Tapering >>>

[curls-for-girls]

First time using steroids. Using a small dose of Test E 250mg/week for 7 weeks. Ive got Nolvadex on hand incase I begin to have side effects.

I was reading another thread about tapering off your cycle with smaller and smaller doses each week. Would this be recomended for a newbie like myself?or is this a method reserved for people using much higher doses than me.

You guys think that Nolvadex is all I need for PCT? Any insight as to how I should run the cycle from start to finish would be awesome!

Thanks again.

 

[Yohimbe33]

Your dose is too low and the cycle not long enough for that ester IMO. I would suggest doing 500mg per week for 10 weeks. You also would need an anti E, the nolva is for pct.
I would suggest having adex or letro on hand in case of estrogen sides. If you notice anything you can run adex at 0.5mg ED or ;etro at 0.25mg eod.
THen start pct 2 weeks from last pin 40mg nolva per day for 2 weeks and then 20mg per day for 2 weeks.

HCG would be a nice addition during the cycle as I find it helps recovery a lot. I like to run it weeks 3-5 1500iu per week, weeks 7-8 at 1500iu per week and then weeks 11-13 1500iu per week, overlapping for a week with the nolva during pct in week 13.

Additional to nolva during pct is high dose vit c-3,000mg per day, EFA's and tribulus if you like

 

[aphextwin]

I agree your dose is way to low. A minimum of 350mg of Test, bit I recommend 500 mg for first time users. You should be ok at that dose, but keep the nolvadex on hand just in case. As you know, all of our bodies are different.

I recommend you save your money and NOT buy Trib.....it is a waste of cash.

 

[curls-for-girls]

weeks. You also would need an anti E, the nolva is for pct.

I thought that Nolvadex was an Anti-E? and prevented estrogen sides such as gyno...

 

[maldorf]

I think the 250/wk is just fine. Thats what I did on my first cycle and I put on almost 10 solid lbs when it was all said and done. I do think though that you should extend the cycle out to 10 weeks.

As far as tapering, I really think it works best on low dose cycles like yours. I say give it a try and see how it goes. Have the nolvadex on hand in case you feel like its not working for you. For an anti-e youll want some arimidex when youre on cycle. At a dose like that though, you probably wont need it, but its best to be safe.

Tapering I would do something like this:

10 weeks at 250

week 11 200
week 12 150
week 13 100

If after doing this you feel like you need more help, then you can try the nolv.
Since youre doing a long ester, the test has a built in tapering effect of its own too. So after week 13 it will taper off during a 2 week time.

Something like this worked for me in the past.

 

[Yohimbe33]

weeks. You also would need an anti E, the nolva is for pct.

I thought that Nolvadex was an Anti-E? and prevented estrogen sides such as gyno...

Nolva is a SERM, not an anti e-SERMS block the receptor to stop you absorbing estrogen, but don't stop the conversion of testosterone to estrogen. An anti e stops the aromatase process. This is what you want on cycle as the testosterone converts to estrogen.

 

[curls-for-girls]

So I should Run the Arimidex EOD at 0.25mg during the cycle from start to finish?

Im confused now.. I should keep the Nolvadex and Arimidex "on hand" but which one do I take if I begin to see symptoms during my cycle?

 

[Yohimbe33]

So I should Run the Arimidex EOD at 0.25mg during the cycle from start to finish?

Im confused now.. I should keep the Nolvadex and Arimidex "on hand" but which one do I take if I begin to see symptoms during my cycle?

It's up to you. I personally would err on the side of caution if you don't know how you're going to handle testosterone and run the adex at 0.25-0.5mg per day (not EOD, the letro is EOD as it's much stronger), and then taper it off during the cycle or keep it going up to pct, depending on whether you feel you need it.
Then run the nolva for pct as suggested.

Or you can leave it but have it on hand, and if there are any problems (sensitive nips) run the adex and nolva together until it subsides and then run just the adex for the remainder of the cycle up to pct and then nolva for pct.
Reasoning for this is the nolva will block the receptors quickly if there is a problem to reduce your estrogen levels quickly and then the adex will stop the aromatize of the tesotosterone to estrogen.
So in this case the nolva will be the quick fix-like a band aid for a wound, but the adex will be the antibiotic to stop infection.

If you go with letro instead of adex and have the problem described above, nolva reduces the efficacy of letro by about 30% so if using them in conjunction if there is a problem you will have to compensate for this and run the letro at 0.5mg EOD at least, and then drop to 0.25mg EOD when the problem subsides and you stop the nolva

 

[Ehren]

Arimidex works great, but at 250/wk you won't likely need it, as Maldorf said.

The Nolvadex would be for PCT, in case the taper leaves you feeling like you're not recovering well. Taking the nolva in PCT would help get your test levels back up if tapering doesnt allow you to recover. (Id taper then use Nolva after the taper, just my opinion)

Arimidex is an AI and would be good for Estrogen problems during the cycle.

IMO, dont take it unless you need it. A low dose shattered my libido for a couple weeks on higher test that you are using now. But that's better than gyno, so take it if you need it.

 

[curls-for-girls]

Thanks for all the great advice you guys rock

Im shopping for the Arimidex and the stuff is friggin expensive. you guys have any recommendations? I looks like its mostly sold in boxes of 10 pills. How many boxes do u think I need?

 

[EatOrBeEaten1]

Didnt you post this before? Test e doesnt really kick in until 3wk. I would run it at a minium of 12 wk. If your going to run it at 250 a wk I dont see the need to taper. If you really wanted to you could taper wk 12-15 at 125. And as for sides everyones different but at that dose you should be fine.

 

[MikeRoss]

Thanks for all the great advice you guys rock

Im shopping for the Arimidex and the stuff is friggin expensive. you guys have any recommendations? I looks like its mostly sold in boxes of 10 pills. How many boxes do u think I need?

How many mg? if they are 1mg you can break it up into 2s or 4s (won't be an exact dose though)

Good looking first cycle btw. Mine was similar.. test cyp 250 for 10 weeks. put on 12 lbs

 

[matrick]

I like your idea of running that low dose for your first cycle. If I was you though I would use a fast acting compound, test suspension for example, to keep blood labels stable.

Also, given the dosage and the fact its your first cycle I don't think you will need to run any ancillaries over the course of your cycle as you have no idea yet how your body is gonna react to externally induced hormones.

 

[Jrizzle385]

WOW


I usually don't comment on threads giving people cycle advice but this is crazy. The guy wants to use a low dose of testosterone (safer than vitamin c at that dosage most likely), and you guys recommend he jump on 3-4 other drugs that are just plain unnecessary!!!! INSANE! Letrozole? really? That drug carries far worse side effects then what he's already planning to do and it will have absolutely zero benefit to him.

To the thread starter; take what you read around this place with a grain of salt. More drugs are not better. If you need 3-4 drugs to combat the sides of another drug, do you really think you should be using it in the first place? Think about it.

 

[kid1dakota]

We recently discussed this but oh well.

Tapering is an outdated way of winding down your cycle ,but many older guys I know still practice this method and don't even do PCT and swear by it.

I have heard many good arguments for and against tapering or even pyrmiding type cycles.

I am kind of curious if you just read an older steroid book? as your cycle suggestion is pretty old school with the tapering and nolva for estro management. nothing wrong with it,just kind of dated.

today most run one dose for a set number of weeks and use an aromatase inhibitor if needed for estro management.After waiting two weeks(for test enth in this case) you would do a post cycle therapy of HCG and nolva or clomid, your choice based on your research and decision.

good luck bro

 

[Yohimbe33]

WOW


I usually don't comment on threads giving people cycle advice but this is crazy. The guy wants to use a low dose of testosterone (safer than vitamin c at that dosage most likely), and you guys recommend he jump on 3-4 other drugs that are just plain unnecessary!!!! INSANE! Letrozole? really? That drug carries far worse side effects then what he's already planning to do and it will have absolutely zero benefit to him.

To the thread starter; take what you read around this place with a grain of salt. More drugs are not better. If you need 3-4 drugs to combat the sides of another drug, do you really think you should be using it in the first place? Think about it.

If you're very sensitive to estrogen, an anti e is a must. Once you get a bad case of gyno, its not going anywhere without surgery. Since you dont know how you're going to react to testosterone on a first cycle, I would always have anti e on hand at least.

If you are going to go on a low dose then in all likely hood you won't need it. IMO, and this is only MO, you need to go to 500mg per week to get benefits of a cycle, 250mg is a trt dose.
But if you feel more comfortable on 250mg per week go for it. I would still say have an anti e on hand, but there shouldn't be enough estrogen conversion at that dose and you could get away with having nolva on hand in case of problems. If you go to 500mg you need an anti e.

Adex is expensive, letro is better value for money seen as you need to use far less. Adex can also be hard on lipids. Cheapest option is to get some raw powder, then you have enough for susequent cycles. All you do is mix it with 151+ proof alcohol (Barcardi 151 or Stroh Rum 160) to suspend it at 1mg per ml and then draw with insulin pin and take orally.

 

[kid1dakota]

If you're very sensitive to estrogen, an anti e is a must. Once you get a bad case of gyno, its not going anywhere without surgery. Since you dont know how you're going to react to testosterone on a first cycle, I would always have anti e on hand at least.

If you are going to go on a low dose then in all likely hood you won't need it. IMO, and this is only MO, you need to go to 500mg per week to get benefits of a cycle, 250mg is a trt dose.But if you feel more comfortable on 250mg per week go for it. I would still say have an anti e on hand, but there shouldn't be enough estrogen conversion at that dose and you could get away with having nolva on hand in case of problems. If you go to 500mg you need an anti e.

Adex is expensive, letro is better value for money seen as you need to use far less. Adex can also be hard on lipids. Cheapest option is to get some raw powder, then you have enough for susequent cycles. All you do is mix it with 151+ proof alcohol (Barcardi 151 or Stroh Rum 160) to suspend it at 1mg per ml and then draw with insulin pin and take orally.

The human body produces roughly 5-11 mg of test daily for a total of 35-77 mg per week.

250mg of test enanthate minus the esters is 180 mg of test per week.
That is 2 and 1/2 times what the body produces at its peak.Not a TRT dose!!

The average TRT dose is actually 100 mg Test CYP per week which equals 72 mgs of test minus the cypionate ester.Some very very generous doctors,not many will prescribe 200mgs and only if the patient stays within normal range.

So a first cycle of 250 a week is conservative, but you will grow and also see how you react to test.You do not have to go to 500mg first cycle to get benfits

Also Aromasin is proving to be a better A.i.than arimidex being less harsh on lipids,freeing up testosterone etc..

 

[Yohimbe33]

The human body produces roughly 5-11 mg of test daily for a total of 35-77 mg per week.

250mg of test enanthate minus the esters is 180 mg of test per week.
That is 2 and 1/2 times what the body produces at its peak.Not a TRT dose!!

The average TRT dose is actually 100 mg Test CYP per week which equals 72 mgs of test minus the cypionate ester.Some very very generous doctors,not many will prescribe 200mgs and only if the patient stays within normal range.

So a first cycle of 250 a week is conservative, but you will grow and also see how you react to test.You do not have to go to 500mg first cycle to get benfits

Also Aromasin is proving to be a better A.i.than arimidex being less harsh on lipids,freeing up testosterone etc..

Bear in mind, I said the 500mg per week is my opinion-not gospel. My first cycle I started at 300mg per week, and only once I bumped it up to 550mg per week was I happy with my gains. But there is no right or wrong answer. It also depends on your expectations and goals. My opinion is 250mg is too low and not worth shutting your natural test production down over.

As far as trt goes, a lot of doctors will only prescribe 100mg every two weeks, which is just barely enough to maintain sexual activity, but many, that I know personally, self medicate at 200-250mg per week trt, because they were not happy with they're given trt dose.
There are other factors to take into consideration as you age and head towards trt such as higher SHBG levels that affect the efficacy of the trt dose-it's not as cut and dried as simply subtracting the ester weight. It varies from person to person, some can use HCG as trt and are fine others need higher doses of test.

 

[ICU11b]

I wouldnt put a set number on length of cycle, stop when the gains stop. For me HRT dose of 250mg isnt a cycle. 500mg & you know your going to grow. 250 may or may not get you there. You going to chance 250mg on your one & only chance at "first cycle gains".

 

[KTY]

So I should Run the Arimidex EOD at 0.25mg during the cycle from start to finish?

Im confused now.. I should keep the Nolvadex and Arimidex "on hand" but which one do I take if I begin to see symptoms during my cycle?

Thanks for all the great advice you guys rock

Im shopping for the Arimidex and the stuff is friggin expensive. you guys have any recommendations? I looks like its mostly sold in boxes of 10 pills. How many boxes do u think I need?

I thought that Nolvadex was an Anti-E? and prevented estrogen sides such as gyno...

NO offense bro not being a dick but you are a CLASSIC example of someone that is NOT ready to do a cycle. You still have a lot more reading and educating to do! And save your pennies!! Don't be cheap make sure you have ample supply of what you are running and make sure EVERYTHING is ready and in hand prior to starting anything...