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The importance of bloodwork ON cycle

bieberhole69

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Many of us have heard Dante talk about needing to see the damage being done while on cycle. Well...I had a quarterly appointment with my doctor last week. Two weeks into my first blast in 6mos.

3 months ago

LDL 106 HDL 40 (these are some of the best values I've ever had in my life, natural or not) on 150 test / week

Fast forward to 2 weeks into a test (1200mg) + dbol cycle (20mg daily)

LDL 156 HDL 16

It took just two weeks for a "low" dose of dbol to chop my HDL in half.

Everything else is fine--I just thought I'd share this information so that others could have evidence of just how quick gear can affect bloodwork. I'm in my 30s now, and know that unless it's contest time I sure as hell won't be running an oral again.
 

mike036

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Thanks for sharing bieberhole .its good to remind guys how fast your blood work can go to shit ,especially using orals .
 

Swifto

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Although I think thats mostly the 17aa (Dianabol), the exogenous testosterone will also have a detrimental effect on lipids and has been proven to many times.

Whats your supplement usage for health?
 

DOGGCRAPP

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Many of us have heard Dante talk about needing to see the damage being done while on cycle. Well...I had a quarterly appointment with my doctor last week. Two weeks into my first blast in 6mos.

3 months ago

LDL 106 HDL 40 (these are some of the best values I've ever had in my life, natural or not) on 150 test / week

Fast forward to 2 weeks into a test (1200mg) + dbol cycle (20mg daily)

LDL 156 HDL 16

It took just two weeks for a "low" dose of dbol to chop my HDL in half.

Everything else is fine--I just thought I'd share this information so that others could have evidence of just how quick gear can affect bloodwork. I'm in my 30s now, and know that unless it's contest time I sure as hell won't be running an oral again.
and the main problem is everyone lives and dies by their "clean" bloodwork...then they go on a 8 month cycle and do un- reversible damage....then clean out for 6 weeks and get bloodwork and think "hey im fine!"...and the question should be....what about the plaque buildup of 8 months of horrible bloodwork that you just did and are going to do for years to come because you only go by your 6 weeks clean bloodwork?
 

Elvia1023

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I have experienced something similar recently. Although I didn't have access to blood work in the past but now I do so I will be getting it done frequently. But I feel safe stating sdrol ruined my cholesterol... it tested at 0.07. I was only using it about 2 1/2 weeks too. There would have been other factors but it just shows you the damage these orals can have. Now I am on an extensive cholesterol improving cycle so I hope to see numbers improve and fast. I would like to say as fast as they dropped but this was my 1st blood work in a long time so I don't know what they looke dlike before the sdrol. Although now I will be getting blood work done every 3 months at a max. I have another blood test planned for just over 1 month after the 1st test to see if there has been a difference.

As mentioned I never get the logic of people who run big cycles then come off then get blood work done. Ideally people should be getting blood work done before, in the middle and the end of a cycle. If I could only pick one time it would definitely be during a cycle just so you can see what the drugs are actually doing to your blood work. I know they are doing it many way because deep down they don't actually want to see the damage the drugs are doing. Hopefully you can get your numbers back up fast and it's probably best dropping the dbol. Good luck with everything.
 

little slice

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im dropping tren and orals altogether, swapped AI's for nolva


may even do a little cardio now and again (probably not).




cracks me up how guys are like "didn't suffer any sides, 2 months bloodwork after cycle was perfect."



willful ignorance
 

get it in ya

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I told myself years ago if i planned on doing this for years i have to stop trying orals and tren. Orals and tren always made me feel awful, that tells me i shouldnt use them. Every year i will try them and expect different results, i dont last 2 weeks and i drop them. For me test, mast, primo is the only thing i feel good on, no sides. Its all about feeling good.
 

Giants83

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I told myself years ago if i planned on doing this for years i have to stop trying orals and tren. Orals and tren always made me feel awful, that tells me i shouldnt use them. Every year i will try them and expect different results, i dont last 2 weeks and i drop them. For me test, mast, primo is the only thing i feel good on, no sides. Its all about feeling good.


I'm with you. I love tren and orals but I don't compete. Why put my body through the unnecessary stress? After listening to guys like gotgame and others I've just decided it's not worth it. Same feeling for high doses. I don't want to feel like shit and I want to live a long time.
 

bieberhole69

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Pretty significant drop. Not surprised. Were you taking nac/tudca?

Gotta pay to play.
Although I think thats mostly the 17aa (Dianabol), the exogenous testosterone will also have a detrimental effect on lipids and has been proven to many times.

Whats your supplement usage for health?
Supplement usage for health:

NAC 1200mg / day
TUDCA 500mg / day
Fish Oil / Krill oil for total ~2000mg total EPA/DHA / day (not "2g of fat total", but 2g of what we're actually going for)
Citrus Bergamot 1000mg / day
Psyllium Husk fiber 2 servings daily
Metformin 1500mg / day (reduces LDL, increases HDL, check the studies)

And then numerous other things...low dose aspirin, coq10, lots of fat from EVOO daily, taurine, citrulline malate, curcumin, etc)

Let me make this clear:

The ONLY thing out of range in my bloodwork was LDL and HDL. 2 weeks on cycle with "only" 20mg dbol effectively wrecked my lipids...and I was taking plenty of health supplements that were unable to stop it.

I expected the AST / ALT to be what I was getting a call about (it was fine). Certainly not the lipid panel--not this quick.
 

suppdude

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Supplement usage for health:

NAC 1200mg / day
TUDCA 500mg / day
Fish Oil / Krill oil for total ~2000mg total EPA/DHA / day (not "2g of fat total", but 2g of what we're actually going for)
Citrus Bergamot 1000mg / day
Psyllium Husk fiber 2 servings daily
Metformin 1500mg / day (reduces LDL, increases HDL, check the studies)

And then numerous other things...low dose aspirin, coq10, lots of fat from EVOO daily, taurine, citrulline malate, curcumin, etc)

Let me make this clear:

The ONLY thing out of range in my bloodwork was LDL and HDL. 2 weeks on cycle with "only" 20mg dbol effectively wrecked my lipids...and I was taking plenty of health supplements that were unable to stop it.

I expected the AST / ALT to be what I was getting a call about (it was fine). Certainly not the lipid panel--not this quick.
Very clear that even using compounds to help improve lipids (which the ones you use are very effective at doing so) won't do zilch while using an oral (sure different orals play different levels of negative effects)
 

Swifto

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Supplement usage for health:

NAC 1200mg / day
TUDCA 500mg / day
Fish Oil / Krill oil for total ~2000mg total EPA/DHA / day (not "2g of fat total", but 2g of what we're actually going for)
Citrus Bergamot 1000mg / day
Psyllium Husk fiber 2 servings daily
Metformin 1500mg / day (reduces LDL, increases HDL, check the studies)

And then numerous other things...low dose aspirin, coq10, lots of fat from EVOO daily, taurine, citrulline malate, curcumin, etc)

Let me make this clear:

The ONLY thing out of range in my bloodwork was LDL and HDL. 2 weeks on cycle with "only" 20mg dbol effectively wrecked my lipids...and I was taking plenty of health supplements that were unable to stop it.

I expected the AST / ALT to be what I was getting a call about (it was fine). Certainly not the lipid panel--not this quick.
Be good if you can drop the 20mg ED Dbol and get tested again after 3-4 weeks. See what damage the Test is having.
 

bieberhole69

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Be good if you can drop the 20mg ED Dbol and get tested again after 3-4 weeks. See what damage the Test is having.
I've dropped it already--however, my fear is that the test is going to suppress any HDL recovery. I've actually set bloodwork for the exact end of my cycle to see the overall picture. Hoping for the best, but trying to be realistic about it too.

It would be interesting to see if anybody else has had similar experiences. Obviously Elvia has, but it was with superdrol which is a known offender. It'd be great if we could compile a list of bloodwork mid-cycle with various orals--especially anavar since everyone thinks it's so "mild"--and build a conclusive body of evidence.

This is something I wish I had known earlier in life (by known I mean had conclusive in-your-face evidence for myself or a huge body of evidence from others). Not that the younger version of myself would have cared as much. But maybe some younger cats out there would see this body of evidence and save the orals for competition time only.
 

nothuman

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Many of us have heard Dante talk about needing to see the damage being done while on cycle. Well...I had a quarterly appointment with my doctor last week. Two weeks into my first blast in 6mos.

3 months ago

LDL 106 HDL 40 (these are some of the best values I've ever had in my life, natural or not) on 150 test / week

Fast forward to 2 weeks into a test (1200mg) + dbol cycle (20mg daily)

LDL 156 HDL 16

It took just two weeks for a "low" dose of dbol to chop my HDL in half.

Everything else is fine--I just thought I'd share this information so that others could have evidence of just how quick gear can affect bloodwork. I'm in my 30s now, and know that unless it's contest time I sure as hell won't be running an oral again.
Is HDL/LDL all you got checked two weeks into that cycle? I'd be curious to see the rest of it

Edit: saw you said you did get other things checked. Can you share what was unaffected? Did you get things like CRP, homocysteine, etc. tested or just the basic kidney/liver stuff?
 
Last edited:

bieberhole69

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Is HDL/LDL all you got checked two weeks into that cycle? I'd be curious to see the rest of it

Edit: saw you said you did get other things checked. Can you share what was unaffected? Did you get things like CRP, homocysteine, etc. tested or just the basic kidney/liver stuff?
I'll get the full results back hopefully today in the mail (I was just notified by phone, but asked if anything else was out of line and they said no), but the only additional thing I had done for the lipid panel that I didn't list (that I'm aware of, unless the doc tacked something else on) will be VLDL + triglycerides--but I have a baseline for those, so it will be interesting to know as well.

I did have liver / kidney stuff done, and when I get the report in the mail I'll come back and update this thread as fully as possible.
 

Dado5

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Try endur-acin. My HDL is 2 points down and my cardiologist said to take endur-acin 1000 mg especially when i am on cycle.
I just started taking it, we will see
 

warlock

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Is HDL/LDL all you got checked two weeks into that cycle? I'd be curious to see the rest of it

Edit: saw you said you did get other things checked. Can you share what was unaffected? Did you get things like CRP, homocysteine, etc. tested or just the basic kidney/liver stuff?
Nothuman,

When you have upped your test some time back, didn't you add in some low dose cardarine (GW-501516)? If so, did you get blood work done during that time? Curious if cardarine was able to keep your HDL in range.
 

nothuman

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Nothuman,



When you have upped your test some time back, didn't you add in some low dose cardarine (GW-501516)? If so, did you get blood work done during that time? Curious if cardarine was able to keep your HDL in range.


The timing of my bloodwork wasn't ideal, but I can tell the HDL went down a little on 750mg test. Not too bad though. I believe the cardarine I used was fake as I also saw sketchy reviews online. Didn't feel anything on it
 

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