the future of science.

[JustWannaBeHuge]

With the new studies being done on gene manipulation, and now with mechanical arms that I have seen people with, how far do you think we'll take it? Do you think that one day, there really will be cyborgs? I know that may seem far fetched, but science seems to be evolving at an incredible rate, and new inventions seem to be popping up all the time.

This is an example of AI that Honda has worked on, watch all the videos, it's really impressive if you ask me.

http://asimo.honda.com/inside_asimo_movies.asp

 

[Nssca]

NO... no need for robotic body parts. With Stem cell research in the very near future we all will be able to grow a new arm or a new eye. replace your heart or kidneys. Stem cells will extend ones life beyound the imagination...ITS COMING

 

[OuchThatHurts]

JWBH,

You MUST read Spiritual Machines by Ray Kurzweil. It's a good book that describe a possible progression along the lines of what you're asking.

It asks a good question but I'll put it in my own words.

Let's say you have Joe. Joe blows his knees out and gets mechanical or artificial knees. Later as he grows older his eyes begin to fail and corneal inplants allow him to see. Same with ears, cochlear implants. Unfortuantely he loses his arms and legs in a car accident which are relaced with mechanical or organic replicas. He has a heart attack. Major blockage. He is given an artificial heart. Now he's really old and his liver and lungs, etc., are all failing. He is given replacements. Since he's aging, his memory begins to fail and he's given shunts placed in his cerebral cortex that bring back memories vividly. Even ones he wanted to forget. The year is now 2150 and his mechanical parts are failing along with his brain since he's now 180 years old. An advanced MRI takes a snapshot of his neural net and Joe's net goes into a fresh body (possibly grown from his own genetic material).

Now many of these technologies are in place as I write this and many are rapidly on the way. Here's the philosphical question: When does Joe stop being Joe. Or is he the same old Joe? What makes Joe "Joe"? After all, after the "neural transplant", Joe's in his new body has all his likes, dislikes, loves, etc.

Trust me, you'd enjoy the book better than my crappy interpretation.

 

[Tyrone]

JWBH,

You MUST read Spiritual Machines by Ray Kurzweil. It's a good book that describe a possible progression along the lines of what you're asking.

It asks a good question but I'll put it in my own words.

Let's say you have Joe. Joe blows his knees out and gets mechanical or artificial knees. Later as he grows older his eyes begin to fail and corneal inplants allow him to see. Same with ears, cochlear implants. Unfortuantely he loses his arms and legs in a car accident which are relaced with mechanical or organic replicas. He has a heart attack. Major blockage. He is given an artificial heart. Now he's really old and his liver and lungs, etc., are all failing. He is given replacements. Since he's aging, his memory begins to fail and he's given shunts placed in his cerebral cortex that bring back memories vividly. Even ones he wanted to forget. The year is now 2150 and his mechanical parts are failing along with his brain since he's now 180 years old. An advanced MRI takes a snapshot of his neural net and Joe's net goes into a fresh body (possibly grown from his own genetic material).

Now many of these technologies are in place as I write this and many are rapidly on the way. Here's the philosphical question: When does Joe stop being Joe. Or is he the same old Joe? What makes Joe "Joe"? After all, after the "neural transplant", Joe's in his new body has all his likes, dislikes, loves, etc.

Trust me, you'd enjoy the book better than my crappy interpretation.

IMO from philosophy I have to say that as long as his brain consits of his exp. and heredity, he's still joe...once the original environment and heredity that have shaped him for so many years are deteriated then he's John Doe...

 

[JustWannaBeHuge]

Now many of these technologies are in place as I write this and many are rapidly on the way. Here's the philosphical question: When does Joe stop being Joe. Or is he the same old Joe? What makes Joe "Joe"? After all, after the "neural transplant", Joe's in his new body has all his likes, dislikes, loves, etc.

Trust me, you'd enjoy the book better than my crappy interpretation.

I'm going to check that book out, it sounds like a must read. My brother and I actually got into a deep discussion about this earlier today.

I posed the question, like what you stated the book is about. If in the future, we're able to move someone's intellect to a computer chip or even to a brand new flesh and bone body, is it still the same person? Would I still be me?

I'm going to the book store tonight to pick up some stuff, I'll definitely get that book. thanks for the heads up.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

So you're saying that if placed Joe's life into a machine. Say a computer with a speaker and a monitor. If that machine had the capacity to process information as fast as Joe's brain did or faster and ALL of Joe's memories, loves, etc. were in this machine. Where's Joe? Does Joe die with his body?

I'm sure if you asked the "computer Joe", he'd say "Hell yeah! It's still me in here! Don't turn me off!"

I think hearing views on this would be interesting.

What if I told you that in our children's lifetimes, it's possible that they will see a machine argue for it's civil rights?

 

[JustWannaBeHuge]

So you're saying that if placed Joe's life into a machine. Say a computer with a speaker and a monitor. If that machine had the capacity to process information as fast as Joe's brain did or faster and ALL of Joe's memories, loves, etc. were in this machine. Where's Joe? Does Joe die with his body?

I'm sure if you asked the "computer Joe", he'd say "Hell yeah! It's still me in here! Don't turn me off!"

I think hearing views on this would be interesting.

What if I told you that in our children's lifetimes, it's possible that they will see a machine argue for it's civil rights?

Yea that's what I was trying to get too. Is there more to "Joe" than just the thoughts and memories? I guess I'm looking as to where the real "Joe" would be.

And as far as the machines arguing for civil rights, I have no doubts that it would eventually happen.

To those that say it never would, I think that is very closed minded. There was a director back in the days of silent movies who bashed everyone who said that one day there would be sound in film. He said it was absurd to ever think that sound would be in film and he said those people were living in fantasyland. Well, we now see what film can do with all the FX now, and it's growing at an even faster rate. Computer processors are getting faster, more AI... it's very interesting to me

In today's world, I don't think anything is impossible. It's only a matter of time.

 

[BigBoyJ]

Well, I can't imagine any person would really want to remain alive as a speaker and monitor. We need touch, affection, sex, love. None of these would be possible without our physical bodies. So in this case, I would say, no, Joe isn't Joe.

But, if Joe's memories and life experience were to be transferred into a clone of his own body, then yes, Joe is still Joe.