Reversing heart hypertrophy/plaque: Can it be done?

[Mini Truck]

Good question J20!

Similar but different.
In simple terms a Vegan Diet involves eating nothing with a face or any
byproduct thereof.

So no chickens - no eggs.
No Cow - no Dairy.
No fish either, because it has a face.

A Vegetarian Diet often allows for eggs, cheeses and fish.

The Paleolithic diet, also popularly referred to as the caveman diet, Stone Age diet and hunter-gatherer diet, is a modern nutritional diet designed to emulate, insofar as possible using modern foods, the diet of wild plants and animals eaten by humans during the Paleolithic era. Proponents of the diet therefore recommend avoiding any foods that they claim were not available to humans at that time, including dairy products, grains, legumes, processed oils, and refined sugar.

-MT

So can one eat "paleo" and have the same effect? Or is vegan different than paleo!?


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[LK3]

lipostabil can clear arterial plaques and is a treatment used in Europe. also used to treat fatty liver. do some reading on it.

curcumin and resveratrol have interesting research in this area as well.

lots of info on how glutathione relates to this as well.

SOD too
**broken link removed**

its all about inflammation and reducing it in a systemic way.

as a few other guys started grains and processed carbs can trigger inflammation.

time to read up on antioxidants if you ask me...

 

[j2048b]

Good question J20!



Similar but different.

In simple terms a Vegan Diet involves eating nothing with a face or any

byproduct thereof.



So no chickens - no eggs.

No Cow - no Dairy.

No fish either, because it has a face.



A Vegetarian Diet often allows for eggs, cheeses and fish.



The Paleolithic diet, also popularly referred to as the caveman diet, Stone Age diet and hunter-gatherer diet, is a modern nutritional diet designed to emulate, insofar as possible using modern foods, the diet of wild plants and animals eaten by humans during the Paleolithic era. Proponents of the diet therefore recommend avoiding any foods that they claim were not available to humans at that time, including dairy products, grains, legumes, processed oils, and refined sugar.



-MT

Polquin (spelling) had a diet similar to this to enhance fat loss:

nothing with a face or any

byproduct thereof.



So no chickens - no eggs.

No Cow - no Dairy.

No fish either, because it has a face


Sent from my iPP using Tapatrash

 

[j2048b]

lipostabil can clear arterial plaques and is a treatment used in Europe. also used to treat fatty liver. do some reading on it.



curcumin and resveratrol have interesting research in this area as well.



lots of info on how glutathione relates to this as well.



SOD too

**broken link removed**



its all about inflammation and reducing it in a systemic way.



as a few other guys started grains and processed carbs can trigger inflammation.



time to read up on antioxidants if you ask me...

Man lk3 im gonna have to hit u up for the injectables of these....


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[LK3]

Man lk3 im gonna have to hit u up for the injectables of these....


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the products we carry are really geared towards this life style.

reduce inflammation and get your immune system up to speed, this will have an impact on training and most importantly HEALTH.

its super important and something most neglect.

we carry the aas of health sups, lol!

 

[nothuman]

Busa and all members who posted there thoughts,
I appreciate everyone's comments and I put a high value
on science and scientific studies.

I am very familiar with the studies you posted.
But like every study ever done, there are opposing counter studies.
Same holds true with Vegan studies.

But let's stay focused on Nothuman's thread title:

Reversing heart hypertrophy/plaque: Can it be done?

Please don't interpret this as being boastful.
But from all the posts, unless I'm missing one, I am the only person
who has successfully done this (from the comments).

The reason I chimed in, was to reassure NH that it can be done.
Regardless of what the studies may say.
Real life trumps science in many cases.

I am anal about getting blood work every 90 days, evaluating the numbers,
and understanding the relationships which coexist between them.

I also get a Nuclear Stress Test done every April. "Amazing" is the word my cardiologist used this time.

Everything clearly supports my lifestyle.

With that, I encourage NH to not necessarily eliminate his GFB but just to
keep it in check. Too much of anything is not a good thing .

Peace,

-MT

MiniTruck, I appreciate your contributions to this thread. To me, it's great to know it can be done. While I don't have the kind of willpower that you do to go vegan, I have been dilligent at doing everything else correctly. It's not like my echo cardiogram was bad, it's just there were some little things in there that could be improved. In my mind, I still plan to live to be a very old man.

As for grass fed beef, I've been eating a pound a day. It's a super food according to John Meadows. I've also been eating chicken breasts and a lot of whey protein with brown rice or oatmeal. Veggies in a blender 1-2x per day as well, with the aforementioned laundry list of supplements. I'm on TRT too.

Yes, reversal is possible. Mine went down in a one year period. No supplements at all and off AAS, no gh or peptides. Completely natural. I ate a low fat low carb diet the first 6 months due to fat gain after coming off test. Other than that my diet is normal. I eat red meat, and quite often, grains, pretty much no restrictions. Never had a plaque problem. Last year I had a coronary calcium test which came back 0% (I'm 32) and that was after 10 years of AAS and fat steaks every day. So I guess it is mostly genetic. I saw top cardiologists regarding my hypertrophy and they all emphasised on going 100% clean. It was a hard switch since I was so used to supplements but it worked. Actually now I have even have a big doubt in supplements since I actually do better without them.

This is great to hear, and congrats on your calcium score. How often did you have cheat meals throughout that time?

 

[Busamuscle]

Lipostabil is what I was trying to remember. Definitely look into this. I have heard of people having this done with success.

 

[Gizmo]

Good question J20!

Similar but different.
In simple terms a Vegan Diet involves eating nothing with a face or any
byproduct thereof.

So no chickens - no eggs.
No Cow - no Dairy.
No fish either, because it has a face.

A Vegetarian Diet often allows for eggs, cheeses and fish.

The Paleolithic diet, also popularly referred to as the caveman diet, Stone Age diet and hunter-gatherer diet, is a modern nutritional diet designed to emulate, insofar as possible using modern foods, the diet of wild plants and animals eaten by humans during the Paleolithic era. Proponents of the diet therefore recommend avoiding any foods that they claim were not available to humans at that time, including dairy products, grains, legumes, processed oils, and refined sugar.

-MT

This is just speculation on my part but it kind of makes sense. When you eat vegan you are pretty much eating a diet extremely high in vitamins and anti oxidants. Now you as a bodybuilder (I'm assuming) eat a lot of food, and all vegan which basically means you are mega dosing vitamins and anti oxidants. Now you said you added some meat back in and noticed some benefits as In you are getting some nutritious advantage from eating some meat. IMO that sounds like the perfect diet.

 

[Mini Truck]

You're welcome Nothuman!
I appreciate your open mindedness.

I really like Quinoa over Oatmeal these days.
More nutritious and mixes well with whey.

If you're able to try some Grass Fed Bison, you may like it.
Definitely worth trying. It's a little different texture than GFB,
probably because it's much leaner.

Keep Grindin', my friend!

-MT

MiniTruck, I appreciate your contributions to this thread. To me, it's great to know it can be done. While I don't have the kind of willpower that you do to go vegan, I have been dilligent at doing everything else correctly. It's not like my echo cardiogram was bad, it's just there were some little things in there that could be improved. In my mind, I still plan to live to be a very old man.

As for grass fed beef, I've been eating a pound a day. It's a super food according to John Meadows. I've also been eating chicken breasts and a lot of whey protein with brown rice or oatmeal. Veggies in a blender 1-2x per day as well, with the aforementioned laundry list of supplements. I'm on TRT too.



This is great to hear, and congrats on your calcium score. How often did you have cheat meals throughout that time?

 

[TT]

I had cheat weekends, lol. Mostly 3-4 meals cheat meals over the weekend.

 

[Knight9]

You're welcome Nothuman!
I appreciate your open mindedness.

I really like Quinoa over Oatmeal these days.
More nutritious and mixes well with whey.

If you're able to try some Grass Fed Bison, you may like it.
Definitely worth trying. It's a little different texture than GFB,
probably because it's much leaner.

Keep Grindin', my friend!

-MT

Grass fed bison? Maybe a stupid question but isn't most Bison wild...so they'd feed on grass anyway? I did hear of something a while back where Bison were bread a certain way 100 or so years ago and there are no longer any true bison/buffalo. No idea how true it is and wish I could explain it better.

 

[nothuman]

I had cheat weekends, lol. Mostly 3-4 meals cheat meals over the weekend.

I think it's the fact you just came off for a year that really helped your case then. I'm hoping mine does its magic is a shorter time frame, but we will see. How was your training and cardio during this time?

 

[TheRoid]

That's for bp tho

Comparison of effects of nebivolol... [Eur Rev Med Pharmacol Sci. 2014] - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Mike Arnold]

I have to disagree with this. I think limiting grain intake is the best way to relieve the inflammation of the vascular system due to oxidative damage! Many of the killer diseases, (heart disease, diabetes and even some cancers) we have now are due to the increase in grain consumption.

the overconsumption of refined grains and processed sugars are the enemy. Whole grains, root vegetables, legumes, fruits, ect...are not, especially when the qauntity consumed does not exceed one's energy needs. In fact, many whole grains can have benefical effects on cardiovascular health.

It is the perversion and destruction of the food supply which has caused all the problems. Food in its pure, vitalized, unadulterated state is health building, not health damaging.

 

[DK0223]

Comparison of effects of nebivolol... [Eur Rev Med Pharmacol Sci. 2014] - PubMed - NCBI

Interesting thanks!

 

[LK3]

Grass fed bison? Maybe a stupid question but isn't most Bison wild...so they'd feed on grass anyway? I did hear of something a while back where Bison were bread a certain way 100 or so years ago and there are no longer any true bison/buffalo. No idea how true it is and wish I could explain it better.

pretty sure ALL bison is far raised.

they were protected at one time.

there used to be millions and now next to nothing.

the only time I have seen them is in national parks and you cant hunt there.

I could be wrong though.

 

[TT]

I think it's the fact you just came off for a year that really helped your case then. I'm hoping mine does its magic is a shorter time frame, but we will see. How was your training and cardio during this time?

My strength decreased very gradually but I have been keeping up with a 6 day/week workout plan as per doctors' recommendations. My cardio got a lot better. I used to do 45 min session 4 times a week, but after I came off TRT I felt like it wasn't enough for me. After 3 months I would barely break sweat and would not get winded. So as soon as weather allowed I started running in the park. started off with 3 miles 3 times a week and now I do 5 mile run (without stop) every morning and 60min cardio on my elliptical at home at night and train Monday thru Saturday in the afternoon. By around 6th months off TRT I could tell that reversal was taking place. I could feel it in my energy level. Even though my test level is 252 I have more energy than ever before and feel that my cardio health is top notch (knock on wood). My blood pressure is 116/70 and resting HR 41-46

 

[Colosseus]

Injectible l-carnitine levo-carnitine (carnitor/cardispan) has been used for treating congestive heart failure (CHF). It is also pretty effective at reducing left ventricle hypertrophy (LVH). Very effective at taking the 'load' off of the kidneys and can help with and possibly prevent renal failure in some situations. Simple, effective, and worth a look.

 

[mountaindog1]

Injectible l-carnitine levo-carnitine (carnitor/cardispan) has been used for treating congestive heart failure (CHF). It is also pretty effective at reducing left ventricle hypertrophy (LVH). Very effective at taking the 'load' off of the kidneys and can help with and possibly prevent renal failure in some situations. Simple, effective, and worth a look.

Do you know what dosing was used on this? I ask because I recently started using Synthetek injectable carnitine.

JM

 

[Colosseus]

Do you know what dosing was used on this? I ask because I recently started using Synthetek injectable carnitine.

JM

Offhand I can't remember the dosing specific to cardiac benefits. I think my Cardispan was 500mg/ml. I've personally loaded it in the 1500mg-3000mg IM (very painfully I might add) and noticed almost instant relief from chest pressure and pain. I followed the loading phase with 500mg E3D. My initial desire was to use it for weight loss and found it made the pressure in my chest disappear. It is used for treating angina, ischemia, as well as cardiac carnitine insufficiency. I can't find the study on the CHF/LVH observations offhand. However, I don't think the dosing was much different than the approach I was taking only it listed mg/kg of bodyweight and they were doing IV push. If I can find the study I will post it up.