Test with HGH

jonesboy · Feb 28, 2007

I have read that hgh can suppress your test levels with long term use. What would be a good protocol for test use and how long should you stay on it if you were planning on using gh for a year or so??

example protocol
4iu a day 2am 2 pw or pm 5/2off
t3 25mg daily
test cyp 250 once a week?

thanks for any feedback...

Running Gun · Feb 28, 2007

I will be starting a similar cycle. Test E 250mg wk, ramp up to 8iu's HGH eod,igf-1 40mg, 100mcg T-4. I think the low test will be a great enhancement while causing minimal shutdown. I plan on staying on the HGH for a year but will only go 12 wks with the test. Don't see why you couldn't continue the test since it a low dose typically prescribed for HRT.

Putin · Mar 1, 2007

Running Gun said:
I will be starting a similar cycle. Test E 250mg wk, ramp up to 8iu's HGH eod,igf-1 40mg, 100mcg T-4. I think the low test will be a great enhancement while causing minimal shutdown. I plan on staying on the HGH for a year but will only go 12 wks with the test. Don't see why you couldn't continue the test since it a low dose typically prescribed for HRT.

lol I cant believe the lack of knowledge and that the people pass it on to others on this board. Taking 50mg of Test or 250mg of test will shut down your natural test production. There is no minimal shutdown. Shut down means your body no longer producest test on it's own. Staying on any dose of test for a long time can have its own consequences. You should do more research before trying that. Everyone is affected differentely. If you do recover you may not have the same test levels you had before; you might have them a lot lower, as one side effect of long term use.

jonesboy · Mar 1, 2007

i have read some of the same things in the hrt boards. That is why i was asking here how long would it be ok. I could always run fenagreek with hgh for the test suppresion.

Zuke · Mar 1, 2007

Yeah, Running Gun you should research some more before you start another on of your "ideas".

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

jonesboy said:
i have read some of the same things in the hrt boards. That is why i was asking here how long would it be ok. I could always run fenagreek with hgh for the test suppresion.

You wont get an answer to this question. It would be ok to run for months but then there could be consequences if you do come off. You might end up on HRT for life.

Running Gun · Mar 2, 2007

Putin said:
lol I cant believe the lack of knowledge and that the people pass it on to others on this board. Taking 50mg of Test or 250mg of test will shut down your natural test production. There is no minimal shutdown. Shut down means your body no longer producest test on it's own. Staying on any dose of test for a long time can have its own consequences. You should do more research before trying that. Everyone is affected differently. If you do recover you may not have the same test levels you had before; you might have them a lot lower, as one side effect of long term use.

Zuke Yeah, Running Gun you should research some more before you start another on of your "ideas".

Well I guess you both know more then my Doctor ! You guys have to get it out of your head that higher amounts of test are better. Especial due to the fact you guys are probably younger and could make great gains on less test. If I said "Blast and cruse", most wouldn't even question it. By keeping your test levels in the "normal high range", you most certainly can cause minimal shutdown. Please don't make me have to explain the negative feedback loop and how it works.

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

Running Gun said:
Zuke Yeah, Running Gun you should research some more before you start another on of your "ideas".

Well I guess you both know more then my Doctor ! You guys have to get it out of your head that higher amounts of test are better. Especial due to the fact you guys are probably younger and could make great gains on less test. If I said "Blast and cruse", most wouldn't even question it. By keeping your test levels in the "normal high range", you most certainly can cause minimal shutdown. Please don't make me have to explain the negative feedback loop and how it works.

Dude. Doctors dont know shit about steroids. They know just about as much or what the ordinary person knows/ or doesnt know. Is that steroids are bad, they cause cancer, aids, acne, roid rage, etc. They still prescribe HRT doses of 200mg once a month, etc.
I dont know where you're getting your information from but its wrong. You can look at a study that compared 100mg/week 250mg/week 500mg/week of test and the conclution was that 500mg/week was better.
What exactely do you mean by keeping your test levels in the "normal high range"? Shutdown is shut down. It's not like you can inject 100mg of test per week and expect your body to still produce some natural test. If the production of natural test stops, it stops, period. It doesnt just hang around at low levels.

jonesboy · Mar 2, 2007

Putin said:
Dude. Doctors dont know shit about steroids. They know just about as much or what the ordinary person knows/ or doesnt know. Is that steroids are bad, they cause cancer, aids, acne, roid rage, etc. They still prescribe HRT doses of 200mg once a month, etc.
I dont know where you're getting your information from but its wrong. You can look at a study that compared 100mg/week 250mg/week 500mg/week of test and the conclution was that 500mg/week was better.
What exactely do you mean by keeping your test levels in the "normal high range"? Shutdown is shut down. It's not like you can inject 100mg of test per week and expect your body to still produce some natural test. If the production of natural test stops, it stops, period. It doesnt just hang around at low levels.

Putin no offense but man you are a little drama queen. Do you just come to this board to flame people? Because that is what i get from most of your posts. Good advice would have been 250 a week is ok for 6 to 8 wks but you will probably be shutdown at the end of it and will need pct at the end of your run. My recommendation would be to up it to 500 a week and then proceed to pct. Or even better yet share your knowledge on what you do for test suppression while on growth for long term if you do at all.

I haven't read anything on this board about this topic and i am sure it would benefit others to get good advice. Not just to flame others....

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

jonesboy said:
Putin no offense but man you are a little drama queen. Do you just come to this board to flame people? Because that is what i get from most of your posts. Good advice would have been 250 a week is ok for 6 to 8 wks but you will probably be shutdown at the end of it and will need pct at the end of your run. My recommendation would be to up it to 500 a week and then proceed to pct. Or even better yet share your knowledge on what you do for test suppression while on growth for long term if you do at all.

I haven't read anything on this board about this topic and i am sure it would benefit others to get good advice. Not just to flame others....

That's what I ment lol no pun intended.

jonesboy · Mar 2, 2007

:fo:d-smil

Running Gun · Mar 2, 2007

Sorry, not into these ridiculous flame things but, where people get this shutdown in all cases thing from, I"ll never know.
So what your saying is a 40 or 50 year old male taking 250mg of test a week will be totally shut down! That is just plain wrong. Let's say you were tested and your test levels were around 300-400,(low),you then decided to inject 250mg of test a week. According to you, your natural test production would come to a halt! Talk about misinformation getting repeated ! Another piece of the puzzle is your workout. If your to do "bust ass" workouts using several compound movements such as heavy deads and squats this would cause more natural test to be needed by the body,(something I'm sure we all know). This coupled with the outside test could leave you at a more acceptable test level. Don't misunderstand me, I'm not talking about Ronnie Coleman here. This protocol would be for someone wanting to achieve a normal or high-normal test level such as 800-1000. If we all wanted a ballistic amount then be would be battling the water retention issues and so on. The best way to asses your possible shut down would be to simple listen to your body. If your experiencing testicle atrophy then your natural test product is stopping. I'm not a power lifter but I bust my ass in the gym. Several friends that are power lifters stay on 250mg and have no TA, (and this person is 28 and ranked in the top 25 in the Country). Get my point.

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

Running Gun said:
Sorry, not into these ridiculous flame things but, where people get this shutdown in all cases thing from, I"ll never know.
So what your saying is a 40 or 50 year old male taking 250mg of test a week will be totally shut down! That is just plain wrong. Let's say you were tested and your test levels were around 300-400,(low),you then decided to inject 250mg of test a week. According to you, your natural test production would come to a halt! Talk about misinformation getting repeated ! Another piece of the puzzle is your workout. If your to do "bust ass" workouts using several compound movements such as heavy deads and squats this would cause more natural test to be needed by the body,(something I'm sure we all know). This coupled with the outside test could leave you at a more acceptable test level. Don't misunderstand me, I'm not talking about Ronnie Coleman here. This protocol would be for someone wanting to achieve a normal or high-normal test level such as 800-1000. If we all wanted a ballistic amount then be would be battling the water retention issues and so on. The best way to asses your possible shut down would be to simple listen to your body. If your experiencing testicle atrophy then your natural test product is stopping. I'm not a power lifter but I bust my ass in the gym. Several friends that are power lifters stay on 250mg and have no TA, (and this person is 28 and ranked in the top 25 in the Country). Get my point.

-Most 40-50 year olds produce half the test 20yr olds do, if not less. And end up going on HRT.
-Testicle atrophy has nothing to do with your natural test production shutting down. My balls never shrink when I'm on a cycle, some guys balls go down to pea size on a cycle. So what you're trying to say is that when someone is using 3g of gear per week and they have no ball shrinkage that means their bodies dont stop producing natural test? lol Dude, then there would be no point of cycling and doing PCT.
-When you body sense the shitload of test you inject, it stops producing natural test; there is no way around it. You obviously have never done your own bloodwork to find that one out. More than enough studies on this subject it's not rocket science.

Running Gun · Mar 2, 2007

Putin said:
-When you body sense the shitload of test you inject, it stops producing natural test; there is no way around it. You obviously have never done your own bloodwork to find that one out. More than enough studies on this subject it's not rocket science.

In order for you to disagree with someone's post, you must first read their post. "When your body senses the shit load of test you inject, it stops producing natural test" Exactly, but we're not talking about a shit load of test! The above statement just proved my point.

Secondly, atrophy certainly has everything to do with shut down. Why do you think they shrink, they're no longer producing test. And yes everyone is different. Some guys can even do a gram a week and retain no water, not many, but a few.

You are right about one thing, your not a rocket scientist !

Sorry Jones boy, I didn't mean to hijack your thread, I apologize.

Gunsmith · Mar 2, 2007

So running Test at 500mg a week for 12-15 weeks with HGH and T3 is a bad idea? What about if I take IGF with it ? or eat alot of cheese and cake?

Their is so much missinformation out their about steroids and their effects and side effects thats its very confusing for a guy thats wanting to try it out to get solid knowledge

A guy at my gym called me last Sunday all worried that he fucked up his liver because he went out and got drunk Saturday night ans he has been on D-bol for 2 weeks at 30mg/ed.. the guy that got him started on it is also a "well read" novice and told him that taking in any alcohol would fuck up his liver

I think that their are to many guys that have read to much that post their "knowledge" as a fact. For every clinical trial that say one thing I can show you another that say the oppisite , which one is true.

My oppinion Jonesboy , Run your HGH like you plan and your test like you plan , I persoanly would ramp the T3 up to at least 75mcg/ed to aid in fat burning and run the test for 6-12 weeks and the last 3 weeks shoot 500iu of HCG twice a week then at the end run your PCT like normal. if your natural test is suppressed then you have taken measures to bring it back and if it isin't so your out a little bit more money.

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

Running Gun said:
In order for you to disagree with someone's post, you must first read their post. "When your body senses the shit load of test you inject, it stops producing natural test" Exactly, but we're not talking about a shit load of test! The above statement just proved my point.

Secondly, atrophy certainly has everything to do with shut down. Why do you think they shrink, they're no longer producing test. And yes everyone is different. Some guys can even do a gram a week and retain no water, not many, but a few.

You are right about one thing, your not a rocket scientist !

Sorry Jones boy, I didn't mean to hijack your thread, I apologize.

250mg a week is more than your body can produce on it's own. So it's a shitload, double than your body's natural production if not tripple. Your statement proved nothing. I'm stating facts based on scientific studies, you're basing them on how big your friends' balls are.
And how do you explain someone doing 2g a week of Deca and test and their balls dont shrink. But when they come off, they gotta go thru PCT and still cannot recover for 6-12months to their natural levels.

Putin · Mar 2, 2007

Gunsmith said:
So running Test at 500mg a week for 12-15 weeks with HGH and T3 is a bad idea? What about if I take IGF with it ? or eat alot of cheese and cake?

-Their is so much missinformation out their about steroids and their effects and side effects thats its very confusing for a guy thats wanting to try it out to get solid knowledge
-A guy at my gym called me last Sunday all worried that he fucked up his liver because he went out and got drunk Saturday night ans he has been on D-bol for 2 weeks at 30mg/ed.. the guy that got him started on it is also a "well read" novice and told him that taking in any alcohol would fuck up his liver
-I think that their are to many guys that have read to much that post their "knowledge" as a fact. For every clinical trial that say one thing I can show you another that say the oppisite , which one is true.
-My oppinion Jonesboy , Run your HGH like you plan and your test like you plan , I persoanly would ramp the T3 up to at least 75mcg/ed to aid in fat burning and run the test for 6-12 weeks and the last 3 weeks shoot 500iu of HCG twice a week then at the end run your PCT like normal. if your natural test is suppressed then you have taken measures to bring it back and if it isin't so your out a little bit more money.

-
If this is your first cycle, you can just go with 300-500mg/week of testosterone alone. Unless you're advanced I wouldnt bother with HGH or IGF.
-And taking Dbol while having a one nighter of boozing is not going to fuck up your liver. It takes years for alcoholics to destroy theirs in the first place.
-Scientific studies are flawed. Some are good and some are bad. That's why you have to read and find the flaws in them in the first place. If the study is well done, and repeated studies confirm the same results, then it's a go.
How many guys do you think retain most of their gains while comming off a cycle? If your theory that you state that natural test production does not stop. There would be no point of doing PCT and you definately would keep most of your gains. You guys should do a cycle, come off, get your test levels checked a few weeks later and see if they are at their natural level. OMG.

Running Gun · Mar 2, 2007

You win, I give up. I always run hcg regardless, that's just common sense.
Of all the power lifters I know, who juice heavy, I never knew one that didn't atrophy. What ever.