods of progress within training

Aaaannd for people like me who overcook things and add to much weight/volume etc it keeps you on track and takes the guesswork and overthinking out of it

 

[qbkilla]

i laughed out loud at that one

Same, I feel like this quote should be on the front door of every gym lol

 

[Reporich]

I changed the high volume in my late 50s right after I got my third hernia surgery doctor told me I’d be coming back again if I didn’t make some changes so I did.

 

[Total1]

Love it.

I input my own programme into for reference

Pros:
Recommended weight progressions are so far are spot on (potential issue will list in cons)

Volume suggestions seem pretty spot on mind you I only ever follow it when it says do more sets not less cause more is better right

Cons:
It bases pretty much everything off a scaling RIR system which I don’t follow because I’m a man. So it goes down from like 3 RIR to I presume 0 over a set amount of weeks but I do 2-3 sets (out of 3) to failure or very close to failure so I’m expecting the weight jumps to exceed what I can do soon BUT you can change the weight and it will give you a target rep range so it’s not a massive issue

Probably overpriced for what it is but overall I am a fan

I literally do the same thing you do. The RIR is a waste on there for me as well.

 

[Josefein421]

I literally do the same thing you do. The RIR is a waste on there for me as well.

Are you guys really doing RP training if you arent following one of the key components... unless I am misunderstanding?

Sounds like saying 'I love DC training I just dont do rest pause sets."

 

[traininsane11]

Are you guys really doing RP training if you arent following one of the key components... unless I am misunderstanding?

Sounds like saying 'I love DC training I just dont do rest pause sets."

Speaking for myself - no probably not just using the app for weight progression and volume suggestions which I do find to be super useful.

Personally I think if you’re spending say 6 out of a 8 week programme multiple reps away from failure AND doing deloads unless you’re a freak of nature you’re not gonna make much progress

I also don’t think doing 1 week of taking things to failure requires a deload week it’s really not that taxing. I’ve done a full time manual job and I’ve taken every set to failure on 6x week programmes and I can tell you the manual job is way more taxing

I kinda get the feeling it’s made to cater to the wants of people who can’t really be arsed and it justifies it for you to make you feel better about not wanting to put effort in

 

[qbkilla]

Speaking for myself - no probably not just using the app for weight progression and volume suggestions which I do find to be super useful.

Personally I think if you’re spending say 6 out of a 8 week programme multiple reps away from failure AND doing deloads unless you’re a freak of nature you’re not gonna make much progress

I also don’t think doing 1 week of taking things to failure requires a deload week it’s really not that taxing. I’ve done a full time manual job and I’ve taken every set to failure on 6x week programmes and I can tell you the manual job is way more taxing

I kinda get the feeling it’s made to cater to the wants of people who can’t really be arsed and it justifies it for you to make you feel better about not wanting to put effort in

My guess would be it's designed to offer a ",different ' way to train, and it is marketed as "optimal. " with the goal being to maximize profits vs gains lol.

 

[traininsane11]

This is a good question.

Dude… stop. Just blowing up every thread with stupid comments to get your post count up

 

[alfresco]

Stop following every post I make trying to start problems… Your account is only 3 months older than mine btw..

He has a good point.

And I have an eye on you.

 

[Aikman56]

Are you guys really doing RP training if you arent following one of the key components... unless I am misunderstanding?

Sounds like saying 'I love DC training I just dont do rest pause sets."

Well, to be fair… I never claimed to be “doing RP training”. Just said I was using the app for tracking.

 

[massephase]

I’ve done a full time manual job and I’ve taken every set to failure on 6x week programmes and I can tell you the manual job is way more taxing

I also worked manual jobs. I found them more taxing in that I feel fucked in the evening when I get home. But with excessive failure training I can get myself into a state of being totally fucked after several weeks/ months which isn't comparable to what a manual labour job could do. It feels different, more CNS symptoms like bad sleep, being wound up all the time, no mental focus, libido gone etc.

But if you don't experience that then maybe you are a genetic animal and I am a genetic weakling lol. I progress better with more rest and only straight sets. When I start doing drop sets and rest pauses on everything 5 days a week I get into trouble after a while.

 

[traininsane11]

I also worked manual jobs. I found them more taxing in that I feel fucked in the evening when I get home. But with excessive failure training I can get myself into a state of being totally fucked after several weeks/ months which isn't comparable to what a manual labour job could do. It feels different, more CNS symptoms like bad sleep, being wound up all the time, no mental focus, libido gone etc.

But if you don't experience that then maybe you are a genetic animal and I am a genetic weakling lol. I progress better with more rest and only straight sets. When I start doing drop sets and rest pauses on everything 5 days a week I get into trouble after a while.

Yeah I definitely get what you’re saying there will definitely be a difference for sure

well I don’t have a lot going for me genetically BUT the only time I found I started to notice over training was when I was doing PPL 6x per week upwards of 20 actual work sets for everything and doing rest pause, muscle rounds, drop sets and anything else I could think of in every workout for every exercise

I genuinely have no idea why I did that but amazingly I did manage to progress for a good while lol however fuuuuuuck ever doing that again

 

[Josefein421]

Just saw this and thought it was a perfectly said reminder that was also good for this thread.

 

[FK86]

Just saw this and thought it was a perfectly said reminder that was also good for this thread.

Along the same lines, there's an old adage: "training is not testing." I don't know who first coined it, but I remember Jim Wendler saying it. The drawback of those kill yourself failure programs is every day is game day.

 

[davetheanimal]

I made the switch this year after watching an old ESPN video profiling Serge Nubret from the 90s. I was blown away by the size and condition he had maintained into his 50s and then dug deeper and saw that he maintained it until he was 70 and I was blown away. The training sounded fun, short rest times, big pumps! My physique has responded extremely well to this type of training as I’m rocking easily the best physique of my life and my brother has taken really well to it as well. I feel so much less beat up and just feel so good after every training session! I think it’s also worth noting that Lee Priest, Jay Cutler and Robbie Robinson train similarly and have maintained fantastic physiques post-retirement and in Robby’s case, at a very advanced age. Really just seems like a great way to train for longevity in the sport.