The preworkout thread

[Mike Arnold]

I've asked you this before Mike but you didn't back then so do you also ship to Europe now? It would be a shame if we couldn't use your products because they always look great

No. Sorry brother. The shipping would cost $28 to ship to almost anywhere in Europe. If you want to pay that, I'll ship it, but most don't want to do that. Furthermore, I can't be held responsible for seizures, so if the country the customer lives in doesn't permit the importation of any of the ingredients in my products...and it gets seized, it will not be reshipped. The reason UGL usually do re-ships is because they are attempting to export controlled substances. Furthermore, most AAS are really cheap to manufacture. For example, a vial of testosterone only costs a few bucks to make, so they don't lose much money on a reship. In my case, I am not exporting controlled substances and my products also cost a lot more than a few dollars to produce, so if I end up re-shipping I could very well end up losing money. That's just not a good position for any business to put themselves in.

If I had a re-distributor in Europe things would be fine, but again, many of my products either can't be sold in certain European countries (due to certain ingredients) or cc's can't be used as a method of payment. If the redistributor can't accept cc's they aren't going to want to deal with it...and if a particular ingredient is banned, they aren't going to want to deal with it ether. All this makes European sales rather difficult. In order to have a European distributor like many other companies I would have to eliminate many of the products I currently sell, strictly adhere to all DSHEA guidelines and pretty much create a whole new line of boring, copycat products. This would defeat the entire purpose of distributing in Europe to begin with. Anyone in Europe who wants these products wants them because of what they are. If I had to get rid of nearly all of them and start over, there would no longer be a demand. For all of these reasons, European sales are rather difficult.

 

[KillerStack]

As a rule I don't buy preworkouts since I think most are absolute shit, just a caffeine overdose with some aminos that do jack shit for pumps or whatever they claim. I like stims however and my interest was piqued by this Hydrapharm Hydrazine. It's got so many rave reviews and I saw Elvia mentioned it in this thread and said it packed a punch. This company sells several grey area supps too, a few of which probably aren't completely legal to sell as supps.

I hate proprietary blends and I would venture to guess this one isn't just herbs, there's probably some synthetic chem in there. Anyone know or would venture a guess as to what is "working" in this formula?

 

[Big Beef]

Been looking into some new pre-workouts lately & found a few that I'm pretty tempted to try: Outlift Amped, Vapor 1 & Wreckage. There were a couple others too, but I forgot to write the names down. Anyone try any of those yet?

 

[jeroendebleser]

No. Sorry brother. The shipping would cost $28 to ship to almost anywhere in Europe. If you want to pay that, I'll ship it, but most don't want to do that. Furthermore, I can't be held responsible for seizures, so if the country the customer lives in doesn't permit the importation of any of the ingredients in my products...and it gets seized, it will not be reshipped. The reason UGL usually do re-ships is because they are attempting to export controlled substances. Furthermore, most AAS are really cheap to manufacture. For example, a vial of testosterone only costs a few bucks to make, so they don't lose much money on a reship. In my case, I am not exporting controlled substances and my products also cost a lot more than a few dollars to produce, so if I end up re-shipping I could very well end up losing money. That's just not a good position for any business to put themselves in.

If I had a re-distributor in Europe things would be fine, but again, many of my products either can't be sold in certain European countries (due to certain ingredients) or cc's can't be used as a method of payment. If the redistributor can't accept cc's they aren't going to want to deal with it...and if a particular ingredient is banned, they aren't going to want to deal with it ether. All this makes European sales rather difficult. In order to have a European distributor like many other companies I would have to eliminate many of the products I currently sell, strictly adhere to all DSHEA guidelines and pretty much create a whole new line of boring, copycat products. This would defeat the entire purpose of distributing in Europe to begin with. Anyone in Europe who wants these products wants them because of what they are. If I had to get rid of nearly all of them and start over, there would no longer be a demand. For all of these reasons, European sales are rather difficult.

I completely understand

 

[jaydog25]

Need this gym to open back up. Just got me a tub of excelsior and the new assassin v6

 

[Elvia1023]

As a rule I don't buy preworkouts since I think most are absolute shit, just a caffeine overdose with some aminos that do jack shit for pumps or whatever they claim. I like stims however and my interest was piqued by this Hydrapharm Hydrazine. It's got so many rave reviews and I saw Elvia mentioned it in this thread and said it packed a punch. This company sells several grey area supps too, a few of which probably aren't completely legal to sell as supps.

I hate proprietary blends and I would venture to guess this one isn't just herbs, there's probably some synthetic chem in there. Anyone know or would venture a guess as to what is "working" in this formula?

Hydrazine was a bit of a let down for me. It starts amazingly but fades away fairly quickly for me. The focus is intense and it's very fast hitting so if you get it I would recommend taking it just before training. It contains a few effective things such as Bauhinia Purpurea Extract, Cymbidium Goeringii Extract (Orchilean) and Kigelia Africana Extract. The reviews from most are excellent so it's worth trying. It is very expensive so you could even try and get one of the 2 cap sample packs like I received with an order from predator in the UK.

I should add why not try Excelsior for the same website that sells the hydrazine?

 

[Elvia1023]

I want to bring up the importance of nutrition and sensitivity when it comes to stimulants and preworkouts. A good example of the point I am trying to make is a review I read about Excelsior recently. The guy who done it wrote it out on his own webpage and to me had no common sense because of how he reviewed the product. Now any product is going to have mixed reviews no matter how good it is because even if 9 people love something you will always get 1 who dislikes it. Excelsior will be hated by some because of whatever reason (too strong etc). But the review this guy gave the product was silly. He basically wasn't a stim junkie and he had a very light breakfast then took 1.5 scoops. He said it was amazing in the gym but he crashed so hard and as a result he will never use it again and he scored it very low. Obviously you would think why not just take 1 scoop first time round and use some common sense and eat properly first. Or if he doesn't like 1.5 scoops try 0.5 scoops 2nd time round and go from there. For me there is a massive difference taking 1.5 or 1 scoop.

You also have to be careful taking strong stimulants especially when you haven't ate properly as you process them so much faster. I can take very strong stimulants but the other day I had a very light breakfast then waited around and I had an espresso. It was just with the nespresso machine so no more than 100mg caffeine max. I went to the shop and I was stood there wired off my head feeling a bit off because that is what happens to me when I take even just caffeine on a very empty stomach. I couldn't imagine taking 1.5 scoops of Excelsior on an empty stomach I would be manic It can really make that much of a difference so you need to adjust your dose accordingly. So if any of you are not stim junkies and try something strong I would recommend starting with a low-standard dose and always have food beforehand (1 hour or so).

I actually decided yesterday to have 1 scoop of Excelsior before training at home. It was quite late and I was taking my dog on a walk first so I figured take it beforehand as it builds up slowly and train when I get back. I also wanted to use it to give me focus/energy for working on the computer after training as well. 1 scoop for me was very steady and I was not wired in any way and it felt fairly light but the thing with Excelsior it just keeps you going. It was my mistake taking it so late because I couldn't sleep. I didn't even try as I was focused on working and beign productive so it can be used with great effect for all day energy and productivity. Just don't take it very late as you will be up at 8am thinking wtf Now if I would have taken just 1/2 scoop more I would have been wired so there is a massive difference in effect with different doses and it made me think of that 1.5 scoop review again. I would be annoyed if I worked for a company and someone tried my product and took 50% more dose on an empty stomach 1st time round then complained they crashed and scored it very low online when the product is labelled as a very strong stimulant and to be taken with care.

 

[jaydog25]

I want to bring up the importance of nutrition and sensitivity when it comes to stimulants and preworkouts. A good example of the point I am trying to make is a review I read about Excelsior recently. The guy who done it wrote it out on his own webpage and to me had no common sense because of how he reviewed the product. Now any product is going to have mixed reviews no matter how good it is because even if 9 people love something you will always get 1 who dislikes it. Excelsior will be hated by some because of whatever reason (too strong etc). But the review this guy gave the product was silly. He basically wasn't a stim junkie and he had a very light breakfast then took 1.5 scoops. He said it was amazing in the gym but he crashed so hard and as a result he will never use it again and he scored it very low. Obviously you would think why not just take 1 scoop first time round and use some common sense and eat properly first. Or if he doesn't like 1.5 scoops try 0.5 scoops 2nd time round and go from there. For me there is a massive difference taking 1.5 or 1 scoop.

You also have to be careful taking strong stimulants especially when you haven't ate properly as you process them so much faster. I can take very strong stimulants but the other day I had a very light breakfast then waited around and I had an espresso. It was just with the nespresso machine so no more than 100mg caffeine max. I went to the shop and I was stood there wired off my head feeling a bit off because that is what happens to me when I take even just caffeine on a very empty stomach. I couldn't imagine taking 1.5 scoops of Excelsior on an empty stomach I would be manic It can really make that much of a difference so you need to adjust your dose accordingly. So if any of you are not stim junkies and try something strong I would recommend starting with a low-standard dose and always have food beforehand (1 hour or so).

I actually decided yesterday to have 1 scoop of Excelsior before training at home. It was quite late and I was taking my dog on a walk first so I figured take it beforehand as it builds up slowly and train when I get back. I also wanted to use it to give me focus/energy for working on the computer after training as well. 1 scoop for me was very steady and I was not wired in any way and it felt fairly light but the thing with Excelsior it just keeps you going. It was my mistake taking it so late because I couldn't sleep. I didn't even try as I was focused on working and beign productive so it can be used with great effect for all day energy and productivity. Just don't take it very late as you will be up at 8am thinking wtf Now if I would have taken just 1/2 scoop more I would have been wired so there is a massive difference in effect with different doses and it made me think of that 1.5 scoop review again. I would be annoyed if I worked for a company and someone tried my product and took 50% more dose on an empty stomach 1st time round then complained they crashed and scored it very low online when the product is labelled as a very strong stimulant and to be taken with care.

Have you tried the new assassin 6 elvia?

 

[loftros]

Have you tried the new assassin 6 elvia?

If you are willing to try something new, Dedlift Dominus is very underrated...its sold on amazon and goes on sale very often. It tastes ehh but has a decent dose of Eria Jarensis and wont jack u up on caffeine, even if you 4x scoop it!. It gives u a great kick and focus more than most PW

 

[Elvia1023]

Have you tried the new assassin 6 elvia?

I haven't matey but I plan to. It's made by Anarchy Labs which is the same as Imperial Nutrition so it's essentially the makes of Excelsior's latest preworkout. It looks very strong with 1 scoop and 20 servings per container.

 

[samgraves82]

I have been using a lot of pre workouts over the last year so thought I would start this thread. I have also seen a lot of talk about various pre workouts scattered all over the forum. I figured we could all post our favourite pre workouts and why. New ones come out all the time too so I can keep this thread updated. Although I am gonna calm them down alittle for health reasons but no chance I will be stopping. I should note I used to be extra sensitive to caffeine but over time that is the opposite now.

Here are a few I have tried in recent times each with a brief review...

GAT Nitraflex- Not impressed at all. I just had a 2 weeks break from caffeine too. Need to give it another week but so far doesn't do much. It's meant to have 325mg caffeine and 1.5g beta alanine per scoop but I don't feel either. Taste means nothing for pre workout's but I will say the pina colada is nice.

Gaspari SP250- Very good. Better for energy and focus than pumps bit overall a great pre workout. It did make me crash a bit later on though. I would get the shakes too. Ver strong even at just 1 scoop and it is not a 1 scoop formula.

Beast Yourself Raging Bull- Very good. On paper it is incredible but doesn't live on to that. Really good pumps and combined with an espresso it comes alive even more.

Lee Lebrada Super Charge Xtreme 4.0- Not impressed at all. I bought a big tub and I doubt I will even have half over 6 months. Not a cheap pre workout either. It's meant to have loads of caffeine in but I feel a single espresso more. Might be ok for some but definitely not for me.

Dorian Yates NOX Pump- Decent. I used this years ago and it was incredible. This time nowhere as good so the formula must be different (something got banned). Maybe better than decent as with an espresso I am an animal in the gym. This an a single espresso was a fav of mine for a while.

Cobra Labs The Curse- Fantastic. On paper this is the worst one. Very basic etc. I think it has 125mg caffeine and 5mg olive leaf extract. But I feel this a lot and it seems to get great reviews by most. Very cheap too. 2 scoops of this will make you a machine in the gym. 1 scoop (125mg caffeine) is stronger than Lee Lebrada's and Nitraflex that are suppose to have alsorts in including 325mg+ caffeine. Definitely recommend if you want something simple but effective.

GSN's NitroNOX Pro- Best pre workout I have ever taken. This is amazing for energy, pumps, mood etc. It has everything and I recommend it to anyone.

Matrix Nutrition NO Pump Xtreme- Amazing. This only has 80mg caffeine per scoop and is more a pump one. Incredible pumps and feel with a nice boost in energy. 2 scoops of this will give you ridiculous pumps and great energy. One of the best I have ever used.

MRI Black Powder- Crap. Not even worth writing more about. How can you fuck up a pre workout so much. 2 pro plus would be better.

Musclemeds NO BULL- Great product. Amazing for pumps and good energy. Feel very different but in a good way. Some of the best pumps ever but they fade away after 2 weeks or so.

Rich Piana's 5% Nutrition KILL IT- This one I only tried a sample so take this review with a pinch of salt. I wasn't impressed and expected/hoped for better as I like 5%. Didn't notice too much but again only a sample. I am gonna order a few of their products in the future so will get this to try out properly.


I have just order jym pre jym that is the best rated pre workout on bodybuilding.com. It sounds great so I am hoping it is. I know nothuman just used that so maybe you can chime in. Their list is nothing to go by though as nitraflex is no.6 and No Explode is no.3. Although I see the Curse is no. 5 so pleased about that. CT Fletcher's new pre workout looks good too.

There was a lot of talk on Angeldust by Blackstone Labs recently after I asked about it so thanks for the input. I may try that one time too (looks good).

Can't help but wonder if the curse had some dmha or something in it. I'll look jt up. Also I had 5% 5150 pwo and loved it never tried the kill it tho.

 

[samgraves82]

HYDE is the other one I plan to get... so yes about 10 of them

But it really is in the top 3 and I imagine I will try it out over the next few months. ProSupps do a great amino product I was using for intra workout... tastes amazing too.

itho.i like hyde a lot! Wanna try mixing with the jekyl soon

 

[Elvia1023]

If you are willing to try something new, Dedlift Dominus is very underrated...its sold on amazon and goes on sale very often. It tastes ehh but has a decent dose of Eria Jarensis and wont jack u up on caffeine, even if you 4x scoop it!. It gives u a great kick and focus more than most PW

Looking at the formula it doesn't look like anything special but you can't always go my the ingredient panel. Although I can't believe you just stated it won't jack you up on caffeine even if you take 4 scoops. No wonder it gives a great kick and focus at 4 scoops that totals 1000mg caffeine The 1000mg is made up from 600mg caffeine anhydrous, 200mg caffeine citrate and 200mg di-caffeine malate. On top of that you get 400 mg eria jarensis.

If you want something with decent caffeine but contains a large dose of eria jarensis you could try Inspired DVST8 which contains per 2 scoops (20 servings) 350mg caffeine and 300mg eria jarensis. Although I personally don't rate it that highly but it's not bad. Now 4 scoops and 10 servings like the deadlift dominus you are using would be 600mg ej and 700mg caffeine which for me is totally over the top and if you need that much you need to get off all stimulants for awhile. Although for someone who needed a lot 3 scoops would be 450mg eria jarensis and 525mg caffeine which is very high but nothing too crazy compared to some doses I hear but still pushing it.

 

[Elvia1023]

itho.i like hyde a lot! Wanna try mixing with the jekyl soon

Why do you keep quoting posts from years ago on this forum? Are you trying to get to 50 posts for the sponsor section? I made that post years ago and ended up using HYDE afterwards. I don't mind if you post 200 times per day on this forum as I don't care as it's none of my business but quoting very old posts is not the best way to go about things. Now if it's an old but decent thread that has become lost or you have a good point to make then sure but not some old random post from me about trying a product I later tried and scored and many others posted about. Although it's funny you quoted the amino post as I have posted about that recently.

Regarding The Curse it's very simple but very good. Yes definitely feels stronger than the ingredient label but at the same time quality caffeine can do alot. You quoted an old list and I have tried everything you just listed. 5150 is a great preworkout and I rate it very highly in every regard. Kill It is disappointing but would be fine for a newbie sensitive to stimulants.

 

[samgraves82]

Why do you keep quoting posts from years ago on this forum? Are you trying to get to 50 posts for the sponsor section? I made that post years ago and ended up using HYDE afterwards. I don't mind if you post 200 times per day on this forum as I don't care as it's none of my business but quoting very old posts is not the best way to go about things. Now if it's an old but decent thread that has become lost or you have a good point to make then sure but not some old random post from me about trying a product I later tried and scored and many others posted about. Although it's funny you quoted the amino post as I have posted about that recently.

Regarding The Curse it's very simple but very good. Yes definitely feels stronger than the ingredient label but at the same time quality caffeine can do alot. You quoted an old list and I have tried everything you just listed. 5150 is a great preworkout and I rate it very highly in every regard. Kill It is disappointing but would be fine for a newbie sensitive to stimulants.

It was at the top od my list this thread and several post on my end just the last few days. Ill pay more attn so ill pay more attn. That said i don't need no sponsor here nor do i plan using one here so take ur accusations else where amd thanks for the welcome asshole!!! But yes ur right I am trying to get to 50 post and not for reasons ur thinking. Sorry for trying to interact and don't assume I'm some new guy to the forums. I always use tapatalk so this ui is totally new !!! MY BAD!

 

[KillerStack]

Hydrazine was a bit of a let down for me. It starts amazingly but fades away fairly quickly for me. The focus is intense and it's very fast hitting so if you get it I would recommend taking it just before training. It contains a few effective things such as Bauhinia Purpurea Extract, Cymbidium Goeringii Extract (Orchilean) and Kigelia Africana Extract. The reviews from most are excellent so it's worth trying. It is very expensive so you could even try and get one of the 2 cap sample packs like I received with an order from predator in the UK.

I should add why not try Excelsior for the same website that sells the hydrazine?

I just got the Hydrazine, haven't tried it yet.

Have you ever tried bromantane and if so, what do you think of it? Same company sells it but appears they are out of it now. I have used quite a bit of it from another company and it causes a very long lasting stimulant effect. Some feel it's very mild but for me it's very strong.

 

[Elvia1023]

It was at the top od my list this thread and several post on my end just the last few days. Ill pay more attn so ill pay more attn. That said i don't need no sponsor here nor do i plan using one here so take ur accusations else where amd thanks for the welcome asshole!!! But yes ur right I am trying to get to 50 post and not for reasons ur thinking. Sorry for trying to interact and don't assume I'm some new guy to the forums. I always use tapatalk so this ui is totally new !!! MY BAD!

You may have posted elsewhere but you are obviously new here. I noticed you bumping up threads from years ago with no real reason. Then you do it for 2 posts in a row in this thread. Maybe you don't realize but they usually ban people for doing stuff like that. Plus 99% of the time it's because they want to get to 50 posts so that's why I asked. I couldn't care less if you want to use a sponsor or not but literally 99% of people who post like that do it to get to 50 posts. I honestly don't care if you post 200 times per day I figured I should mention it.

This thread had just been updated so it was at the top of the list but you are quoting posts from a few years ago. Nothing wrong with that but it's literally a post about me trying hyde soon and if you looked over the next page you see I tried it. Anyway it's not important and it's all pointless but trust me when new guys start quoting random posts from years ago it's definitely not liked by most on here. I am the last to have a go at someone for posting and your posts aren't bullshit and actually include your opinion (not 2 words like many do to get to 50 posts) so that's fine in my book but I figured I would mention it does annoy a lot of us.

 

[Elvia1023]

I just got the Hydrazine, haven't tried it yet.

Have you ever tried bromantane and if so, what do you think of it? Same company sells it but appears they are out of it now. I have used quite a bit of it from another company and it causes a very long lasting stimulant effect. Some feel it's very mild but for me it's very strong.

Judging by the reviews you will probably love it. I would recommend Excelsior if you have never used it as I feel it's better than hydrazine in all areas. I have never tried bromantane and as you stated they do sell some more obscure ingredients. The only other product I have tried in their range was their joint product called "Unbreakable" which contains Cissus Quadrangularis and BPC-157.

 

[sgtfury]

Amplify by cutler...the only one that doesnt make me sick

 

[Nyoco]

It was at the top od my list this thread and several post on my end just the last few days. Ill pay more attn so ill pay more attn. That said i don't need no sponsor here nor do i plan using one here so take ur accusations else where amd thanks for the welcome asshole!!! But yes ur right I am trying to get to 50 post and not for reasons ur thinking. Sorry for trying to interact and don't assume I'm some new guy to the forums. I always use tapatalk so this ui is totally new !!! MY BAD!

Elvia is a well respected and liked member on this forum, no need for the insults since he wasn´t insulting to you, not even in his reply to your "I´m a rude hermaphrodite" post (you exhibit character traits of both the male and female genitalia) if you aren´t new to the forums you should know quoting really old posts is not the best etiquette nor is piss poor posting to reach the 50 count.