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Starting trt & have some concerns

mcs2012

New member
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Joined
Sep 16, 2012
Messages
10
I apologize for the length here, but it's always extensive and never easy with my issues.

I am about to embark on a TRT program through my physician. I am 53 and am in good health other than the following issues. I've discussed such with my physician, but he thinks most of these will resolve and not worsen with TRT as long as we monitor everything on a regular basis. My purpose for this email is to get other opinions. I am also looking at stacking some pharm-grade rhGH to help with recomp.

My scrip is for 200mg/week of cyp. My most recent TT was 425, FT was 9.70 (ref range: 9.0-46.0ng/dL).

1) BLOOD CLOTS: I had two clots in my legs last year. Knowing that exogenous T can raise RBC/HCT/HGB, is there anything else besides monitoring these levels and getting regular therapeutic phlebotomies when necessary that I should be aware of given my prior issues?

2) SLEEP APNEA: I have mild sleep apnea. Sleeping on sides to avoid it. Trying to avoid CPAP. Knowing that exogenous T is a double-edged sword: if low T, then it improves sleep apnea, but it can also worsen it over time via central apnea.

3) HYPERTENSION: I am controlling this naturally. Will only resort to meds if absolutely necessary.
From what I researched, it is from the increase in blood volume that cause this, so same, thing phlebotomies?

4) LIPIDS: LDL-C (153) has improved, but is still elevated; HDL-C (46) has improved, but needs to increase. TRT can reverse that (increase LDL and decrease HDL).

5) HYPOTHYROID - I have been treating my hypothyroidism with dessicated thyroid/T3. I've read that TRT can reduce thyroid function.

But my biggest dilemma has been the inability to lose excess body and visceral fat no matter what I try diet or training-wise (and I have tried everything over the last 4 years - i.e. low carb, intermittent fasting, keto, counting calories, etc.). In addition to hypothyroidism, I believe insulin resistance is still an issue which obviously plays a major role in preventing fat loss. I also have a MTHFR (methylation) genetic defect which I am treating with targeted methylated B-vitamins, etc..

I agree with my doc that much of the above issues will improve by reducing body and visceral fat via TRT but still am concerned.

I would say I am 25lbs overweight based on my body composition (which doesn't help BP). My bf runs 25-29% no matter what I do. Losing weight isn't the issue; it's losing the fat.
Stats:
AGE: 53
WT: 179
HT: 5-07

My latest BodPod showed I weighed less but had more bf and less lean mass which was really disappointing:
BODYFAT %-31.10%
BODYFAT-LBS: 53.9
LEAN-FFM: 68.90%
LEAN-FFM-LBS: 119.6
TOTAL WEIGHT: 173.5
RMR: 1500

Training routine (up until I had to eliminate press movements in the last two weeks because of my shoulder impingement got much worse):
Resistance training: every other day - 45 min. 30 sec. rest; 25 sets total
Cardio: 3 x's/week on off days - 30-45 min.; elliptical/bike; outdoor (until my lower back became inflamed). I do both steady state and HIIT, depending on my energy level.
I am also engaged in a 6-week PT protocol for the shoulder and back which is a workout in and of itself.

I have been training fasted with 20g BCAAs and 5-10g glutamine to try and shed bf, but it has done nothing. I have 2 main meals/day and one snack following workouts. I am gluten-free and soy-free, eat organic only, no processed anything, lean meats, fish, poultry, eggs, Healthy fats are from whole avocados, coconut oil, seeds, nuts and nut butters, olive oil, flax oil. Carbs are mostly from veggies and a small amount of fruit (berries). Only grains are wild rice and quinoa which is technically a seed which I eat maybe once a week.

AVG MACROS:
CALORIES: 1500-1800
PRO: 150-170g
CHO: 40-50g (will cycle carbs so I eat a little more post workout; but no more than 50g)
FATS: 80-100g

I have not attempted to eat less than 1500 calories/day than the above because it's already at a low threshold and any lower I would fear would put me into starvation mode, damage my metabolism and worsen my thyroid function.

I can lose weight; but all I do is get skinny fat. My doc think it's largely because my free T is in the dumps (despite my TT being in the 400s) and this is primarily why I continue to have a hard time gaining lean mass and dropping bf. My SHBG has been a bit high (42), but that's because of taking T3. My E2 is actually too low (4)!

Appreciate any and all input.
 
TRT can be a scary thing, but no need to sweat it. At your age, the benefits will far outweigh the negatives. 200mgs weekly seems high for your age, but I am sure if your Dr is progressive, he will make adjustments based on regular BW. My protocol (at age 31 mind you) is 125mgs of test C weekly. I like it like this, as I have no real need for an AI, and I function much better with my E2 levels a touch high. I like that. I can recommend a few supplements to use in order to maintain a normal hormonal environment. I would suggest HcG for sure. It is simple and inexpensive, so I say do it. Hopefully your Doc will do this for you. D3 is another hormone I would suggest. DHEA and Pregnenolone is fantastic, as DHEA precurses test and preg precurses almost all hormones. Since your test is low, DHEA and preg will most likely be non existant as well.

Take plenty of fish oil and other sources of omega fatty acids. This will help maintain a healthy blood flow as well as cardiovascular heath benefits. Make sure to take vitamin E along with those omegas! Good luck and I am sure youre going to be perfectly fine!
 
TRT can be a scary thing, but no need to sweat it. At your age, the benefits will far outweigh the negatives. 200mgs weekly seems high for your age, but I am sure if your Dr is progressive, he will make adjustments based on regular BW. My protocol (at age 31 mind you) is 125mgs of test C weekly. I like it like this, as I have no real need for an AI, and I function much better with my E2 levels a touch high. I like that. I can recommend a few supplements to use in order to maintain a normal hormonal environment. I would suggest HcG for sure. It is simple and inexpensive, so I say do it. Hopefully your Doc will do this for you. D3 is another hormone I would suggest. DHEA and Pregnenolone is fantastic, as DHEA precurses test and preg precurses almost all hormones. Since your test is low, DHEA and preg will most likely be non existant as well.

Take plenty of fish oil and other sources of omega fatty acids. This will help maintain a healthy blood flow as well as cardiovascular heath benefits. Make sure to take vitamin E along with those omegas! Good luck and I am sure youre going to be perfectly fine!

How are you running HCG? Every so many weeks and what dose?

What were your TT and FT levels before TRT?

MY last TT was 425 which is low normal and FT was 9 which is very low. My E2 is too low right now @ 4. T will help with that.

Also was looking at stacking it with HGH - and for my injuries - my doc wrote me a scrip for deca which I will wait to try with the T.
 
Last edited:
How are you running HCG? Every so many weeks and what dose?

What were your TT and FT levels before TRT?

MY last TT was 425 which is low normal and FT was 9 which is very low. My E2 is too low right now @ 4. T will help with that.

Also was looking at stacking it with HGH - and for my injuries - my doc wrote me a scrip for deca which I will wait to try with the T.

The deca is a great idea! I have currently started it at 100mgs weekly and it works wonders. I have actually blended Cyp/deca at 100/100 and use it once a week. It is great. As far as Hcg, most recommend 250ius 2x weekly. That is ideal, but I use 500ius 1x weekly and have good results that way. The reason for that is because I can easily draw it all up in the same pin. My FT was in low, but I can remember off hand. My total T was 330. My low T was due to negligence of hypertension, then the meds used for it. A double edged sword really.
 
The deca is a great idea! I have currently started it at 100mgs weekly and it works wonders. I have actually blended Cyp/deca at 100/100 and use it once a week. It is great. As far as Hcg, most recommend 250ius 2x weekly. That is ideal, but I use 500ius 1x weekly and have good results that way. The reason for that is because I can easily draw it all up in the same pin. My FT was in low, but I can remember off hand. My total T was 330. My low T was due to negligence of hypertension, then the meds used for it. A double edged sword really.

What are the benefits you notice on deca? Have you monitored your prolactin levels since it wil raise them?

Are you still on the HTN med and if so, which ones? I am also hypertensive, but am trying to avoid meds by using natural herbals and supps.

125/79 right now and no meds! Not too bad.
 
Last edited:
What are the benefits you notice on deca? Have you monitored your prolactin levels since it wil raise them?

Are you still on the HTN med and if so, which ones? I am also hypertensive, but am trying to avoid meds by using natural herbals and supps.

125/79 right now and no meds! Not too bad.

I have no problems whatsoever with prolactin. Being such a low dose, just like the test, ancillaries are seldom needed by any. I am on BP meds as well as a beta blocker. Herbs don't cut it for me. But fish oils seem to help a bit. Even on the meds, I sit around 138/85, which sucks, but its better than 165/100.
I will add once more thing while I am thinking of it. I don't have prolactin sides, mainly due to the low dose. However, I do take prami @ .25mgs ED just for the sexual sides. I like to have fun, what can I say ;) Prami works for me much better than caber. But this is what I do. Many would say not too do it, but of all the research I have done, and spoken to several doctors on the subject of running a DA for long periods, there seems to be 0 problems with running a small dose of prami or caber long term.
 
I have no problems whatsoever with prolactin. Being such a low dose, just like the test, ancillaries are seldom needed by any. I am on BP meds as well as a beta blocker. Herbs don't cut it for me. But fish oils seem to help a bit. Even on the meds, I sit around 138/85, which sucks, but its better than 165/100.
I will add once more thing while I am thinking of it. I don't have prolactin sides, mainly due to the low dose. However, I do take prami @ .25mgs ED just for the sexual sides. I like to have fun, what can I say ;) Prami works for me much better than caber. But this is what I do. Many would say not too do it, but of all the research I have done, and spoken to several doctors on the subject of running a DA for long periods, there seems to be 0 problems with running a small dose of prami or caber long term.

Hawthorn, celery juice, inositol, berberine, FO, etc. all work to lower my BP. I assume you tried all those?
 
Hawthorn, celery juice, inositol, berberine, FO, etc. all work to lower my BP. I assume you tried all those?

Oh yes. Ive tried everything. Even my current BP meds aren't working ideally. I am supposed to go in for a re eval in a couple of weeks and hope to up the doses. I really want to be around 125/80 at most.
 

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