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T3 - How Long?
- Thread starter yardrock
- Start date
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- Jul 22, 2002
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- 2,765
what makes you even want to do this, if your using t3 at all with no AAS under 15% bodyfat you probably shouldnt ever go unre 25mcg.. 100mcg constantly isnt a good idea, personally ive used it at 25mg at a constant rate for 10 week with no probs, since I tried it with up/down dosing exa: 15mcg, 50, 25, 100, 0, 0, 0, 50, 25, 0, 100, ect..
no rule to it really except get a couple days break with none at all, and dont stay at a high dose too long, Im not sure how great it works but it has "worked" for me, I heard it through another bber and experimented with it, not saying its the "right way" but its a way to use it.. I wouldnt push t3 though its a nice drug to add but nothing to keep that prominent
no rule to it really except get a couple days break with none at all, and dont stay at a high dose too long, Im not sure how great it works but it has "worked" for me, I heard it through another bber and experimented with it, not saying its the "right way" but its a way to use it.. I wouldnt push t3 though its a nice drug to add but nothing to keep that prominent
- Joined
- May 29, 2003
- Messages
- 312
As Dave said, I would not use T3 at all unless you are on a cycle or it will chew up as much muscle as fat.
I think T3 is best used to shed the last few pounds of stubborn fat. It can make a difference and you dont have to be on it long. Otherwise, cycle your doses with equal off time to on time. You do not want to suppress your thyroid. If you do, and you think you are too fat now, wait till you have a suppressed - the weight will never come off.
I think T3 is best used to shed the last few pounds of stubborn fat. It can make a difference and you dont have to be on it long. Otherwise, cycle your doses with equal off time to on time. You do not want to suppress your thyroid. If you do, and you think you are too fat now, wait till you have a suppressed - the weight will never come off.
The proper way to take T3 for someone who does not have a thyroid problem is thus:
25mcg - days 1 - 5
50mcg - days 6 - 10
75mcg - days 11 - 15
100 mgc - days 16 - 20
75 mcg - days 21 - 25
50 mcg - days 26 - 30
25 mcg - days 31 - 35
You want to pyramid up so that your own production of thyroid hormone does not get shut off before you've replaced it with enough exogenous hormone. As you taper down the thyroid will be alerted to the sudden drop of hormone and restart you own production. The thyroid (as compared to the testes, for example) can start and stop production (or even tweak production) very fast. That's why you add/subtract hormone every 5 days.
I had a dog w/ a thyroid problem and the vet gave me the full rundown. This does not apply to Synthroid - only T3 (Cytomel, Cynomel).
You should no repeat this cycle until you've "rested" the thyroid for at least 1 full month.
By the way - this protocol in conjunction with Clen is sure to produce a great look for the beach or stage!
25mcg - days 1 - 5
50mcg - days 6 - 10
75mcg - days 11 - 15
100 mgc - days 16 - 20
75 mcg - days 21 - 25
50 mcg - days 26 - 30
25 mcg - days 31 - 35
You want to pyramid up so that your own production of thyroid hormone does not get shut off before you've replaced it with enough exogenous hormone. As you taper down the thyroid will be alerted to the sudden drop of hormone and restart you own production. The thyroid (as compared to the testes, for example) can start and stop production (or even tweak production) very fast. That's why you add/subtract hormone every 5 days.
I had a dog w/ a thyroid problem and the vet gave me the full rundown. This does not apply to Synthroid - only T3 (Cytomel, Cynomel).
You should no repeat this cycle until you've "rested" the thyroid for at least 1 full month.
By the way - this protocol in conjunction with Clen is sure to produce a great look for the beach or stage!
Fullybuilt
Banned
- Joined
- Feb 23, 2004
- Messages
- 1,309
I thought it was supposed to be 2week's on 2weeks off like this
252550507575100100757550502525 then 2week off(eca only) then repeat
252550507575100100757550502525 then 2week off(eca only) then repeat
YARD -
I am not (personally) a big fan of time-off from CLEN either. I find that the results get better over time. In fact, I usually begin my CLEN in May and don't stop again until start of September.
I read a LONG time ago - I mean it may have even been in MM2000 back in the early 1990's, that CLEN loses efficiency as a fat burner after a few weeks, but gains efficiency as an anabolic preparation over time.
But, for me, I still feel it's effects even taking it 2X daily for 4 months. Sure, maybe it loses effectiveness, but I bet it's still better at that point than 99% of what's sold OTC.
Just my opinion. I could drop dead tomorrow too!
I am not (personally) a big fan of time-off from CLEN either. I find that the results get better over time. In fact, I usually begin my CLEN in May and don't stop again until start of September.
I read a LONG time ago - I mean it may have even been in MM2000 back in the early 1990's, that CLEN loses efficiency as a fat burner after a few weeks, but gains efficiency as an anabolic preparation over time.
But, for me, I still feel it's effects even taking it 2X daily for 4 months. Sure, maybe it loses effectiveness, but I bet it's still better at that point than 99% of what's sold OTC.
Just my opinion. I could drop dead tomorrow too!
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2003
- Messages
- 965
DIEZEL666 said:
hehe
No, I don't think there will be one posted. The info in this thread is speculative and I mean no disrespect by saying that, but it is. I have run and have alot of clients that have run T3 for long periods of time with no adverse reaction or loss of production of their thyroid. I am yet to hear of ONE person that has had problems with their thyroid over the past 20 years and please don't site Alfie Newman, either. This is the ONLY name that gets thrown out there when this issue arises.
I still cannot figure out where the thyroid scare originated from.
Skip
Last edited:
- Joined
- Jun 4, 2002
- Messages
- 5,177
Coopie said:
Clen will down regulate the Beta-agonist receptors after about 2wks, due to its long half life (thus steady non-stop blood levels of the drug). That why its sometimes stacked with Ketofin, which prevents this down regulation.
I always believed it had a slight cortisol blocking property, preventing
muscle breakdown. Thats one of the reasons its used in PCT. Its not really anabolic specifically, but being an anti-cortisol that sort of amounts to the same thing.
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2004
- Messages
- 66
DIEZEL666 said:
I think this rumor got started when someone described that they use to use high doses of T3 for a long time, then nothing and then high doses of irradiated iodine to chemically "cure" people of hyperthyroidism.
People also cite that you have to use higher and higher doses of Synthyroid as you go on in therapy. But that's also because you're getting older and the thyroid "ain't what she use to be."
So, I don't think this happens.
- Joined
- Apr 8, 2003
- Messages
- 1,251
i thought i saw somewhere recently that ketafin isnt needed. maybe im wrong. i also read something about taurine with clen. again, not to sure, as i havent been able to spend much time on the boards, just skimming thru. maybe it will jog someones memory.
Fullybuilt
Banned
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- Feb 23, 2004
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- 1,309
Ketofin lets clen work longer to my knowledge. I think you can get like 8weeks or so out of clen before the receptors start downregulating opposed to the normal 2-3weeks. I don't think it has anything to do with T3 though. And taurine(2-3g daily) I hear is recommened on clen for liver protection, but i've also heard that taurine in large doses(2-3g daily) can mess with insulin and cause more fat storage. I can't find the article but its on bodybuilding.com
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2002
- Messages
- 5,878
This should help with any questions. 
RAVER'S T3 ARTICLE
Cytomel (Mexican Cynomel) Synthetic T-3 amd Clenbuterol Stacking - A Quick Weight Loss Solution
This is to be a far from scientific article, one based, rather, in practical experience in losing weight and helping others to lose weight. We are not, on the average, concerned with obese individuals, but those who have packed on an additional 12-25 pounds beyond what was expected in a traditional steroid cycle, and the weeks beyond.
Not all of us will gain this type of weight during a cycle, but those of us who use a high protein / high calorie diet in conjunction with heavy weight lifting, accompanied by a medium to high dosed androgenic (i.e., Dianabol, Testosterone, Trenbolone (Finaplix or Component T-H)) steroid cycle, will almost always pack on an additional 6-20 pounds of pure lard. Granted that Burger King, Hooters, and Papadeux are not on the traditional bodybuilders menu, many of us are either forced, or by personal inclination, choose to indulge in calorie/fat bombs in order to provide the necessary building blocks for muscle.
Who, after all, can subsist on 3-5 protein shakes a day? I certainly can't, and from what I've seen of the advice on the boards, a Whopper or 2 every other day seems to be the prescribed regimen for gaining LBM - the prized Lean Body Mass.
Let's look at that paradigm for a moment - LBM. Sure and granted, we all seek this Holy Grail of Bodybuilding, but too many novices and mid-level bodybuilders alike sacrifice gaining pure muscle mass, in favor of gaining 2-6 pounds of LBM with a $400 - $1100 steriod cycle - all because they want to stay lean.
I might be wrong (it's been known to happen, albeit once a year or so), but if I'm going to invest that kind of dough, I want to see some by God muscle appear. In order to build the kind of muscle I expect from a cycle, I need to consume 4000 - 6000 calories a day, depending upon what I'm doing (Touch Football, Softball, or Indoor Soccer season). Those calories don't ALL go towards LBM, many (sometimes too many) go towards pure lard.
Don't get me wrong, the intensity you apply in the gym does, in fact, burn some serious fat, while at the same time channeling blood, nutrients, and the cherished PUMP to your muscles. However, if you intend to gain serious mass, and here I give kudos to the WarPig, you'll bulk and bloat.
Damnit, the bloat. We don't want to look like Beachballs, we want to look like Footballs - tight, tapered, lean in all the right places. How to eat the necessary calories, the necessary protein, the absolutely essential, energy giving Carbohydrates, without the dreaded bloat?
Here's where the first application of T-3 comes in. I won't quote any studies (there are few), but from personal experience, and the experience of those amatuer and mid-level bodybuilders I've helped, a 25-50mcg dosage of T-3, per day, will help to reduce bloating and water retention, while at the same time enhancing the effect of whatever steriod (androgenic or anabolic) the user chooses. It won't, by any means, keep the mass from piling on, but it will eliminate the dreaded moon face and the hideous stomach bloat.
The second application of T-3 is intended to quickly reduce the blubber produced by a serious mass cycle, and ALWAYS, always includes Clenbuterol. Say, for example, you've done a Raver Cycle - 2g Test, 600mg Deca, and 50-75mg Dbol a day, for 12 weeks. You've devoured 3 Cornish Game Hens at a meal, wolfed down a double Whopper with cheese, but no Mayo every other day, and forced yourself to eat spaghetti with meatballs, cottage cheese, herb-seasoned chicken breasts, pork tenderloins, meatloaf, oatmeal, grits, and eggs, eggs, eggs, tuna tuna tuna, along with 2-3 daily protein shakes.
Trust me - you're fat. You look big as shit in the mirror, but you have no abs, no separation, and no definition. The remedy?
Weigh yourself. For every pound, use 1mcg of T-3. If you weigh 180, and you look fat, use 175mcg of T-3. If you weigh 250, and you look fat, use 250mcg of T-3. Round the dosage down to the nearest 25mcg, and stack Clenbuterol at 5-12 tabs a day for 6 weeks. Follow a CKD diet, such as Body Opus or Animalobolics, do 15-20 minutes of Cardio for the first 3 weeks, and watch the fat shed.
T-3 by itself produces sweat like there's no tomorrow - you'll have wet spots under your arms, under your pecs, in the crack of your ass, and, on your forehead. You might get the shakes.
T-3, stacked with Clenbuterol, will give you all of the above mentioned sweats, along with the shakes...your hands, your legs (stairs are really a bitch), and your neck, on occasion. If you have a job like mine, where the shakes are undesirable, use a potassium supplement or eat 2-3 bananas a day, it will alleviate them.
In summary, T-3 has two uses - eliminating bloat and water retention during a cycle, and rapid weight loss after a cycle. One of the things to remember while using this drug is that it DOES NOT DISCRIMINATE between LBM and pure fat - it eats tissue, period. I used T-3 exactly twice before figuring out that it should never be used without at least 400mg of Testosterone, preferably, in dieting mode, Propionate. A post cycle regimen of 1mcg T-3 per pound of bodyweight, along with Clenbuterol and a 50-100mg / day dosage of Test Prop, will work absolute wonders.
And now, for the Raver challenge (the third in 14 months) - If anyone - ANYONE can produce scientific, verifiable evidence that synthetic T-3 (Cytomel, Cynomel) causes thyroid shutdown in humans after prolonged, high dose use - I'll send them $100. A major medical journal, a study by a top 10 ranked pharmaceutical firm, or verifiable results of a personal medical evaluation (verifiable via documentation and confirmation by the physician) are acceptable. Barring that, let's not hear any further argument about the horrible side effects of T-3
RAVER'S T3 ARTICLE
Cytomel (Mexican Cynomel) Synthetic T-3 amd Clenbuterol Stacking - A Quick Weight Loss Solution
This is to be a far from scientific article, one based, rather, in practical experience in losing weight and helping others to lose weight. We are not, on the average, concerned with obese individuals, but those who have packed on an additional 12-25 pounds beyond what was expected in a traditional steroid cycle, and the weeks beyond.
Not all of us will gain this type of weight during a cycle, but those of us who use a high protein / high calorie diet in conjunction with heavy weight lifting, accompanied by a medium to high dosed androgenic (i.e., Dianabol, Testosterone, Trenbolone (Finaplix or Component T-H)) steroid cycle, will almost always pack on an additional 6-20 pounds of pure lard. Granted that Burger King, Hooters, and Papadeux are not on the traditional bodybuilders menu, many of us are either forced, or by personal inclination, choose to indulge in calorie/fat bombs in order to provide the necessary building blocks for muscle.
Who, after all, can subsist on 3-5 protein shakes a day? I certainly can't, and from what I've seen of the advice on the boards, a Whopper or 2 every other day seems to be the prescribed regimen for gaining LBM - the prized Lean Body Mass.
Let's look at that paradigm for a moment - LBM. Sure and granted, we all seek this Holy Grail of Bodybuilding, but too many novices and mid-level bodybuilders alike sacrifice gaining pure muscle mass, in favor of gaining 2-6 pounds of LBM with a $400 - $1100 steriod cycle - all because they want to stay lean.
I might be wrong (it's been known to happen, albeit once a year or so), but if I'm going to invest that kind of dough, I want to see some by God muscle appear. In order to build the kind of muscle I expect from a cycle, I need to consume 4000 - 6000 calories a day, depending upon what I'm doing (Touch Football, Softball, or Indoor Soccer season). Those calories don't ALL go towards LBM, many (sometimes too many) go towards pure lard.
Don't get me wrong, the intensity you apply in the gym does, in fact, burn some serious fat, while at the same time channeling blood, nutrients, and the cherished PUMP to your muscles. However, if you intend to gain serious mass, and here I give kudos to the WarPig, you'll bulk and bloat.
Damnit, the bloat. We don't want to look like Beachballs, we want to look like Footballs - tight, tapered, lean in all the right places. How to eat the necessary calories, the necessary protein, the absolutely essential, energy giving Carbohydrates, without the dreaded bloat?
Here's where the first application of T-3 comes in. I won't quote any studies (there are few), but from personal experience, and the experience of those amatuer and mid-level bodybuilders I've helped, a 25-50mcg dosage of T-3, per day, will help to reduce bloating and water retention, while at the same time enhancing the effect of whatever steriod (androgenic or anabolic) the user chooses. It won't, by any means, keep the mass from piling on, but it will eliminate the dreaded moon face and the hideous stomach bloat.
The second application of T-3 is intended to quickly reduce the blubber produced by a serious mass cycle, and ALWAYS, always includes Clenbuterol. Say, for example, you've done a Raver Cycle - 2g Test, 600mg Deca, and 50-75mg Dbol a day, for 12 weeks. You've devoured 3 Cornish Game Hens at a meal, wolfed down a double Whopper with cheese, but no Mayo every other day, and forced yourself to eat spaghetti with meatballs, cottage cheese, herb-seasoned chicken breasts, pork tenderloins, meatloaf, oatmeal, grits, and eggs, eggs, eggs, tuna tuna tuna, along with 2-3 daily protein shakes.
Trust me - you're fat. You look big as shit in the mirror, but you have no abs, no separation, and no definition. The remedy?
Weigh yourself. For every pound, use 1mcg of T-3. If you weigh 180, and you look fat, use 175mcg of T-3. If you weigh 250, and you look fat, use 250mcg of T-3. Round the dosage down to the nearest 25mcg, and stack Clenbuterol at 5-12 tabs a day for 6 weeks. Follow a CKD diet, such as Body Opus or Animalobolics, do 15-20 minutes of Cardio for the first 3 weeks, and watch the fat shed.
T-3 by itself produces sweat like there's no tomorrow - you'll have wet spots under your arms, under your pecs, in the crack of your ass, and, on your forehead. You might get the shakes.
T-3, stacked with Clenbuterol, will give you all of the above mentioned sweats, along with the shakes...your hands, your legs (stairs are really a bitch), and your neck, on occasion. If you have a job like mine, where the shakes are undesirable, use a potassium supplement or eat 2-3 bananas a day, it will alleviate them.
In summary, T-3 has two uses - eliminating bloat and water retention during a cycle, and rapid weight loss after a cycle. One of the things to remember while using this drug is that it DOES NOT DISCRIMINATE between LBM and pure fat - it eats tissue, period. I used T-3 exactly twice before figuring out that it should never be used without at least 400mg of Testosterone, preferably, in dieting mode, Propionate. A post cycle regimen of 1mcg T-3 per pound of bodyweight, along with Clenbuterol and a 50-100mg / day dosage of Test Prop, will work absolute wonders.
And now, for the Raver challenge (the third in 14 months) - If anyone - ANYONE can produce scientific, verifiable evidence that synthetic T-3 (Cytomel, Cynomel) causes thyroid shutdown in humans after prolonged, high dose use - I'll send them $100. A major medical journal, a study by a top 10 ranked pharmaceutical firm, or verifiable results of a personal medical evaluation (verifiable via documentation and confirmation by the physician) are acceptable. Barring that, let's not hear any further argument about the horrible side effects of T-3
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