Only problem is that margins are tiny on food and commercial kitchens/restaurants are regulated and inspected and there is lots of waste working with perishables
©ALL CONTENT OF THIS WEBSITE IS COPYRIGHTED AND CANNOT BE REPRODUCED WITHOUT THE ADMINISTRATORS CONSENT 2002-2024
.gif "IP Gear")
Supplements you can't buy cheap online
- Thread starter Thebigone
- Start date
Only problem is that margins are tiny on food and commercial kitchens/restaurants are regulated and inspected and there is lots of waste working with perishables
Get this shit. In CA to sell meal preps from another company you actually have to be employed by that company. The laws here are absurd. I mean the company can technically put you on payroll but what a stupid law.
I thought of this but you are already well informed with supplements. I'm selling to the average Joe who knows nothing. Who wouldn't think to compare ingredients to something similar for cheaper. I used to manage a max muscle and I built people's trust so much they bought whatever I told the to and kept re buying. And that's Max Muscle which is hard to sell to the general public. We will see how it goes. Luckily I have a 1yr lease with two (3) year options so if it bombs the first year I'll just write everything off.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2003
- Messages
- 4,665
QUOTE=Blitz-Test;2472499]Not sure where you got this information, literally every supplement company buys bulk powder, mixes it and throws a fancy label on.
Supplements are not regulated. Literally all you have to do to protect yourself is put a disclaimer saying your claims have not been validated by the FDA.[/QUOTE]
Thats total bullshit. 99.5% of supplement companies are marketing companies who dont go near the making of their own supplements. They hire custom manufacturers like myself to make their products for them. Supplements arent regulated? Ever have an FDA visit? Takes a week sometimes of pouring thru batch records and MMR's and third party testing procedures. The ONLY and I mean ONLY people not getting FDA visits are people who are making supplements in their 'garage' illegally and trying to fly under the radar. If you are a legit manufacturer the FDA visits your facility and goes thru everything with a fine tooth comb. Ive been thru 6 of these already. It takes a stack of paper about 4 inches high now to make a certain supplement and {again if you are legitimate and not a small time shyster} every single ingredient that comes into your facility has to be quarantined and then sent out for 3rd party testing for potency / identity / purity...before it is allowed into the general inventory. It then has to be checked and double checked by various supervisors thru the whole manufacturing process. And then tested 1-2x again (especially the end product has to be sent out again to be tested before it is allowed for sale)....this whole chain of events including all your SOP's have to be shown to the FDA during their tour of your facility....For the FDA I have three full time highly trained quality assurance people working for me just for the mountain of paperwork and 3rd party testing purposes....so I have no idea in heck where you are getting your information. The FDA sure as hell dont pat you on the back and say "great job"....they are a regulatory agency that always is looking for you doing something wrong.
Supplements are not regulated. Literally all you have to do to protect yourself is put a disclaimer saying your claims have not been validated by the FDA.[/QUOTE]
Thats total bullshit. 99.5% of supplement companies are marketing companies who dont go near the making of their own supplements. They hire custom manufacturers like myself to make their products for them. Supplements arent regulated? Ever have an FDA visit? Takes a week sometimes of pouring thru batch records and MMR's and third party testing procedures. The ONLY and I mean ONLY people not getting FDA visits are people who are making supplements in their 'garage' illegally and trying to fly under the radar. If you are a legit manufacturer the FDA visits your facility and goes thru everything with a fine tooth comb. Ive been thru 6 of these already. It takes a stack of paper about 4 inches high now to make a certain supplement and {again if you are legitimate and not a small time shyster} every single ingredient that comes into your facility has to be quarantined and then sent out for 3rd party testing for potency / identity / purity...before it is allowed into the general inventory. It then has to be checked and double checked by various supervisors thru the whole manufacturing process. And then tested 1-2x again (especially the end product has to be sent out again to be tested before it is allowed for sale)....this whole chain of events including all your SOP's have to be shown to the FDA during their tour of your facility....For the FDA I have three full time highly trained quality assurance people working for me just for the mountain of paperwork and 3rd party testing purposes....so I have no idea in heck where you are getting your information. The FDA sure as hell dont pat you on the back and say "great job"....they are a regulatory agency that always is looking for you doing something wrong.
Last edited:
Thats total bullshit. 99.5% of supplement companies are marketing companies who dont go near the making of their own supplements. They hire custom manufacturers like myself to make their products for them. Supplements arent regulated? Ever have an FDA visit? Takes a week sometimes of pouring thru batch records and MMR's and third party testing procedures. The ONLY and I mean ONLY people not getting FDA visits are people who are making supplements in their 'garage' illegally and trying to fly under the radar. If you are a legit manufacturer the FDA visits your facility and goes thru everything with a fine tooth comb. Ive been thru 6 of these already. It takes a stack of paper about 4 inches high now to make a certain supplement and {again if you are legitimate and not a small time shyster} every single ingredient that comes into your facility has to be quarantined and then sent out for 3rd party testing for potency / identity / purity...before it is allowed into the general inventory. It then has to be checked and double checked by various supervisors thru the whole manufacturing process. And then tested 1-2x again (especially the end product has to be sent out again to be tested before it is allowed for sale)....this whole chain of events including all your SOP's have to be shown to the FDA during their tour of your facility....For the FDA I have three full time highly trained quality assurance people working for me just for the mountain of paperwork and 3rd party testing purposes....so I have no idea in heck where you are getting your information. The FDA sure as hell dont pat you on the back and say "great job"....they are a regulatory agency that always is looking for you doing something wrong.[/QUOTE]
What about this bigger faster stronger documentary?
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vxrTMYXpZo"]The Truth About American Bodybuilding Supplements - YouTube[/ame]
maybe what you are describing is for a GMP facility but it seems only the top brands claim to be made in a GMP facility?
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2003
- Messages
- 4,665
Here is the problem. It is the reason you are seeing Europa and GNC going downhill. I think Europa has receded by 25% and I think I saw GNC has lost 33% of its value in the last year. Bodybuilding.com just let go of something like 15% of its workforce and its not doing well either. When you sell direct to consumer you can make a healthy profit margin. What these entities did for a long time was really rake companies over the coals to get into distribution and you would make a product for 20 bucks and have to sell them to these distributors for 24 dollars to "get popular" and into distribrution....on top of that they would expect you to spend a grip on advertising (dont even get me talking about free fill etc etc etc)....so a few things have happened.
a) Shysters came into the supplement industry and ruined its reputation by amino spiking and selling bunk ingredients and junk....so these guys ruined the supplement industry in the last few years
b) Amazon has taken over and supplement companies are now backlashing at these supplement distributors for raking them over the coals for little profits...Amazon is kicking these guys asses (and also the brick and mortar store)
I set up TN in 2003 to buy direct from the dairies or their packaging mediaries or the source manufacturer itself....which is unlike virtually everyone else in this business....we are the ultra rare supplement company that is the custom manufacturer of their own products..... in addition to that......its hilarious to hear all these other companies of late say "and we are 3rd party tested"...LOLOL REALLY? YOU WERE SUPPOSED TO DO THAT THE WHOLE TIME!!! Its your job! Its a great catch phrase of late for these companies and we have been doing it for so many years we forgot about it because we thought everyone was doing it back years ago....but it looks like virtually nobody but we were.....we have been testing since day one. Anyway I digress......that costs a boatload of money...a huge amount of money....especially when you have a massive inventory. I try to stay out of these things but there is a site that is lauded on pro muscle many times I have to bite my tongue on every time its mentioned (nonhuman just touted them in one of his posts)....the owner of that company has been thru the mill with fraud/arrests/lawsuits its too long to even name.....yet he has a supplement company that EVERYONE knows he is not testing the supplements because it would be astronomical the cost of testing all the ingredients he carries....it couldnt be done....so the testing costs a great deal of money. So here is a learning experience for you guys....if there is say a fat burner with like 13 ingredients in it...every one of those 13 ingredients need to be tested by a third party lab individually and then at the end when the product is completed. Alot of these tests run 150-300 dollars...so right there not even counting the bottle/top/label/advertising/capsules/ingredient cost/manufacturing cost/labor....that guy is looking at 1000's and 1000's of dollars JUST in the testing of that product before it is put together and then again after its manufactured.
So to get back to your point Thebigone....when we run a 10% sale...its a huge deal in my company because our profit margins are much slimmer than others profit margins. Every supplement company that has become multi millionaire companies what did they make their millions on?
Capsules! You make a capsule product for 13 bucks and sell it for 49.95 to 64.95 and make a grip of money. Think Gaspari ....when he was selling 90 million in sales a year was it from Myofusion? No halodrol and novedex and products like that made him millions. IForce when they were going strong....what were they selling? Pro hormones = capsules. BSN was innovative with coming out with pre workout NO products and they captured the market with that and made huge profits but by and large any other company that has become massive in profits had some kind of small capsulized product that they made millions on........so with that long diatribe i get to my point.
My profit margin is small. I really cannot wholesale heavy powder products to you under the TN name. I mean if you were moving large volume yea i probably could try to work something out but I cant knock off huge percentages to a mom and pop store....its not in the profit margin. Thats why this whole supplement industry is upside down. I sell a legitimate tested Isolate on my site and it is a legitimate tested isolate and you can see the lab assay right underneath the heading if you hit the green tab. Meanwhile this place over there will sell a "100% whey protien" and get near my price but its 25% isolate and 25% concentrate and the rest is sugar/dairy creamer and sawdust and because they manufactured it for much less than I did they can give you a great cut over to you wholesale. So we can talk about this some more if you want or another option is to make your own house brand and push it heavily in your stores which i can do with ease...but again this comes with minimums.....i have to make at least 500 jugs of one size and one flavor of proteins to account for all the paperwork and labor my employees have to do for the FDA. The FDA has absolutely destroyed the small time entrepeneur...its sucks....in the old days i could make you 6 jugs of cho 6 jugs of strawberry 6 jugs of vanilla etc etc and we could increase as you see fit and how sales go....nowadays? no way in heck...not with all the new regulations....most custom manufacturers their minimums are 5000 jugs of one size and one flavor.....ill do 500.... but again the cost is usually too much for the smalltime entrepenuer to get into the game...thats why virtually everyone who does what you do goes with Europa or Lonestar to stock their store
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2003
- Messages
- 4,665
[/QUOTE]
What about this bigger faster stronger documentary?
maybe what you are describing is for a GMP facility but it seems only the top brands claim to be made in a GMP facility?[/QUOTE]
I didnt even look at the video as I can gather what its going to portray. Ill say this. No doubt about it there are shysters in the industry that are going to try to do stuff in their kitchen or garage. Take this to the bank though....there is no way in hell that any "company" who starts selling a large amount of product is NOT going to get visited by the FDA. So if someone wants to take the chance to make something in their garage and try to make some money that is their risk to do so. If things take off they will be on the radar and they will be shut down so freaking fast the day the FDA comes and visits. What do you think happened to the East Coast supplement distributor last year who is no longer in business. I actually inquired into buying him until he sent me the trouble he was in and I was out in a heartbeat. FDA came in and it was a done deal
What about this bigger faster stronger documentary?
maybe what you are describing is for a GMP facility but it seems only the top brands claim to be made in a GMP facility?[/QUOTE]
I didnt even look at the video as I can gather what its going to portray. Ill say this. No doubt about it there are shysters in the industry that are going to try to do stuff in their kitchen or garage. Take this to the bank though....there is no way in hell that any "company" who starts selling a large amount of product is NOT going to get visited by the FDA. So if someone wants to take the chance to make something in their garage and try to make some money that is their risk to do so. If things take off they will be on the radar and they will be shut down so freaking fast the day the FDA comes and visits. What do you think happened to the East Coast supplement distributor last year who is no longer in business. I actually inquired into buying him until he sent me the trouble he was in and I was out in a heartbeat. FDA came in and it was a done deal
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2010
- Messages
- 5,559
What about this bigger faster stronger documentary?
maybe what you are describing is for a GMP facility but it seems only the top brands claim to be made in a GMP facility?[/QUOTE]
I didnt even look at the video as I can gather what its going to portray. Ill say this. No doubt about it there are shysters in the industry that are going to try to do stuff in their kitchen or garage. Take this to the bank though....there is no way in hell that any "company" who starts selling a large amount of product is NOT going to get visited by the FDA. So if someone wants to take the chance to make something in their garage and try to make some money that is their risk to do so. If things take off they will be on the radar and they will be shut down so freaking fast the day the FDA comes and visits. What do you think happened to the East Coast supplement distributor last year who is no longer in business. I actually inquired into buying him until he sent me the trouble he was in and I was out in a heartbeat. FDA came in and it was a done deal[/QUOTE]
What they did Dante, the guy bought some creatine and some other powders to show how "easy" it is to start a sup company. They basically mixed the powders with cutting agents and then capped them in the kitchen. Put the in bottles, put a label on it, bam you have a supplement company. Not how it works in the real world. I really don't see guys making tens of thousands of caps in their kitchen and being in B&M stores. Maybe they can sell online, but no big online store will carry their stuff.
I'm a seller on Amazon (3p and vendor) not supplement related but I have deep knowledge of how Amazon works.
The Health & Household category on Amazon is not gated. I can buy some bulk creatine, mix it with some crystal light. package it and put a nice label on it and have it in front of millions of people on Amazon in minutes.
By the time or if you get big enough you should be smart enough to switch to a legit manufacturer or upgrade your own facility
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2010
- Messages
- 5,559
Hence me saying no B&M store or big online store, meaning like a bbcom place
My buddy started selling glass bottles from his bedroom, now has a 10k sq ft warehouse, employs 25 people with a payroll of a little over $500k, so yeah it can be done.
Most people aren't smart enough though, you know that. They want the quick buck.
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2002
- Messages
- 2,329
Years ago my brother and I owed a small electronics store. I was also doing freelance work as a videoagrapher/ and a head audio tech at the time. In electronics, the profit margin is very small... very small.....we couldn't compete, lost everything because our egos kept telling us we could do it...
anyway... Not trying to be debbie downer, but anyone that thinks they're smart/wealthy enough to compete against Amazon or walmart, you're 100% fooling yourself. Not talking to the OP, just in general. There is no way in hell a small store can compete against them.
You need a lot more than just a retail brick and mortor, you need something that cannot be offered at Amazon/Walmart in any way shape or form, and you have to know marketing.
Good luck, and before you even put a penny into anything, do a hell of a lot more research.
anyway... Not trying to be debbie downer, but anyone that thinks they're smart/wealthy enough to compete against Amazon or walmart, you're 100% fooling yourself. Not talking to the OP, just in general. There is no way in hell a small store can compete against them.
You need a lot more than just a retail brick and mortor, you need something that cannot be offered at Amazon/Walmart in any way shape or form, and you have to know marketing.
Good luck, and before you even put a penny into anything, do a hell of a lot more research.
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2003
- Messages
- 4,665
Where do you get your information from? I keep seeing you post things matter of factly on this board in different posts and alot of it is straight out false. What is your deal?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=14113001
"Three of the categories that are restricted on Amazon and seem to be the MOST desired for approval, are Beauty, Health & Personal Care and Grocery.
These also happen to be the hardest of the restricted categories to get approval in
The reason why it is so hard, is because Amazon requires that a seller have multiple invoices from an approved wholesaler, and sometimes they require proof of having a legal business."
I sell supplements on amazon....the process i had to go thru was this:
We needed category approval for Health and Personal care, so we submitted a letter from the manufacturer (us), test results, and our FDA registration number.
Sort of on topic...do you think the current conglamorates of today (google, facebook, amazon etc.) Should be broken up with anti trust legislation?
They seem to be pirates in a sense..destroying small business. I know, i know..free markets. This wont end well for the American ecomomy...
They seem to be pirates in a sense..destroying small business. I know, i know..free markets. This wont end well for the American ecomomy...
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2010
- Messages
- 5,559
No they shouldn't.
They aren't destroying small business. At the end of the day it comes down to value proposition, it's that simple. You can tell me they are undercutting everyone's prices bla bla bla, which further proves my point. People are finding "value" in low price. Small business has to offer a value that these cannot or will not. What is it? If you find out, you'll be a trillionaire!
I own a small 2 person office, and offer the same product as the other 28 offices in my small county. I'm doing good for myself, not great, but good. We have some large offices here in the same industry that employ 25+ people, but people leave them to come to my office. Why? I offer them a value proposition, not necessarily in the form of saving money. When they come in, they are greeted by name, talked to as a person and feel welcomed. These larger offices see them as a bother, resource waster, hassle.
I would not pay twice as much for something, but if it's pretty close, I'll deal with a small business all day long. Many people would, but many small business people treat their customers like shit and wonder why they're going to these conglomerates. Answer is simple, get treated like shit and pay $5 or get treated like shit and pay $7.50. You're getting treated like shit either way, might as well save $$$
Breaking these business' up as a form of punishment for being successful is utter nonsense. If they're breaking the law somehow, go for it. If they're successful and people are butthurt because of it, take a long walk off a short bridge with that nonsense. This isn't directed at you, I just had this conversation with a 19yr old snowflake about how big business' are destroying our country. Yep, a person with ZERO life experience took an economics class at the local junior college (got a B in btw) and is now an economics expert!
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2013
- Messages
- 732
They can't do it the same way they went after Standard Oil. It's even harder than when they repeatedly went after Microsoft. Google, Facebook, and Amazon are service based companies at their foundation (search engine, social media, 3rd party e-commerce and cloud computing). While they have products they sell now, all of their products are sold in a competitive market.
But what prevents them being labeled as a monopoly is that they allow for any business to thrive off their services, including small businesses. Anybody/company can sell products on Amazon through their platform. PPC advertising and utilizing google analytics will make your small business more visible and profitable and Facebook ads are the most cost effective way to advertise per impression and ctr than any other form of advertising available.
Sure you can't compete with the prices of amazon or other websites, but that's not only reason why small businesses fail. Small businesses (and large ones) fail because they are slow to keep up with market trends and don't pivot fast enough.
I work at a firm that does digital and content marketing and SEO for small and large businesses and nearly all of them come in wanting to spent large portions of their marketing budgets on dated things like newspaper, radio and tv advertisements. That doesn't work anymore and it still costs a ton for what you get in return.
Every time I talk to someone IRL talk about opening a gym or starting a personal training business and talk about building their brand the way things used to be done by passing out flyers and business cards and going door to door or into businesses, I cringe. They could make a much greater ROI with a couple Facebook ads and even kill it for free by putting out engaging content with geo-targeted filters.
- Joined
- May 9, 2010
- Messages
- 313
I made a post about it but got not many replies, I found this super cheap wholesaler online, minimum order 100 items. It's called g4supplements, nobody know bout them? I'm so tempted to order for my store, but I'm afraid it's a scam.
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2013
- Messages
- 732
Yea, checked them out actually. Would have posted, but I know nothing about them either. Never heard of them before you posted actually.
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2010
- Messages
- 5,559
Come on bro, door-to-door with flyers is where the BIG money is at!!!!!!!!!!
hahahaha, I have the phone book and newspaper people constantly trying to get me to advertise with them. I haven't in 10 yrs and never will. Granted my population is older, let's be honest, they're dying off, so I need the younger people. Facebook has been amazing for me, and I don't pay a dime!
I have my business page and share content with friends and it's public, so a lot of people see it. I THRIVE from referrals, do NOT really want walk ins at all! They are the one time policy shoppers that are gone at the renewal. So the $60 I make from commission is really $25 once everything is accounted for...not worth it.
A referral averages about $150+/yr on commission and as long as they stay (referrals typically stay minimum 3 yrs) it's great. Then they refer people and so on. Facebook has been a big help there honestly
Similar threads
Staff online
-
A50#Old School Moderator
Members online
- Js118
- juiceddunk2.0
- plane
- blackjack
- taslajrisi
- BOZZ
- mackpatti
- A50#
- criticalben1
- Zokim
- Dlrob27
- Chipper Jones78
- Doitagain
- luki7788
- dany23x
- Eguz22
- johnjuanb1
- j4ever
- Heath82
- Cerberus777
- danieltx
- shawn nutter
- gunz78
- aDw32
- dxteran
- SB Labs
- TransAmWS6
- Gunsmith
- Palifter
- Kauto_star
- airman
- btails
- Tomcat200
- Hulk69
- kastro
- bobby c
- Klime
- Riley*
- rhinomight
- EnhancedFatGrappler
- Durro
- gojimmgo
- BIGEZ
- SOUR DIESEL
- rebelmc
- Xplicit
- Drax
- Bravohero
- Dens228
- Onidus
Forum statistics
