S-23 Sarm - any experiences?

[jstrong20]

Yeah very good stuff. Strength gains come on quick. A few weeks in and people I know are commenting on size gains.

 

[dros]

Stopped using it after 6 weeks. Extreme joint pain and very stiff.

Tried again 2 times after weeks off both times but still it would give me joint pain and stiffness. Cannot run this anymore. S4 at 100-125mg will give similar results as 20-30mg S23 but without joint issues and stiffness.

 

[natrol]

This was my original post on it:

This will be a general introduction to the Selective Androgen Receptor Modulator known as "S-23" ((S)-N-(4-cyano-3-trifluoromethyl-phenyl)-3-(3-fluoro, 4-chlorophenoxy)-2-hydroxy-2-methyl-propanamide).

Here is the study that was conducted on S-23: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2630904/

Let's preface this by saying that at the time of this post, I do rep a research chem company who just launched this compound.

However, the reason they now stock this product is because of a recommendation made by me to order it and start stocking it for you guys, as I personally have seen great things from this compound, and feel it has a place not just among SARM researchers, but it also has great potential for more mainstream bodybuilders looking for a POSSIBLY “safer” alternative to harsh DHT derivatives precontest.

When I say safer, I DO NOT mean because it is thoroughly researched and has been proven to be a safe compound, but I do mean via the results in the study done on it, and through various anecdotal logs it proved to not exert any of the same brutal side effects that DHT derivatives are notorious for (horrendous permanent hair loss, prostate enlargement, etc.).

Keep this in mind, as this compound isn’t for the non-adventurous type, it has extremely limited data available on it that isn’t derived from anecdotal logs or bro-science.

Obviously there are many individuals who won’t touch something or even fathom “researching” it unless there are an abundant amount of clinical studies backing the compound, and that is more than understandable, but for those who are still interested, I compel you to read on as the above is more of a disclaimer for those who will inevitably chastise this compound for its limited available published research.

Now, for those who are still interested, let’s actually delve into it:

This isn't a new compound by any means, but its popularity is starting to rise recently.

At the moment, this is one of the strongest SARMs on earth (if not THE strongest SARM), as it has a very high binding affinity to the androgen receptors.

What you can expect from this compound:

- Lean/dry gains (similar to Superdrol)
- Greatly increased strength
- Cosmetic drying out effect of the muscle (much like Winstrol)
- Greatly increased vascularity
- Improved endurance
- Improved body composition (great compound for recomp’s)
- Notable increase in grainy detail of the muscle and muscle hardness

The best way I can describe this compound is it is like a far more powerful version of the SARM S4 (Andarine) without the night vision side effect.

Or, a direct replacement for a high dose of Winstrol.

There is a blatant conditioning effect of the muscle that is apparent at lower levels of body fat, and this is with an absence of the traditional side effects associated with DHT derivatives.

So far, what we have concluded via the study done on it and the several extensive anecdotal logs (provided by brave and adventurous researchers) are the following for S-23 related side effects:

- Increased levels of aggression
- Endocrine shutdown (just like any traditional DHT derivative)
- Decrease in prostate size (as opposed to traditional DHT derivatives which enlarge the prostate)
- Potential shedding (this is different than the actual acceleration of androgenic alopecia, which is what DHT derived steroids do, shedding can occur when a hormonal fluctuation occurs in the body, but it is not permanent)
- Night sweats (rare)
- Increased necessity for proper hydration (S-23 seems to have a dehydrating effect not just on the condition of the muscle, but in the body as a whole)

While this is a VERY new compound on the bodybuilding scene, it is a SARM so we are also under the impression off the bat that this compound features an extremely minimal (to non-existent) androgen rating.

However, this was obviously undetermined until we had more experience with the compound, and could see for ourselves if it caused androgenic side effects or not.

Recently, there have been some logs from females who have tried S-23 and they experienced no Androgenic side effects, so we can likely conclude that it does in fact behave like a traditional SARM, it simply has a higher binding affinity and its’ effects on the androgen receptor are more pronounced/potent than the more mainstream SARMs (like Ostarine, S4, etc.), hence more lean tissue gain and strength can be expected from this compound.

The half-life in the study done was 11.9 hours via oral administration, but this was done on rats so obviously this isn’t a conclusive half-life for a definitive human dosing schedule, however, it does give us a rough guideline of what we can expect regarding the drugs active life.

During the studies done on S23, human equivalent doses of 0.5mg – 50mg were utilized.

Obviously this range is extremely general, so pinpointing an effective human dosage is difficult, but the consensus seems to be that the sweet spot lies around 20-30mg for bodybuilding purposes.

Once again I have to reiterate, this isn’t set in stone, this is just what we can conclude right now based on the information given.

What place do I think this compound has in a bodybuilder’s regimen?

Personally, I wouldn’t use this compound in the off-season.

This isn’t because it doesn’t have the potential for being a great lean mass builder, but because it has a blatant dehydrating effect which can exacerbate joint issues while trying to continuously get stronger each workout.

In other words, it will not provide joint lubrication or have any sort of injury prevention benefits like traditional more “wet” compounds will.

However, if retaining a “leaner” less watery look even in the off-season is appealing to you, then this compound I believe has a place.

What I would personally reserve this for is the last month or two precontest.

Instead of throwing the kitchen sink in of DHT derived hardeners, I would take out the high dosed Winny and opt for 30mg of S-23 instead.

Winstrol rips the hair out of my head, and aggravates other issues that I am not a big fan of.

Most logs have found that S-23 could be a totally viable replacement in a situation like this, providing the same cosmetic effects as Winstrol, and I have found this as well through my personal experience.

This is what I will reserve it for personally, and where I think it shines.

For SARM only guys (those who want to only use SARMs and not delve into the world of AAS), or those who simply don’t want to shut their systems down completely, this is not going to be a viable compound for you as you will absolutely be shut down when you use S-23, even for a short span of time.

The study showed complete endocrine shutdown (infertility) in a matter of weeks, so don’t expect to cruise through a cycle of S-23 with just slight suppression.

This is obviously reversible during PCT, but it will almost inevitably completely shut you down for the duration of time it is in your system.

So if you are a SARM only guy and want to run this, either contemplate adding in a base of Testosterone to offset the potential for low-testosterone related side effects, or simply be prepared to experience them as they will very likely occur.

It goes without saying that a full PCT will be necessary after a cycle of S-23 if you aren’t a guy who blasts and cruises, or is on TRT.

This isn’t something you can just take some D-Aspartic Acid after and expect efficient endocrine recovery.

You will need to do a real PCT.

Cliff Notes:

- Potential replacement for harsher DHT derivatives without the side effects of traditional DHT derived steroids that we hate
- Seems to provide the same cosmetic benefits as DHT derivatives
- Great lean/dry mass builder
- Will shut you down
- Extremely limited research/higher risk factor than more traditional SARMs

As far as ordering S-23 for research purposes, Chemyo just had their S-23 HPLC tested and it came back as 99%+

**broken link removed**

You can order S-23 here: **broken link removed**

Cheers.

^ My opinions still haven't changed and I have used it a couple times since that post.

However, there is an apparent dose-dependent level of androgenic activity that occurs with S23.

"Androgenic activity and anabolic activity of S-23 in castrated male rats
The in vivo pharmacologic activity of S-23 was initially evaluated in castrated male rats after 14 d treatment. Figure 2A​2A shows the androgenic activity (prostate and seminal vesicles) and anabolic activity (levator ani muscle) of S-23 in castrated male rats at doses ranging from 0.01 to 3 mg/d. After castration, the weight of prostate, seminal vesicles, and levator ani muscle decreased significantly to 5.7, 6.5, and 35% of control values in intact animals, respectively. By administration of S-23 to castrated animals, androgen-dependent organ weights increased in a dose-dependent manner. At a dose rate of 1.0 mg/d, S-23 was able to maintain the prostate and seminal vesicles at weights equal to or greater than that observed in intact animals. Notably, at a dose rate as low as 0.1 mg/d, S-23 was able to selectively maintain the weight of the levator ani muscle at the intact control level, whereas its effects on the prostate and seminal vesicles were lower than 30% of those observed in intact controls. As shown in Fig. 2B​2B,, the Emax of S-23 in the prostate, seminal vesicles, and levator ani muscle was 138 ± 21, 144 ± 1, and 129 ± 4% of those observed in intact controls, respectively. Accordingly, the ED50 of S-23, calculated by nonlinear regression of the dose-response relationship, in the prostate, seminal vesicles, and levator ani muscle was 0.43 ± 0.18, 0.41 ± 0.0070, and 0.079 ± 0.010 mg/d, respectively. In comparison with C-6 (13), S-23 demonstrated a 2-fold higher potency (ED50) in all three organs without significantly increasing the efficacy (Emax) or changing the androgenic/anabolic activity in vivo. The increase in potency of S-23 in vivo was possibly due to its higher AR binding affinity compared with C-6. Another possibility was the improved in vivo drug exposure after administration, which would be verified by results of pharmacokinetic studies."

The extent of this is still not in the same realm of pure DHT, like similar AAS (Winny, Mast, etc.) that would be used for similar goals (drying out, lean gains, etc.), so there is definitely less risk of miniaturization of the hair follicles and prostate growth, however, you can see for yourself in the S23 study there is an apparent dose-dependent relationship where androgenic activity is 100% noted.

 

[JoeyDHB]

To be honest it feels like your on Tren with less sides. Some get pretty bad aggression from it but I don’t. Tren never really gave me any size just made me look incredible

 

[SOUR DIESEL]

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