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OK. BOYS AND GIRLS.. its back.. sorry to those who have asked.. i ma late getting a few of these up.. but since i am laid up from surgery i figured why not lol.. as always the interview may be altered to condense it but it will not change the content.. my questions are in bold and he is in small print...
the gentleman in question is a competitor (a very good one) in the 80's.. he competed in the nabba/wabba org which had many greats like joe meeko , jeff king.. he also competed in the aau orgs also in their day.. i met him through a mutual friend and we talk a few times a month.. he agreed to let me print this as he is pretty distant from the scene today but still a big, big boy in his 50's.. so lets start..
HEY THANKS FOR DOING THIS.. MANY GUYS HAVE HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT THE 80'S AND HOW THING HAVE CHANGED IN REGARDS TO TRAINING AND AND EVEN THE CYCLES AND DIET.. SO THIS SHOULD HELP A BIT..
no problem .. glad to do it.. i am not well versed on what goes on today so this should answer some of my questions too (laughs)
TELL ME... WHY YOU DROPPED OUT OF COMPETITION.. YOU WERE WELL KNOWN IN A FEW MAGAZINES AND WERE STILL COMPETITIVE.. WHAT HAPPENED?
well.. many things.. i was locked into a organization and was pretty happy with them.. but weider was really where it as at.. the next step ya know.. i saw how many were being treated who tried to make that jump and weider would kinda punish them.. make them re qualify and just being silly about shit.. i really did not have anything to prove anymore.. i went up against many great guys in the organization i was with.. i planned on just taking time off and working at my new job at the time.. well.. i never went back (laughs)
DID YOU STILLL TRAIN?
oh hell yes!! that never changes.. once a bodybuilder .. always a bodybuilder.. many leave but always come back..
WOULD YOU SAY IT STILL DEFINES YOU?
yes.. but so does numerous other things.. husband.. father.. grandpa.. bodybuilder.. but it is always there..
LOOKS LIKE YOU STILL HIT IT HARD..
yeah.. no other way is there? i go in 4 days a week.. i train like i always did.. fast.. hard.. and many sets baby! i am actually a bit thicker now oddly enough..
YEAH I WAS SURPRISED.. SO LETS BE HONEST.. STILL HITTING THE SAUCE?
(laughs) well.. i would be lying if i said no.. but still small amounts.. again, that rarely leaves all together..
ARE WE TALKING HRT DOSAGES? OR DO YA ADD A BIT TO THE MIX? BEING IN THE 50'S YA GOT TO HAVE SOME HELP! (WE BOTH LAUGH)
yep.. i have a doc that helps me.. i am on 200 mgs a week of prescribed test cyp.. and i get 2 ius of gh a day.. now.. since i agreed to be honest.. i do rotate other things in there.. like dbol or deca.. i dont up the test.. never liked it much..
IN OUR PAST TALKS YOU SAID THAT YOU DID NOT HEAR MUCH ABOUT THE USE OF TEST FROM YOUR FELLOW COMPETITORS..
no .. not until '86 or so.. i mean some used it in small amounts but no body raved about it.. i know some that were starting to experiment with upping it.. that is when ya started to see more bitch tits hit the scene.. that right there was enough to make me not use it much.. but most were hitting the dbol and deca routine.. with anavar thrown in .. maybe test in small amounts.. 200mgs or so i guess.. but not me..
WHAT WAS A TYPICAL CYCLE? DID YOU HAVE THE OFF SEASON ECT?
no not really.. i did a bit of guest posing.. so i was always trying to look good.. no bulking up really.. so i was using deca.. some dbol.. at some times i tried anadrol.. but made me lose my appetite... and anavar.. and if i could get a deal on primo i would use it also.. what ever was available i made work..
THAT WAS EARLY ON.. WHAT ABOUT LATER.. ANYTHING DIFFERENT?
well.. later on we all loved to go to europe because we could get lots of different things.. that made competing over there worth while (laughs).. when parabolan came out i made sure i had quite a bit of it.. loved that stuff.. best i looked was with parabolan.. had a good connection for it,, in europe they were all using it.. it quickly became a favorite.. we had bags full of those little gems (laughs)
SO GIVE ME NUMBERS.. DOSAGES..
oh boy.. ill try and remember... hhmm.. if i was doing a old stand by i would do anywhere from 40 to 60 mgs of dbol a day.. added to 400-500 of deca.. that was a old standby.. i would gradually add in the dbol to about 60 mgs or so then start tapering back down.. lasted about 12 weeks.. then i would just do deca and maybe primo.. primo would be about 400 mgs a week..
WE HEAR SO MUCH ABOUT HOW YOU GUYS NEVER USED VERY MUCH .. BUT THE DOSAGES YOU GAVE ARE ON THE HIGH SIDE.. 60 OF DBOL.. 500 OF DECA.. SEEMS A BIT HIGHER THAN I EXPECTED..
we re human.. even back then the urge to increase was always there.. we werent any different than today..
JOE MEEKO ONCE TOLD ME THAT HE ONLY DID 200 TEST CYP AND 200 DECA AND HE COMPETED IN THE HIGH 220'S..
(laughs real loud).. joe said that? are you kiddin me..? thats just .. well.. i wont say.. yes i will .. thats a f@!@# lie.. oh well.. i was there.. joe did what we did and then some..
SO WHAT WERE THE CYCLES LIKE TOWARDS THE END OF YOUR CAREER..?
well.. once i started parabolan that was my mainstay.. i would do three amps a week of that.. then 400-500 primoblan.. 40 mgs of anavar.. and then i started about 200 mgs of test in there.. why? i dont know but everyone started doing it so i did.. but the test dosages were creeping up with many..
DID YOU SEE A CHANGE IN PHYSIQUES WITH THE INCREASE IN THE TEST DOSAGE?
well.. not for the better.. some guys were having a real hard time cutting with it.. they tried to taper it before the shows.. but many just were scared to come off it.. so i saw a lot of blurry guys who normally werent.. so i left it alone..
IN THE 70;'S AMNY CLAIMED THAT TEST WAS A DIRTY COMPOUND.. DO YOU AGREE..?
yes and no.. in small amounts its great.. it makes us a man baby! but in large amounts i think its shit.. just my opinion.. i liked my deca.. i loved me parabolan... i like dbol.. i did nt really care about the rest..
SO YOU EVER HEAR OF ANYONE USING INSUILIN OR GROWTH HORMONE..?
HMM.. well it was talked about in regards to insulin in the last couple of year i was competing.. there was the belknap factor that everyone was talking about.. he was such a freak.. but the whole growth hormone thing i know people were whispering about.. i never tried it either back then..
DID YOU WITNESS THE CHANGE IN PHYSIQUES AFTER YOU RETIRED?
yeah.. wow.. i was big.. joe was big.. jeff was big .. but about 4 years after i took off they exploded.. thats when i hear about the insulin and growth hormone being used in big amounts.. look.. we werent boy scouts.. i see some of these web sites saying how great the 70's or 80's were.. but we abused the shit like anyone else.. it was warfare in that regard.. i am sure that if i would have added 15 pounds more by using the other stuffi could have gone and mopped up.. but my time was over.. but let me state.. that i think if this use of insulin and growth hormone adds , say, 14 -20 pounds of muscle over time.. well add that to the physiques i competed with and they would kill those today from what i have seen..
HOW DID YOU TRAIN BACK THEN? I HAVE SEEN OLD ARTICLES.. BUT LETS HEAR IT FROM YOU..
well.. most of us trained the same way.. i did lots of sets.. lots of reps.. and trained fast.. samir.. danny (padilla).. joe.. we all trained very hard.. pretty fast.. get as much done as possible in the shortest time.. we did alot of super sets.. giant sets.. you name it.. it got crazy.. there seems to be alot of emphasis on moving alot of weight today from what i see in my gym.. we have quite a few competitors in the gym i am at.. those joints will be ruined in no time.. i would hate to be those guys in their 50's.. train and exhaust the muscle..
DO YOU STILL TRAIN THAT WAY NOW? SAME SETS I MEAN
hhmm.. more or less.. maybe if i used all the time i would... but i have to make adjustments.. but i am soaked in sweat when i leave the gym.. i see guys taking 1 hours to do 10 sets of chest.. workin the joints i say.. i do chest and back together and can do 15-20 sets 10-15 reps really squeezing of each in under a hours.. if i am not talking too much (laughs)
GIVE ME TYPICAL CHEST WORKOUT..
ok.. last night.. i did the hammer decline press.. love that machine.. i put three plates on it and did 12 slow reps.. waited exactly 1 minute.. did another 12.. i kept doing this until i only got 7.. dont know.. maybe 5-6 sets.. then went and did the pec dec and supersetted it with flat dumbell presses with one minute between supersets.. both about 10-12 reps.. really squeezing on the pec dek.. the dumbell was at a faster pace.. 4 super sets.. then i ran the rack, so to speak, on machine dips.. i put pin in and did 10 reps.. move it up again and did 10 without resting.. kept going untill i could not get 10.. then rested a minute and reversed it.. took a drink and went on to back..
NO INJURIES?
no.. not really.. sometimes i get a ache or two.. nothing too bad.. it leaves.. but i am still able to train how i want..
EVER THOUGHT OF COMPETING AGAIN? I JUST SAW ROBB HARROP COMPETING IN THE MASTERS NATIONALS.. YOU KNEW HIM..
really?!?! robb?? how did he look?
GREAT.. BIGGER THAN EVER.. LOOKED REALLY CONDITIONED.. LOOKED GREAT .. DID WELL..
wow.. thats great.. yeah.. i still think about doing a masters show.. stay tuned (laughs).. i think of it often..
YOU STATED THAT YOU ADDIN ANABOLIC NOW AND THEN EVEN TODAY.. EXPLAIN..
well i told ya what i get from the doctor.. but i will add in 30-40 mgs a day of dbol for 4 weeks.. then add in a fast acting deca .. they call it aahh.
NPP?
yeah (laughs) sorry.. i get it from a buddy of mine.. i will do that 4 to 6 weeks.. the back to the test only for 6-8 weeks..
STILL KEEPING THE HGH AT 2IUS?
yeah.. i got some stuff recently and added it to my hgh.. just 1 ius though so the amount was 3 ius.. but i actually think i felt it (laughs)
PART 2 TOMORROW
the gentleman in question is a competitor (a very good one) in the 80's.. he competed in the nabba/wabba org which had many greats like joe meeko , jeff king.. he also competed in the aau orgs also in their day.. i met him through a mutual friend and we talk a few times a month.. he agreed to let me print this as he is pretty distant from the scene today but still a big, big boy in his 50's.. so lets start..
HEY THANKS FOR DOING THIS.. MANY GUYS HAVE HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT THE 80'S AND HOW THING HAVE CHANGED IN REGARDS TO TRAINING AND AND EVEN THE CYCLES AND DIET.. SO THIS SHOULD HELP A BIT..
no problem .. glad to do it.. i am not well versed on what goes on today so this should answer some of my questions too (laughs)
TELL ME... WHY YOU DROPPED OUT OF COMPETITION.. YOU WERE WELL KNOWN IN A FEW MAGAZINES AND WERE STILL COMPETITIVE.. WHAT HAPPENED?
well.. many things.. i was locked into a organization and was pretty happy with them.. but weider was really where it as at.. the next step ya know.. i saw how many were being treated who tried to make that jump and weider would kinda punish them.. make them re qualify and just being silly about shit.. i really did not have anything to prove anymore.. i went up against many great guys in the organization i was with.. i planned on just taking time off and working at my new job at the time.. well.. i never went back (laughs)
DID YOU STILLL TRAIN?
oh hell yes!! that never changes.. once a bodybuilder .. always a bodybuilder.. many leave but always come back..
WOULD YOU SAY IT STILL DEFINES YOU?
yes.. but so does numerous other things.. husband.. father.. grandpa.. bodybuilder.. but it is always there..
LOOKS LIKE YOU STILL HIT IT HARD..
yeah.. no other way is there? i go in 4 days a week.. i train like i always did.. fast.. hard.. and many sets baby! i am actually a bit thicker now oddly enough..
YEAH I WAS SURPRISED.. SO LETS BE HONEST.. STILL HITTING THE SAUCE?
(laughs) well.. i would be lying if i said no.. but still small amounts.. again, that rarely leaves all together..
ARE WE TALKING HRT DOSAGES? OR DO YA ADD A BIT TO THE MIX? BEING IN THE 50'S YA GOT TO HAVE SOME HELP! (WE BOTH LAUGH)
yep.. i have a doc that helps me.. i am on 200 mgs a week of prescribed test cyp.. and i get 2 ius of gh a day.. now.. since i agreed to be honest.. i do rotate other things in there.. like dbol or deca.. i dont up the test.. never liked it much..
IN OUR PAST TALKS YOU SAID THAT YOU DID NOT HEAR MUCH ABOUT THE USE OF TEST FROM YOUR FELLOW COMPETITORS..
no .. not until '86 or so.. i mean some used it in small amounts but no body raved about it.. i know some that were starting to experiment with upping it.. that is when ya started to see more bitch tits hit the scene.. that right there was enough to make me not use it much.. but most were hitting the dbol and deca routine.. with anavar thrown in .. maybe test in small amounts.. 200mgs or so i guess.. but not me..
WHAT WAS A TYPICAL CYCLE? DID YOU HAVE THE OFF SEASON ECT?
no not really.. i did a bit of guest posing.. so i was always trying to look good.. no bulking up really.. so i was using deca.. some dbol.. at some times i tried anadrol.. but made me lose my appetite... and anavar.. and if i could get a deal on primo i would use it also.. what ever was available i made work..
THAT WAS EARLY ON.. WHAT ABOUT LATER.. ANYTHING DIFFERENT?
well.. later on we all loved to go to europe because we could get lots of different things.. that made competing over there worth while (laughs).. when parabolan came out i made sure i had quite a bit of it.. loved that stuff.. best i looked was with parabolan.. had a good connection for it,, in europe they were all using it.. it quickly became a favorite.. we had bags full of those little gems (laughs)
SO GIVE ME NUMBERS.. DOSAGES..
oh boy.. ill try and remember... hhmm.. if i was doing a old stand by i would do anywhere from 40 to 60 mgs of dbol a day.. added to 400-500 of deca.. that was a old standby.. i would gradually add in the dbol to about 60 mgs or so then start tapering back down.. lasted about 12 weeks.. then i would just do deca and maybe primo.. primo would be about 400 mgs a week..
WE HEAR SO MUCH ABOUT HOW YOU GUYS NEVER USED VERY MUCH .. BUT THE DOSAGES YOU GAVE ARE ON THE HIGH SIDE.. 60 OF DBOL.. 500 OF DECA.. SEEMS A BIT HIGHER THAN I EXPECTED..
we re human.. even back then the urge to increase was always there.. we werent any different than today..
JOE MEEKO ONCE TOLD ME THAT HE ONLY DID 200 TEST CYP AND 200 DECA AND HE COMPETED IN THE HIGH 220'S..
(laughs real loud).. joe said that? are you kiddin me..? thats just .. well.. i wont say.. yes i will .. thats a f@!@# lie.. oh well.. i was there.. joe did what we did and then some..
SO WHAT WERE THE CYCLES LIKE TOWARDS THE END OF YOUR CAREER..?
well.. once i started parabolan that was my mainstay.. i would do three amps a week of that.. then 400-500 primoblan.. 40 mgs of anavar.. and then i started about 200 mgs of test in there.. why? i dont know but everyone started doing it so i did.. but the test dosages were creeping up with many..
DID YOU SEE A CHANGE IN PHYSIQUES WITH THE INCREASE IN THE TEST DOSAGE?
well.. not for the better.. some guys were having a real hard time cutting with it.. they tried to taper it before the shows.. but many just were scared to come off it.. so i saw a lot of blurry guys who normally werent.. so i left it alone..
IN THE 70;'S AMNY CLAIMED THAT TEST WAS A DIRTY COMPOUND.. DO YOU AGREE..?
yes and no.. in small amounts its great.. it makes us a man baby! but in large amounts i think its shit.. just my opinion.. i liked my deca.. i loved me parabolan... i like dbol.. i did nt really care about the rest..
SO YOU EVER HEAR OF ANYONE USING INSUILIN OR GROWTH HORMONE..?
HMM.. well it was talked about in regards to insulin in the last couple of year i was competing.. there was the belknap factor that everyone was talking about.. he was such a freak.. but the whole growth hormone thing i know people were whispering about.. i never tried it either back then..
DID YOU WITNESS THE CHANGE IN PHYSIQUES AFTER YOU RETIRED?
yeah.. wow.. i was big.. joe was big.. jeff was big .. but about 4 years after i took off they exploded.. thats when i hear about the insulin and growth hormone being used in big amounts.. look.. we werent boy scouts.. i see some of these web sites saying how great the 70's or 80's were.. but we abused the shit like anyone else.. it was warfare in that regard.. i am sure that if i would have added 15 pounds more by using the other stuffi could have gone and mopped up.. but my time was over.. but let me state.. that i think if this use of insulin and growth hormone adds , say, 14 -20 pounds of muscle over time.. well add that to the physiques i competed with and they would kill those today from what i have seen..
HOW DID YOU TRAIN BACK THEN? I HAVE SEEN OLD ARTICLES.. BUT LETS HEAR IT FROM YOU..
well.. most of us trained the same way.. i did lots of sets.. lots of reps.. and trained fast.. samir.. danny (padilla).. joe.. we all trained very hard.. pretty fast.. get as much done as possible in the shortest time.. we did alot of super sets.. giant sets.. you name it.. it got crazy.. there seems to be alot of emphasis on moving alot of weight today from what i see in my gym.. we have quite a few competitors in the gym i am at.. those joints will be ruined in no time.. i would hate to be those guys in their 50's.. train and exhaust the muscle..
DO YOU STILL TRAIN THAT WAY NOW? SAME SETS I MEAN
hhmm.. more or less.. maybe if i used all the time i would... but i have to make adjustments.. but i am soaked in sweat when i leave the gym.. i see guys taking 1 hours to do 10 sets of chest.. workin the joints i say.. i do chest and back together and can do 15-20 sets 10-15 reps really squeezing of each in under a hours.. if i am not talking too much (laughs)
GIVE ME TYPICAL CHEST WORKOUT..
ok.. last night.. i did the hammer decline press.. love that machine.. i put three plates on it and did 12 slow reps.. waited exactly 1 minute.. did another 12.. i kept doing this until i only got 7.. dont know.. maybe 5-6 sets.. then went and did the pec dec and supersetted it with flat dumbell presses with one minute between supersets.. both about 10-12 reps.. really squeezing on the pec dek.. the dumbell was at a faster pace.. 4 super sets.. then i ran the rack, so to speak, on machine dips.. i put pin in and did 10 reps.. move it up again and did 10 without resting.. kept going untill i could not get 10.. then rested a minute and reversed it.. took a drink and went on to back..
NO INJURIES?
no.. not really.. sometimes i get a ache or two.. nothing too bad.. it leaves.. but i am still able to train how i want..
EVER THOUGHT OF COMPETING AGAIN? I JUST SAW ROBB HARROP COMPETING IN THE MASTERS NATIONALS.. YOU KNEW HIM..
really?!?! robb?? how did he look?
GREAT.. BIGGER THAN EVER.. LOOKED REALLY CONDITIONED.. LOOKED GREAT .. DID WELL..
wow.. thats great.. yeah.. i still think about doing a masters show.. stay tuned (laughs).. i think of it often..
YOU STATED THAT YOU ADDIN ANABOLIC NOW AND THEN EVEN TODAY.. EXPLAIN..
well i told ya what i get from the doctor.. but i will add in 30-40 mgs a day of dbol for 4 weeks.. then add in a fast acting deca .. they call it aahh.
NPP?
yeah (laughs) sorry.. i get it from a buddy of mine.. i will do that 4 to 6 weeks.. the back to the test only for 6-8 weeks..
STILL KEEPING THE HGH AT 2IUS?
yeah.. i got some stuff recently and added it to my hgh.. just 1 ius though so the amount was 3 ius.. but i actually think i felt it (laughs)
PART 2 TOMORROW
Thank you for the wonderful insight bro.
