Sleep Supplements

[Ranchhand]

I would like to add, in the beginning of the clip he briefly touches on Epitalon, Melatonin, and our Circadian rhythm and how DSIP interacts with these. Reason why I say Epitalon first to restore Melatonin levels and our circadian rhythm before introducing DSIP. Plus, I would run Selank with the Epitalon to get your GABA levels back to normal. Especially Epitalon you want to cycle, run it for about 6-8 weeks, stop and then introduce DSIP separately for about 6-8 weeks. It's recommended DSIP is cycled as well, 6-8 weeks, then repeat as necessary.

No, I haven't read any studies myself, but from what I've learned, especially stronger androgens can strip Melatonin and GABA stores from the brain. My thought is get your melatonin, GABA, and circadian rhythm back on track and then let DSIP to it's job. Plus, I like Trevor's holistic approach of having Mots-C in there as well.

 

[Ranchhand]

The Gorilla Chemist, the first and main thing he talks about is the importance of GABA for sleep, ie: Selank is that one peptide that restores GABA levels in your brain:

 

[Virtues]

Brother, I do not remember. That was years ago, maybe even 10 years ago. I tried it when my sleep was nonexistent. Used a couple of vials to see if I could get my sleep back on track, got

Yes sir. I recently read a post where people said it did not work at first. Once they increased the dose to around 0.5 to 1 mg, it started working. Anything over 1 mg was described as extremely deep sleep, like going several layers deep in the movie Inception.

 

[Denwor]

man i feel your pain because melatonin literally does nothing for me except give me weird dreams and a headache the next day. that specific combo of mag, apigenin, and l-theanine is basically the "huberman" stack and it actually works way better for staying asleep than the usual crap you find at the grocery store. magnesium glycinate is the real mvp there because it actually relaxes your muscles instead of just knocking your brain out. honestly though if you find a pill that has all four of those just make sure the dosages are high enough to actually do something otherwise your just paying for expensive pee. good luck getting some actual rest bro because i know how much it sucks to be wide awake at 3am for no reason.

 

[Ranchhand]

Yes sir. I recently read a post where people said it did not work at first. Once they increased the dose to around 0.5 to 1 mg, it started working. Anything over 1 mg was described as extremely deep sleep, like going several layers deep in the movie Inception.

Thanks for mentioning, it's just been so long ago I just don't remember the dosing I did. But with two vials on hand at the time I'm sure I upped the dose at some point. To what dose I topped out at I have no idea.

 

[Ranchhand]

bro because i know how much it sucks to be wide awake at 3am for no reason.

I hear ya, it's been a long time but I remember getting a total of 3hrs sleep every night, like clockwork waking up at 3am in a puddle of sweat, wide awake but zombied out. It was so consistent that I just started training at 330am in my home gym before going to work. I agree completely with magnesium glycinate, this is the sleep aid I've been using for years. I'll double up the dose and add in extra melatonin.


Even with these supps my sleep still hasn't been perfect. Reason why I'm deep diving the peptides to see if I can get a permanent fix and restore my sleep back to its original state. Like when I was a baby, but kidding aside, my sleep was perfect up into my 20's. Then the slow degrade happened, then I completely wrecked my sleep with Tren.

 

[ChickenRiceRepeat]

Dante wrote about this a long time ago. It’s also supposed to promote visceral fat loss. Did u notice any of that?

Uhm, no, I can’t say that I’ve ever noticed any visceral fat or the reduction of such. I’ve been taking above 30mg nightly for 6 months and 70mg for perhaps 3 months.

Melatonin is the strongest antioxidant so it’s very useful for enhanced athletes especially.

 

[ChickenRiceRepeat]

Here I thought 10mg was a lot! You find that amount keeps you asleep all night? How do you feel in the morning, refreshed or groggy?

Feel great no grogginess. Lately I messed up my sleep with tren and now it’s still a bit off, not sure if it’s due to total androgenic load being higher than I’m used to or if I just need time on a cruise post tren to recover.

Before the tren, the melatonin made sleep wonderful with no grogginess but some guys stay groggy all day I hear. Also gives me wild dreams.

 

[j4ever]

Sleep hygiene has been mentioned, but it really only gets a passing mention. This is a big deal. By now, we all know not to lay there with bright lights and scrolling social media before bed.

But I was listening to a Rhonda Patrick podcast where she's interviewing a CBT-I therapist recently. The real deal is to never use your bed for scrolling, working, watching TV, etc... even during the daytime.

Your brain makes associations and patterns based on experience. So the more time you spend in your bed stimulating your brain with content, entertainment, work stress, etc, the more your brain associates your bed as a place to be active.

So I tried it. The only reasons I'm ever in bed now are sleep and sex. I can read a few pages of a novel until I can't keep my eyes open, and that's it. Saturday mornings I used to wake up and browse the internet... nope. Get your ass up and go to the living room to look at your phone. Wake up in the middle of the night? Don't even think about looking at the damn phone, and if you do, go to another room. Make your bed a sanctuary for sleep and nothing else.

It works. I was always the one to wake up at 2 am with my mind racing about work. That has almost entirely stopped.

i think one of the worse things i ever did for sleep was putting a tv in my room, now no matter how tired i am my dumbass thinks i need to turn on the tv, the absolute worse thing i did was working the night shift for 21 years.

 

[Ranchhand]

Must watch if you are really serious about improving your sleep:

 

[Klax]

Not sure if it counts as a supplement, but popped in here to say I got some Zopiclone from Indian pharmacy and tried it last night for the first time. Knocked me out in 30 minutes, got 8 hours of sleep, and woke up feeling like a million bucks. Definitely not something I'd take every day, but for what I needed it for, it worked. Will probably only use it when I really need to ensure I get a full night's rest. I've had "big days" where the night prior I couldn't get my mind to shut off and I'm checking the clock, panicking that I won't get enough sleep.

 

[warlock]

Not sure if it counts as a supplement, but popped in here to say I got some Zopiclone from Indian pharmacy and tried it last night for the first time. Knocked me out in 30 minutes, got 8 hours of sleep, and woke up feeling like a million bucks. Definitely not something I'd take every day, but for what I needed it for, it worked. Will probably only use it when I really need to ensure I get a full night's rest. I've had "big days" where the night prior I couldn't get my mind to shut off and I'm checking the clock, panicking that I won't get enough sleep.

7.5mg? And no grogginess in the AM?

 

[Klax]

7.5mg? And no grogginess in the AM?

Correct. Woke up feeling fresh. Was sitting up in bed watching a podcast on the TV, felt super relaxed and mellow at about T+25.

At T+35 I remember feeling like my eyes were heavy so I shut them “for a second” and woke up 8 hours later.

Definitely worked, but I’m going to save it as a tool for nights I really need it because I could see myself becoming reliant on it, as it worked so well.

 

[megroo]

None of the things seem to work for me. And ironically- magnesium seems to make my sleep worse. If I take it close to bedtime, I’m restless all night.

Melatonin used to work. I’m intrigued by these high doses though.
I have some 10mg time release tablets…

Dsip and selank didnt do anything measurable, maybe worth another go at higher doses.

This epitalon looks interesting, may have to try that.

The one thing that works for me, as mentioned above, is zopiclone!!

I keep a half a tab on my bed side table, so when I wake up to piss around midnight, I glug it down with some water. That stuff tastes horrendous.
But it’ll knock me out till 4-5 ish so I’m good with that

 

[Duke309]

For the guys running high dose melatonin, how did you progress up to the level you are at?

 

[Acerola]

TBH, I’ve found 3mg melatonin to be more effective personally compared to 10mg. Haven’t needed it in sometime but can be a useful tool to help me sleep a bit deeper through the night.

 

[warlock]

The one thing that works for me, as mentioned above, is zopiclone!!

I keep a half a tab on my bed side table, so when I wake up to piss around midnight, I glug it down with some water. That stuff tastes horrendous.
But it’ll knock me out till 4-5 ish so I’m good with that

Is that half of 7.5mg?