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Staying away from Testosterone?

TheOtherOne55

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Test gives scale weight , not small arms
Now when shit genetics and you pound test-slin-gh you force growth but only thing growing is ass and gut
The reason abominations exist at 250,260,270 etc is massive test,gh,slin,overfeeding
All these guys would be beter at 200-220 and looking good not like abominations with huge ass and guy and no arms
Tren of course not needed i never said something about tren , i said anabolics in general

Test and kidneys ? Hahaha why you not ask a nephrologist ?
My brothers nephrologist told me , i can give you his name , best doctor here maybe you know more ?
Test increase BP more than ANYTHING !
Have you done tren without test ? I have ! Guess what ?? No BP spikes


Hahha brother i never said huge bbs suck and all should look like 80s
I have said COUNTLESS TIMES i respect all huge guys today, search my post history i wait ...
I said FOR THE AVERAGE USER IN FORUMS is beter to stay lean and chase 80s physique than be a fat bloated mess that llooks good for a week
And 99,999999 % ppl on forums on high test are a fat watery mess and would cry hard if the dieted to true 6%
Also while bring in this dante ?i am on forums 17 years , i know what i am talking , i have seen countless ppl even here looking like shit cause of high test and overfeeding chasing the “mass “
ALL this guys would be 10000000% more happy and proud of themselfs if they did what i say
Have you noticed how only few ppl post pics ? You know why ? I do ... THEY ARE ASHAMED
when you look good and are happy and proud you just post your pics

Countless ppl pm me saying they WOULD KILL to look like me ... well pounding the test and 100000 cals sire aint the way

I NEVER SAID EVERYONE ELSE IS LAZY OR MY WAY IS THE ONLY WAY!!!
i am not english , i speak 4 language
Maybe you can try speak my language and we can see how well you do

I respect you man bit please answer me something ... can you post your pics after you diet this year and also from last year ?
Lets see all this offseason and weighing 300 how much muscle has put on you ?
With all due respect i bet only your ass and waist will have grow

And last but not least ... i never weighted more than 95 kg ... i have take 3 overalls from guys weighing 250+ ... if i didnt wory ppl find my name i would post them and you can check how small i am next to them while weighing 40 lb less

Stop attacking everyone who dont agree with you

This was last post of me on this matter

Ppl can do what they like but i prefer being 60 and looking like nubret than being fat , injured with health issues and needing to show photo of me so ppl believe i really trained at some point in my life

Try to be more civil and not put words in my mouth

And since you want bring dante here ... you can ask Disgusted ( he was post here) if what i say is true about the 80s

Respect

The problem comes when guys, like yourself, try to state OPINIONS as FACTS.
You are mixing your own anecdotal evidence—and random shit you THINK you see—and then coming on here and stating it like it is 100% truth. The world doesn't work that way buddy.

I don't like Dbol. It bloats me, makes me looks gross, never liked using it ever. And I see the same in a lot of people.
But i ALSO CANNOT say that dbol is a bad drug, everyone should avoid it, it doesn't do anything good to one's physique.
Because I'm only reacting to my own personal opinion. Hey, DBol works for LOTS of guys, including Pros. So who am I to challenge that shit. It worked for them, doesn't work for me. The end.

Learn how to separate facts and opinion. Test has grown some of the greatest physiques in BBing, whether you like it or not.
Btw, I'm very glad you tried to personally call me out and want to see pics of me when I cut down. You're pouring gas on a fire brother lol
 

madg

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The problem comes when guys, like yourself, try to state OPINIONS as FACTS.
You are mixing your own anecdotal evidence—and random shit you THINK you see—and then coming on here and stating it like it is 100% truth. The world doesn't work that way buddy.

I don't like Dbol. It bloats me, makes me looks gross, never liked using it ever. And I see the same in a lot of people.
But i ALSO CANNOT say that dbol is a bad drug, everyone should avoid it, it doesn't do anything good to one's physique.
Because I'm only reacting to my own personal opinion. Hey, DBol works for LOTS of guys, including Pros. So who am I to challenge that shit. It worked for them, doesn't work for me. The end.

Learn how to separate facts and opinion. Test has grown some of the greatest physiques in BBing, whether you like it or not.
Btw, I'm very glad you tried to personally call me out and want to see pics of me when I cut down. You're pouring gas on a fire brother lol

I never stated facts , never called you out

You just keep not reading what i write and picking what you like

As i said i am done with this

Try to read my post slowly without being mad
 

DOGGCRAPP

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People are stating their opinion on how they personally want to look and how they think others should look and then stating those opinions as facts. I'd love to come in here and say "Tren, and Halotestin are totally safe"....and if you went according to the mirror they are. According to the mirror Tren and Halotestin are the safest drugs you can take. You look awesome, rock hard and lean. Obviously the insides tell a different story. People dont want to use testosterone because they dont like the look. I GET IT! But if you want to get down to brass tacks and look at things longevity and health wise....the truth is pretty darn obvious. Madg you are using guys from the 70's and 80's as your arguing point on health and look. And your darn right...Padilla and Coe and Ross and a whole bunch of other guys in the 70's and 80's went low test and high anabolics. But you are putting "health" in that equation. Well lets look at that shall we? Padilla was freaking awesome. I saw him compete in the Night of Champions back in early 90's in Yates first show. Coe was a teenage phenom. You are taking guys with phenomenal genetics and making an argument on what they used as the argument. Do you know how many 5'3 bodybuilders tried to look like Padilla? Hundreds of thousands? How many ended up looking like him? 12 maybe? {Priest, Lewis, Henry, Terra, and a handful more)....obviously genetics created that bodybuilder....regardless of his drug choices. But you are leaving out a main cog in all this.....how is what they did healthier? Padilla went the low test high anabolic route and had quadruple bypass in his late 40's. Coe went low test and high anabolics and had quadruple bypass in his 50's. Don Ross went low test high anabolics and dropped dead of a heart attack in his late 40's. A slew of low test high anabolic bodybuilders from the 70's ended up with heart problems.

This isnt going to go well in here at all...AT FREAKING ALL. I do know this.....from looking at (its got to be over 1000 bodybuilders blood work now) that people on low testosterone dosages, and low gh dosages have virtually no changes in their bloodwork. With all PEDS blood pressure must be kept in check but with testosterone in low dosages what you get is a slightly higher hematocrit and a slightly lower HDL and thats about it. Now if you want to talk about Testosterone bloodwork compared to "steroids that are considered safe" bloodwork? Everyone on this thread will be pissed at this but it the g'damn truth....you cannot make the argument because "you like a look"....and want to continue having that look and will argue vehemently because you want to use "X compound"...instead of testosterone when "X compound" is not even remotely as safe as testosterone. For example Anavar for some fracked up reason got a reputation as "SAFE" all these years. Its about the unsafest long time usage drug out there. And virtually any person in here doing 50mg of anavar a day who checks their bloodwork about 6 weeks in on that will quickly see lipid numbers that would make a doctor say "WTF are you doing?".....I keep running into physique competitors online that have coaches having them use anavar year round and their HDL is plummetted and LDL/TRigs skyrocketed. Because these coaches are telling them "Anavar is healthy and safe".....Ive had about 6 guys in this last year who are physique guys who have used anavar longterm who i told to get coronary calcium scores......they are all coming back escalated. The last guy is 34 years old and his CCS is 383. 383!!! the guy is 34! Thats a cardiac event waiting to happen by the time he is 38-42.

I had another bodybuilder who was known for his longterm usage of "healthy anabolics" {One of the most famous people in the sport}.....come to me because his coronary calcium score was 340 and wondered if I could get him down from that. So much for mans tweaking of the parent hormone (testosterone) to make it safer. If anyone took the time to get bloodwork smack dab in the middle of these so called safe anabolics (noone does that)....they would be shocked to see that a great many of them are really detrimental to longterm lipid health. It is what it is. <---is that statement going to be popular in this forum....hell no its not....some people are seething right now reading that because again 'they want a certain look" and here comes Dante Trudel pissing on the apple cart.

So in my opinion this all comes down to an opinion on a look that you want vs what you are wanting to risk health wise...it really does. My opinion is this: if health is the highest importance in this sport. Low dose testosterone and low dose gh are the two things you can do pretty much the rest of your life and not have very detrimental aspects to your bloodwork. If someone was going to add an anabolic to that then maybe primobolan could be added to that (but again that would have to be proven out by bloodwork). Thats why i have stated time and time again in this forum.....try to spend the longer periods that you ar putting on size with a test dosage (while keeping bp in check) with low dose gh (so you can eat enough food to get larger but remain lean) and again with maybe primobolan....and if you got a contest in sight "YOU GOT TO DO WHAT YOU GOT TO DO"....and that means using drugs that are in no way conducive to health. Never ever use orals offseason...only precontest or before something important you want to look good for and keep that usage fairly short.
If thats not acceptable for someone then so be it.....they are free to do whatever they want and to take whatever health risks they want. But the bioidentical hormones have shown time and time again that in low dosages they are pretty safe healthwise. There is not a mass epidemic of people dying who are on TRT but again thats the bioidentical hormone of the body ....id rather see someone use 300mg of testosterone longterm than ever use 50mg of anavar longterm 1000 times over. But again i have always had people test bloodwork smack dab in the middle of things....but 99% of people dont do that....they get off and go "hey im healthy"...your supposed to be healthy off. Its the 48 weeks of the year that you were on that counted toward longterm health.
Madg you said something about guys using testosterone but you are using guys with insane genetics as your argument. If a guy has small arms genetically using anavar and deca over testosterone is not going to fix that. Guys like Serge Nubret with 6.5 inch wrists and 21 inch arms dont fall out of trees. Thats a genetic anomaly. So what are guys with subpar genetics supposed to do? Give up and take up golf? They are trying to even the playing field by putting on enough size they can compete.

Regardless of the above...everyone in this forum can do whatever they want with their look and their health. They can take chances and they can be uber health conscious. I dont have any stock in Testosterone Cypionate so i dont care what anyone does. I just have the opinion I have formed from looking at so many bbers health markers over the years that i have drawn the conclusion that testosterone in low dosages has been much safer than drugs thought of as "safe". Myself i would rather take tren and var and 150mg of test a week if it was a perfect world. But its not and that route would have dire consequences. I can differentiate my preference for a certain look over what i have come to know is the healthiest route of performance enhancement drugs. I truly believe as we go along here in years people are going to start seeing the validity of the parent compound in its safety compound instead of mans tweaking of that parent compound (which all came from the 60's pretty much)
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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Fucking. Awesome. Post.

Damn.

@DOGGCRAPP random question but have you seen much with pregnenolone/progesterone helping guys, especially quality of life/with BPH issues?
 

Sides

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People are stating their opinion on how they personally want to look and how they think others should look and then stating those opinions as facts. I'd love to come in here and say "Tren, and Halotestin are totally safe"....and if you went according to the mirror they are. According to the mirror Tren and Halotestin are the safest drugs you can take. You look awesome, rock hard and lean. Obviously the insides tell a different story. People dont want to use testosterone because they dont like the look. I GET IT! But if you want to get down to brass tacks and look at things longevity and health wise....the truth is pretty darn obvious. Madg you are using guys from the 70's and 80's as your arguing point on health and look. And your darn right...Padilla and Coe and Ross and a whole bunch of other guys in the 70's and 80's went low test and high anabolics. But you are putting "health" in that equation. Well lets look at that shall we? Padilla was freaking awesome. I saw him compete in the Night of Champions back in early 90's in Yates first show. Coe was a teenage phenom. You are taking guys with phenomenal genetics and making an argument on what they used as the argument. Do you know how many 5'3 bodybuilders tried to look like Padilla? Hundreds of thousands? How many ended up looking like him? 12 maybe? {Priest, Lewis, Henry, Terra, and a handful more)....obviously genetics created that bodybuilder....regardless of his drug choices. But you are leaving out a main cog in all this.....how is what they did healthier? Padilla went the low test high anabolic route and had quadruple bypass in his late 40's. Coe went low test and high anabolics and had quadruple bypass in his 50's. Don Ross went low test high anabolics and dropped dead of a heart attack in his late 40's. A slew of low test high anabolic bodybuilders from the 70's ended up with heart problems.

This isnt going to go well in here at all...AT FREAKING ALL. I do know this.....from looking at (its got to be over 1000 bodybuilders blood work now) that people on low testosterone dosages, and low gh dosages have virtually no changes in their bloodwork. With all PEDS blood pressure must be kept in check but with testosterone in low dosages what you get is a slightly higher hematocrit and a slightly lower HDL and thats about it. Now if you want to talk about Testosterone bloodwork compared to "steroids that are considered safe" bloodwork? Everyone on this thread will be pissed at this but it the g'damn truth....you cannot make the argument because "you like a look"....and want to continue having that look and will argue vehemently because you want to use "X compound"...instead of testosterone when "X compound" is not even remotely as safe as testosterone. For example Anavar for some fracked up reason got a reputation as "SAFE" all these years. Its about the unsafest long time usage drug out there. And virtually any person in here doing 50mg of anavar a day who checks their bloodwork about 6 weeks in on that will quickly see lipid numbers that would make a doctor say "WTF are you doing?".....I keep running into physique competitors online that have coaches having them use anavar year round and their HDL is plummetted and LDL/TRigs skyrocketed. Because these coaches are telling them "Anavar is healthy and safe".....Ive had about 6 guys in this last year who are physique guys who have used anavar longterm who i told to get coronary calcium scores......they are all coming back escalated. The last guy is 34 years old and his CCS is 383. 383!!! the guy is 34! Thats a cardiac event waiting to happen by the time he is 38-42.

I had another bodybuilder who was known for his longterm usage of "healthy anabolics" {One of the most famous people in the sport}.....come to me because his coronary calcium score was 340 and wondered if I could get him down from that. So much for mans tweaking of the parent hormone (testosterone) to make it safer. If anyone took the time to get bloodwork smack dab in the middle of these so called safe anabolics (noone does that)....they would be shocked to see that a great many of them are really detrimental to longterm lipid health. It is what it is. <---is that statement going to be popular in this forum....hell no its not....some people are seething right now reading that because again 'they want a certain look" and here comes Dante Trudel pissing on the apple cart.

So in my opinion this all comes down to an opinion on a look that you want vs what you are wanting to risk health wise...it really does. My opinion is this: if health is the highest importance in this sport. Low dose testosterone and low dose gh are the two things you can do pretty much the rest of your life and not have very detrimental aspects to your bloodwork. If someone was going to add an anabolic to that then maybe primobolan could be added to that (but again that would have to be proven out by bloodwork). Thats why i have stated time and time again in this forum.....try to spend the longer periods that you ar putting on size with a test dosage (while keeping bp in check) with low dose gh (so you can eat enough food to get larger but remain lean) and again with maybe primobolan....and if you got a contest in sight "YOU GOT TO DO WHAT YOU GOT TO DO"....and that means using drugs that are in no way conducive to health. Never ever use orals offseason...only precontest or before something important you want to look good for and keep that usage fairly short.
If thats not acceptable for someone then so be it.....they are free to do whatever they want and to take whatever health risks they want. But the bioidentical hormones have shown time and time again that in low dosages they are pretty safe healthwise. There is not a mass epidemic of people dying who are on TRT but again thats the bioidentical hormone of the body ....id rather see someone use 300mg of testosterone longterm than ever use 50mg of anavar longterm 1000 times over. But again i have always had people test bloodwork smack dab in the middle of things....but 99% of people dont do that....they get off and go "hey im healthy"...your supposed to be healthy off. Its the 48 weeks of the year that you were on that counted toward longterm health.
Madg you said something about guys using testosterone but you are using guys with insane genetics as your argument. If a guy has small arms genetically using anavar and deca over testosterone is not going to fix that. Guys like Serge Nubret with 6.5 inch wrists and 21 inch arms dont fall out of trees. Thats a genetic anomaly. So what are guys with subpar genetics supposed to do? Give up and take up golf? They are trying to even the playing field by putting on enough size they can compete.

Regardless of the above...everyone in this forum can do whatever they want with their look and their health. They can take chances and they can be uber health conscious. I dont have any stock in Testosterone Cypionate so i dont care what anyone does. I just have the opinion I have formed from looking at so many bbers health markers over the years that i have drawn the conclusion that testosterone in low dosages has been much safer than drugs thought of as "safe". Myself i would rather take tren and var and 150mg of test a week if it was a perfect world. But its not and that route would have dire consequences. I can differentiate my preference for a certain look over what i have come to know is the healthiest route of performance enhancement drugs. I truly believe as we go along here in years people are going to start seeing the validity of the parent compound in its safety compound instead of mans tweaking of that parent compound (which all came from the 60's pretty much)

This post should be required reading for anyone contemplating chemical physique enhancement. Best post I've seen or read in a long time.

Test is best, always has been, always will be, at least as far as healthy bodybuilding goes, if there is such a thing, and of course up to a certain point. Nobody can claim that 2g per week of test is healthy. But test should be the one essential component to any cycle, for health reasons if nothing else. The side effects of test are known, and can be managed fairly easily, again up to a certain point. What that point is, will differ from individual to individual. But test should be the bedrock of any cycle, and the one requirement for the long-term user.

Of course you can always add other compounds into the mix, and they will all come with their own list of benefits and risks, and they will work better or worse from one individual to another. But at least for libido and health, not to mention strength and size, test should always be the first building block on your own personal construction project.
 

pickapeck

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At 59 I guess I should be dead then. At one point some years ago I took one of the Gold's Gym old time photos and went through then to see who was dead or alive and who had serious health issues. I guess I can't know all about all of them but hey I tried. I then added in some BBers from the later 80s and 90s. Then I did my best to compare to normal populations. There was definitely more heart disease as I recall but that seemsed to be worse the later in time they were active and the funny thing was that they were younger. So, at least in my mind, as time went on the sport became more and more fringe as far as drug use. It was also more popular in the earier time frame to take long off periods. I appear healthy according to bloods and annual EKG and a stress test or 2. I'm sure if the med pros did every test under the sun they could find something. Anyways... patiently waiting for my shit to fail.

Hey DT, what do you do? Seems you are still using according to recent videos.
 

DOGGCRAPP

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At 59 I guess I should be dead then. At one point some years ago I took one of the Gold's Gym old time photos and went through then to see who was dead or alive and who had serious health issues. I guess I can't know all about all of them but hey I tried. I then added in some BBers from the later 80s and 90s. Then I did my best to compare to normal populations. There was definitely more heart disease as I recall but that seemsed to be worse the later in time they were active and the funny thing was that they were younger. So, at least in my mind, as time went on the sport became more and more fringe as far as drug use. It was also more popular in the earier time frame to take long off periods. I appear healthy according to bloods and annual EKG and a stress test or 2. I'm sure if the med pros did every test under the sun they could find something. Anyways... patiently waiting for my shit to fail.

Hey DT, what do you do? Seems you are still using according to recent videos.

If thats to me.....since 2008 2009 (except for a month or two in which i experimented with 7 mg tren Every other day many years ago) Ive been on nothing but doctor prescribed Testosterone. Anywhere from 180 to 240mg a week. I have also used 1.3ius of gh for a number of years. The last few years I have been getting larger and larger while getting leaner (which is honestly kind of alarming me because I really dont want scale weight going up) because of a few compounds I have been using that are outside of the regular toolbox and non hormonal but work no doubt about it. {Cant talk about those on this forum....but yes TRT and then later on adding low dose Vitamin G is 99.9 % of what I have done over the last 11-12 years}...I am 4 years to 60 so I dont take chances
 

0893

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If thats to me.....since 2008 2009 (except for a month or two in which i experimented with 7 mg tren Every other day many years ago) Ive been on nothing but doctor prescribed Testosterone. Anywhere from 180 to 240mg a week. I have also used 1.3ius of gh for a number of years. The last few years I have been getting larger and larger while getting leaner (which is honestly kind of alarming me because I really dont want scale weight going up) because of a few compounds I have been using that are outside of the regular toolbox and non hormonal but work no doubt about it. {Cant talk about those on this forum....but yes TRT and then later on adding low dose Vitamin G is 99.9 % of what I have done over the last 11-12 years}...I am 4 years to 60 so I dont take chances

I know you said you cant talk about it on this forum, but where can we find more information?
 

Dens228

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If thats to me.....since 2008 2009 (except for a month or two in which i experimented with 7 mg tren Every other day many years ago) Ive been on nothing but doctor prescribed Testosterone. Anywhere from 180 to 240mg a week. I have also used 1.3ius of gh for a number of years. The last few years I have been getting larger and larger while getting leaner (which is honestly kind of alarming me because I really dont want scale weight going up) because of a few compounds I have been using that are outside of the regular toolbox and non hormonal but work no doubt about it. {Cant talk about those on this forum....but yes TRT and then later on adding low dose Vitamin G is 99.9 % of what I have done over the last 11-12 years}...I am 4 years to 60 so I dont take chances
Is that 1.3 iu's of GH per day? I'm 57 and low dose test but have never used GH but strongly considering it.
 

DOGGCRAPP

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Is that 1.3 iu's of GH per day? I'm 57 and low dose test but have never used GH but strongly considering it.
yes per day with usually one day off on the weekend
 

[email protected]

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@madg :
I bet some of the things you say are correct. I am by far not as advanced as you are in the sports.
But you always have to keep in mind that each and every individual reacts different to those supersupps.
Example being myself:
ive cutted on 4,5iu HGH, 150mg Test and 50mg var. My bloodpressure during the 10 weeks where ive used var was between 135-142/~75. (even on bp medication)
some time off and now i am "lean bulking" (forgive me dante for this word, i just want to say that i am not eating like a maniac just to put on 3 pounds a week) on 6-7iu HGH, 600mg Test and 6-10iU Huma preworkout (so more hgh and more test should be higher bp, right?
my bp dropped to 120-130/~70, no change in BP medication.
 

pickapeck

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Well. It can be either actually. Both are just measurements.

1mg GH = ~3iu
That's about right but who knows with some of these generics because the weight would be indicative of purity and % water, the last of which is dependent upon how efficient the lyophilization process is.
 

Matsuo Munefusa

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That's about right but who knows with some of these generics because the weight would be indicative of purity and % water, the last of which is dependent upon how efficient the lyophilization process is.
Yeah I agree who knows with underground. I’ve always gotten great results with TP’s GH though 🙂
 

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