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Synthetine Vs Acetyl L Carnitine

Elvia1023

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Lot's of guys have been getting into l-carnitine recently which is good to see. It's one of my favourite supplements. I get great results from synthetine. I have used oral versions in the past with decent results but nothing great. Anyway recently I conducted an experiment to see what I would get from high dosed ALCAR.

Before I start it's worth highlighting the fact all the studies on l-carnitine tend to be done on the various oral forms of it. I am going off my head now (and I am tired) but I have read anywere from 15 to 75% absorption. This may be one of the reasons some of the studies done on it have mixed findings. However, most of them have great results and this is especially common for acetyl l-carnitine and l-carnitine tartrate. I could post 20 solid studies showing training and/or health improvements.

I have experimented with different doses of synthetine but 3ml (600mg) is a very common one pre workout for me. I haven't used synthetine (an odd shot) for awhile so decided to try ALCAR whilst having a break from all the injections.

I bought 180 caps of ALCAR and have been dosing 2000-3000mg pre workout so a high dose. I definitely noticed the difference when adding it in. I get a good mood boost and feel it is assisting training and some fat loss but it's literally night and day difference from synthetine. I don't really get any of the visual effects such as improved vascularity. So whilst it is a worthwhile supplement and I am sure even higher doses would be more beneficial I don't get a fraction of the physique benefits I do from synthetine.

Just a little experiment I done and I wasn't even going to post about it but figured I should. It makes me question some of the higher absorption numbers I read about ALCAR as again I was using 3000mg pre workout. I only have about 30 caps left so I may do 5000mg for the last 3 days just to see if that makes a difference.

mrzpud.jpg
 

boxer cam

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I'm a big fan of oral L carnitine, but after using both acetyl and tartrate over the last 10 years, I find the tartrate the better of the two for fat loss. I also don't believe one large dose is the best way to take the oral version. I put 1000mg-1500mg of cheap powder in every litre of water I drink over the day, for a total of 5g per day. I buy amino acid flavouring separately to fix the taste, as my water has Bcaa, creatine, taurine and gaba added to it depending on the time of the day I'm making a bottle up.
 

Elvia1023

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I'm a big fan of oral L carnitine, but after using both acetyl and tartrate over the last 10 years, I find the tartrate the better of the two for fat loss. I also don't believe one large dose is the best way to take the oral version. I put 1000mg-1500mg of cheap powder in every litre of water I drink over the day, for a total of 5g per day. I buy amino acid flavouring separately to fix the taste, as my water has Bcaa, creatine, taurine and gaba added to it depending on the time of the day I'm making a bottle up.

Sounds good. I have used tartrate in the past but can't remember the dose. I think I used 2g as that is the common dose in studies and has been shown to have good effects. This was just a little experiment to see how I responded now. It's relatively cheap so I am sure mega dosing it throughout the day would be a worthwhile experiment. I am going back on synthetine soon and will be posting about that as I have something interesting planned. I have had all these ideas in my head but haven't had the time to post about them.

Incidentally I used to use GABA pre bed and that stuff was mental. I had the powder so used quite high doses. If I took too much I would feel weird but once I fell asleep it would be incredible :D
 

boxer cam

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Sounds good. I have used tartrate in the past but can't remember the dose. I think I used 2g as that is the common dose in studies and has been shown to have good effects. This was just a little experiment to see how I responded now. It's relatively cheap so I am sure mega dosing it throughout the day would be a worthwhile experiment. I am going back on synthetine soon and will be posting about that as I have something interesting planned. I have had all these ideas in my head but haven't had the time to post about them.

Incidentally I used to use GABA pre bed and that stuff was mental. I had the powder so used quite high doses. If I took too much I would feel weird but once I fell asleep it would be incredible :D

I only added gaba back in a month ago, after not using it in years. My insomnia was so bad I was ready to go have a sleep study done, but the gaba has made a huge difference for me. I haven't used melatonin before, so I'm about to try stacking them together and see how my sleep improves.

Can't wait to see what you have planned for your next synthetine run. I've only tried some vet grade injectable carnitine once and was disappointed for the cost and having to inject, compared to just using oral. Let myself get too fat last year and weight is coming of easy at moment (well not the last 3 weeks, feeding superdrol with 1.2kg of lamb a day), but going to try synthetine middle of this year when fat loss stalls.
 

Elvia1023

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I only added gaba back in a month ago, after not using it in years. My insomnia was so bad I was ready to go have a sleep study done, but the gaba has made a huge difference for me. I haven't used melatonin before, so I'm about to try stacking them together and see how my sleep improves.

Can't wait to see what you have planned for your next synthetine run. I've only tried some vet grade injectable carnitine once and was disappointed for the cost and having to inject, compared to just using oral. Let myself get too fat last year and weight is coming of easy at moment (well not the last 3 weeks, feeding superdrol with 1.2kg of lamb a day), but going to try synthetine middle of this year when fat loss stalls.

Melatonin is fantastic for me. I have played about with doses. Last time I was on iherb I wasn't even planning to get it but a brand come up on promo and it sounded nice. I like cherries and they are cherry flavour tabs dosed at 10mg so a high dose. Decided to try them and they are great. My gf keeps stealing them though :D Just checked and the brand is 21st century and they were only very cheap. Gonna buy more of them as they are probably the best ones I have used.
 

suppdude

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Although both carnitine salts, they work differently. If going for the physique changes, one would need l-carnitine and it needs to be dosed with carbs, or in a lot of cases, insulin. This is for oral l-carnitine.

ALCAR isn't going to do much for fat loss at all but it is one of the better aids for overall health.

PLCAR would be a better option if one is wanting fat loss when deciding between ALCAR, PLCAR, and LCLT.
 

KillerStack

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Just tried melatonin for the first time in years. It actually
gives me shorter, more fitful sleep. And I'm not alone after looking around on the net. Maybe the dose is too high, 3mg. Studies have shown .3mg to be effective for sleep.

Also bought some ALCAR. Gives a tense feeling at 1 gram dose. Some complain of neck stiffness with it (like with excessive choline supps).
It can also "cause" depression in some.
Again, the dose is probably too high for me.
 

Gunsmith

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In reference to the injection L-Carnitine , at 600mg a day did you notice a significant difference if fat loss as opposed to not having it.??

I have a bunch here and I'm planning to run it at 800-1000mg a day split into two doses , half before fasted cardio at 4:30 am then the other half pre workout at 4:00pm. I'm considering adding 3iu Humulin-R with it as from what I've read that adds a huge difference in fat loss.
 

rmtt

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I just started. Today was dose #2 of 600ml injected 30 minutes preworkout.

I know in the thread I posted about synthethin.....most mention using carbs or insulin. But Phidas mentioned having good results with it without using slin when he first started out.

Only thing I'm doing is taking it....then start sipping on my intra which has HBCD in it in the way to the gym.

I track everything I eat....so this is the only variable I've added aside from a daily 250 calorie deficit that I started 3 weeks ago. My tracking app is showing a "trend" of .4lbs per week weight loss.

So I will see what happens with this added in. Phidas did mention the more you used, the better the results. I think I remember him saying he hit 10ml a day at one point.

Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk
 

Elvia1023

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Just tried melatonin for the first time in years. It actually
gives me shorter, more fitful sleep. And I'm not alone after looking around on the net. Maybe the dose is too high, 3mg. Studies have shown .3mg to be effective for sleep.

Also bought some ALCAR. Gives a tense feeling at 1 gram dose. Some complain of neck stiffness with it (like with excessive choline supps).
It can also "cause" depression in some.
Again, the dose is probably too high for me.

Melatonin is not for everyone. Like anything everyone responds differently. Some people don't get anything from it. Others only need a low dose such as 1mg for strong effects. I have used 1, 3, 5 and 10mg per night and much prefer the higher doses. My gf loves the 10mg ones I have now. ALCAR is the same. I have just took 5000mg pre workout and I get no side effects.

In reference to the injection L-Carnitine , at 600mg a day did you notice a significant difference if fat loss as opposed to not having it.??

I have a bunch here and I'm planning to run it at 800-1000mg a day split into two doses , half before fasted cardio at 4:30 am then the other half pre workout at 4:00pm. I'm considering adding 3iu Humulin-R with it as from what I've read that adds a huge difference in fat loss.

I just started. Today was dose #2 of 600ml injected 30 minutes preworkout.

I know in the thread I posted about synthethin.....most mention using carbs or insulin. But Phidas mentioned having good results with it without using slin when he first started out.

Only thing I'm doing is taking it....then start sipping on my intra which has HBCD in it in the way to the gym.

I track everything I eat....so this is the only variable I've added aside from a daily 250 calorie deficit that I started 3 weeks ago. My tracking app is showing a "trend" of .4lbs per week weight loss.

So I will see what happens with this added in. Phidas did mention the more you used, the better the results. I think I remember him saying he hit 10ml a day at one point.

Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk

Yes I notice a big difference from 600mg. I think 400mg is a nice amount for most but basically the higher you go the better. For cost effectiveness 600mg is a good dose. As I mentioned in that synthetine thread I would guess 70% of the time I have used synthetine I didn't use slin so as Phidias posted it is not needed. Big A also used it heavily without insulin. Now 3iu regular slin will assist so if you can add that in then great.

GS your protocol sounds great and that's what I always recommend. Basically 50% pre fasted cardio and 50% pre training if using higher amounts. Otherwise (lower total dose) I would just use the whole dose pre training. Again use with slin if you can but it is not needed. To get the most out of everything though you can't go wrong adding in a little slin.

I have actually done a thread in the past were I high dosed synthetine and syntheselen for I think 4 days. I done 9ml of both and the results were fantastic. That and all the recent post have had me thinking and I will post a thread I think you guys will enjoy and can take part in as well. More on that very soon! I will be using a high dose soon and I am bulking so will be adding in insulin and plenty of intra carbs as well.
 

boxer cam

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Although both carnitine salts, they work differently. If going for the physique changes, one would need l-carnitine and it needs to be dosed with carbs, or in a lot of cases, insulin. This is for oral l-carnitine.

ALCAR isn't going to do much for fat loss at all but it is one of the better aids for overall health.

PLCAR would be a better option if one is wanting fat loss when deciding between ALCAR, PLCAR, and LCLT.

Why is PLCAR better for weight loss than LCLT?
All my readings on the subject come back to PLCAR is better for heart and LCLT for fat loss.

When you say needs to be dosed with carbs or in a lot of cases insulin, what do you mean? The only case for exogenous insulin with carnitine is in a carbless state, when the body isn't releasing endogenous insulin.
 

suppdude

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Why is PLCAR better for weight loss than LCLT?
All my readings on the subject come back to PLCAR is better for heart and LCLT for fat loss.

When you say needs to be dosed with carbs or in a lot of cases insulin, what do you mean? The only case for exogenous insulin with carnitine is in a carbless state, when the body isn't releasing endogenous insulin.

LCLT is better for performance and saturating the muscle with carnitine.

I mean, when you take oral l-carnitine or LCLT, you need to be dosing with carbs/something that is going to give an insulin spike.
 

boxer cam

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LCLT is better for performance and saturating the muscle with carnitine.

I mean, when you take oral l-carnitine or LCLT, you need to be dosing with carbs/something that is going to give an insulin spike.

Yes, it's common knowledge that insulin (exogenous or endogenous) helps transport carnitine into muscles. But you wrote in a lot of cases insulin, which sounded like there are multiple reasons to use exogenous insulin with it.

Was hoping you could give more info on what makes PLCAR better for fat loss?
 

suppdude

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Yes, it's common knowledge that insulin (exogenous or endogenous) helps transport carnitine into muscles. But you wrote in a lot of cases insulin, which sounded like there are multiple reasons to use exogenous insulin with it.

Was hoping you could give more info on what makes PLCAR better for fat loss?

Yes, with insulin as well. Typically, you're going to shoot slin, then take in carbs, so that works.

PLCAR helps provide crucial Krebs intermediates to produce ATP, works as an antioxidant, helps burn fat by altering the Acyl-CoA:Acetyl-CoA ratio, and helps to transport fatty acids into the inner mitochondria to be burned for fuel (not my own definition). But with PLCAR altering the Acyl-CoA:Acetyl-CoA ratio, this is the main course of action for its ability to burn fat.

ALCAR mainly is used for cognitive and mental clarity.
 

boxer cam

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Yes, with insulin as well. Typically, you're going to shoot slin, then take in carbs, so that works.

PLCAR helps provide crucial Krebs intermediates to produce ATP, works as an antioxidant, helps burn fat by altering the Acyl-CoA:Acetyl-CoA ratio, and helps to transport fatty acids into the inner mitochondria to be burned for fuel (not my own definition). But with PLCAR altering the Acyl-CoA:Acetyl-CoA ratio, this is the main course of action for its ability to burn fat.

ALCAR mainly is used for cognitive and mental clarity.

All those benefits are listed for LCLT as well.

I'm asking about the difference between PLCAR and LCLT, not ALCAR.
 

suppdude

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All those benefits are listed for LCLT as well.

I'm asking about the difference between PLCAR and LCLT, not ALCAR.

LCLT is used more for performance and recovery. If androgen receptor density preservation/recovery is your goal. If muscle carnitine loading and subsequent substrate shifts is your goal, take it with high carb meals.
 

boxer cam

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LCLT is used more for performance and recovery. If androgen receptor density preservation/recovery is your goal. If muscle carnitine loading and subsequent substrate shifts is your goal, take it with high carb meals.

You obviously don't understand my questions or don't know the answers, so I will stop asking you. Thanks.
 

Lifted78

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Definitely enjoyed this post Elvia. I feel as though this might have been mentioned before, however can't locate the exact post, but my question is in regards to missing a pin.

Since carbs are recommended to take along side the injection, would it not be recommended to pin before bed? I guess the question comes down to if it is better to miss one day of pinning or to squeeze it in before bed, even though no carb source will be taken along with it?
 

G-FLUX

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Massive fan of higher dosing Synthetine...works like a charm!

Generally never seen anything out of the oral forms/variations
 

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