Training on an empty stomach

[Chipper Jones78]

You should be calling me out. I would. Why do you think AAS are so effective at reducing catabolism? They help shift this ratio in favor of limiting muscle burning during exercise.

I learned this back in 1990 from OTS. I'll be damned if it isn't true. Do you think you have an endless supply of blood glucose and liver glycogen to burn while you lift? You don't unless you are sipping a carb drink during training.

Does anyone remember Critical Mass carb and amino supplement OTS was selling back in '95? I know Phil does. That was one of the best anti-catabolic supplements I've ever used simply because it addressed this muscle burning issue with all the bases covered.

My experience has been that I gained muscle much easier when I had the carb drink with training and aminos immediately after. Now it's a whole new ballgame for me. No more carb dominate diet. Yes, I'm a nonuser.

Thanks for the response.

No, I wont call you out (lol) just your statement, which you have yet to prove to me. I love to know how you came up with "50% muscle tissue loss when training on a empty stomach"

 

[kingpeon]

Thanks for the response.

No, I wont call you out (lol) just your statement, which you have yet to prove to me. I love to know how you came up with "50% muscle tissue loss when training on a empty stomach"

Serious Growth newsletter from early 1990's. I forgot which issue. Bulgarian, Russian and East German research. It's possible new research has found this to be false ,BUT I'd rather be safe than sorry. They've been on the cutting edge about everything else so why doubt them now.

50% refers to total muscle loss relative to fat loss due to the catabolic effect of weight training past the point, 20 minutes or so, when all preferred fuel sources are no longer available, i.e. blood glucose, liver glycogen, muscle glycogen.

Hypothetically, if you lost one pound of bodyweight, I know nobody is going to lose a pound of weight from a 45 minute weight session, eight ounces would be comprised of muscle tissue.

 

[Aaron Osaka]

Interesting, I wouldn't want to be one of your clients. The "experts" I train by have been in this business for literally decades. To each his own.

I never said I am against training on an empty stomach; some people work better that way. My original post was about the fear of heavy oxidative protein breakdown during training.

 

[kingpeon]

I never said I am against training on an empty stomach; some people work better that way. My original post was about the fear of heavy oxidative protein breakdown during training.

I'd like to know what you've learned. :lightbulb: So, your education refutes this info I've been passing on. I'm not telling anyone to live by what I'm saying. I just come across that way.

Protein breakdown is not this dramatic?

 

[Aaron Osaka]

I'd like to know what you've learned. :lightbulb: So, your education refutes this info I've been passing on. I'm not telling anyone to live by what I'm saying. I just come across that way.

Protein breakdown is not this dramatic?

If you were heavy training for less than an hour with full glycogen stores (and even not having eaten for many hours), the answer is no; it may count for 3-18% during very heavy activity (likely even more if you are completely glycogen depleted and don't have anything in your stomach but training this way would seem to be very catabolic).

Even very high intensity resistance training may reduce glycogen levels by "only" 20-60% percent. (at least 4 studies back this one up)

(In regards to protein breakdown during training):
Amino acid and protein metabolism during exercise ... [Med Sci Sports Exerc. 1987] - PubMed result

 

[ojs]

This is what I do, too. It's the best time under the best conditions, for me.

I like a handful of aminos 30 minutes prior and during and immediately after as well.

I do about the same. 10g BCAAs and 20g EAAs pre workout. And then 8oz raw milk post workout with 20-30g of high quality protein powder.

 

[kingpeon]

OJS, gains come a lot easier when you have all those aminos ready to go to work for you, don't they? Nothing like exploiting that 2 hour window of opportunity.

 

[SL1CED]

For me, I always read to take plenty of complex carbs before but looking back, I realized all those workouts I came in bloated and sluggish. I'm not a carb person at all.

In my new diet, by Alex, my pre-workout meal is about an hour before and it's real light in terms of volume. I've had great workouts, no bloat, and no sluggish feeling. Not only do I feel good, I can actually perform better cause of it. I get bloated for about 15-20 min after every meal, but it sets aside. Before, I just would feel like crap and have crappy workouts.

Heck I get better pumps from this low-carb diet than I did before with enormous carbs, and when I asked such a question on why I get no pumps, the other forums I was at said to eat more carbs before your work out.

 

[mexbeast]

ok, lets put an end to this sht, if you want maximum fat lose go empty stomach, any catabolism you may create you will more than compensate for by the anabolic effect of your weight lifting wo, for maximum muscle growth then eat/drink something before wo.

 

[kingpeon]

for maximum muscle growth then eat/drink something before wo.

Just so long as you don't "blow your insulin load" and not have enough for your aminos after your workout.

 

[plang]

Just so long as you don't "blow your insulin load" and not have enough for your aminos after your workout.

Amino acids (especially leucine) and whey protein do create their own insulin response.....I've never heard of the scientific term or equivalent of "blowing you insulin load"....sounds like bro-science

 

[kingpeon]

Amino acids (especially leucine) and whey protein do create their own insulin response.....I've never heard of the scientific term or equivalent of "blowing you insulin load"....sounds like bro-science

Simple, use the wrong carb source during your workout, i.e. some simple sugar, and you will "blow your insulin load", crash and have nothing for your aminos to be shuttled into the muscle with immediately after your workout. This is all, hypothetically, taking place within 45 minutes to one hour.

 

[plang]

I understand what ur trying to convey...but we don't have a storage tank of insulin in our body that gets "tapped dry".....blood sugar cam rise, fall, and rise again in an hour period easily. Spiking insulin pre workout has been shown o be quite anti catabolic.

 

[kingpeon]

I understand what ur trying to convey...but we don't have a storage tank of insulin in our body that gets "tapped dry".....blood sugar cam rise, fall, and rise again in an hour period easily. Spiking insulin pre workout has been shown o be quite anti catabolic.

I must be training on outdated concepts then.

How beneficial could it be to spike insulin and then crash 20 minutes later?

Are you going to have energy when this happens?

Do you like to train with your insulin levels bouncing all over the board?

The only insulin surge I feel comfortable with at training time is from the aminos I take, but hey that's me.

 

[Blade_HST]

Some interesting articles/posts on the subject of fasted training:

**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

And one showing you could potentially increase resting muscle glycogen by up to 55% training fasted:

**broken link removed**

 

[Known_u]

Howdy Y'all

Hey everybody,

penis. There are different types of penis stretching exercises but their basic principle is the same: stretching the tissue of the penis. Stretching makes cells composing your penis grow increasing the length and thickness (less effective) of your penis.
Kegel exercises. These exercises are not directed to the penis itself, but the level of the pubococcygeus, which is delayed for the erection. Therefore, if you train this muscle, you can prolong your erections. That's why you should see a great site like**broken link removed** No expansion of natural penis exercises work
Penis Exercises
As the penis contains no muscles there are no exercises or massage techniques that can expand, (except in the short term).
Many programs and products found on the secret of the true claim to have increased a larger penis. Potential customers should be careful because there are no scientifically proven to increase your penis size without risk. All for the "scientific" I do not want a team of infomercials, but a regulated, controlled, and the investigation of how the U.S. Food and Drug Administration. Surgery for **broken link removed** Enlargement

Surgery offers the only permanent solution for enlargement of the **broken link removed**. Through surgery, the **broken link removed** can be visually enlarged, usually by just over an inch. The surgeon will cut the ligaments that hold the **broken link removed** in its usual position and this allows the **broken link removed** to descend. Weights, or stretching devices, are then used for a few months to effect a permanent increase in size. The procedure may result in scar tissue, the erection will point down, and the base of the **broken link removed** will be hairy.
Another surgical technique is known as a dermal implant. Girth and length can be increased by transplanting fat cells from other parts of the body to the **broken link removed**. As the size of head of the **broken link removed** cannot be increased the results can be visually rather odd.
Sometimes the distribution of the grafted cells results in clumping and a gives a far from smooth result. Many Urologists will not perform this type of surgery unless there are good therapeutic reasons.

Cost of Surgical Enlargement of the **broken link removed**

New participant here just saying hey there. In case you would like to get to learn far a lot more about what I do, go to my weblog at **broken link removed**. I look forward to finding to learn anybody.
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

 

[Known_u]

Hi Everyone There

Hey there every person,

The following is an explanation of how different penis exercises work:
Milk. Jelqing is probably the oldest technique for Male Enhancement was (used by nomadic tribes of Arabia.) Movement is similar to "milking" the penis to the amount of blood, the corpora Covernosa (the penis fills with blood increase during filling and enhanced erections ), your penis more visible. The important fact is that jelqing, if performed regularly, can permanently increase the size of the Covernosa corporations and therefore the size of his penis (length and girth). That's why you should see a great site like**broken link removed** No expansion of natural penis exercises work
Vacuum pumps are placed on the penis. The air sucked into the hose, whereby pressure. Consequently, the blood in the penis is forced rapidly as in an erection. A ring is then temporarily applied to the base of the penis to drain the blood to stop quickly. Penis enlargement is to work only for 24 hours.
You can also have side effects. Burst blood vessels and cause inflammation and pain. If you want to try a vacuum device for erectile dysfunction, or if you feel could be a nice feeling to be aware of potential hazards designed and the fact that some devices are available bad. Many men think their **broken link removed** is small, often too small. Research confirms that heterosexual men worry about **broken link removed** size more than women do, and are more dissatisfied with the size of their own **broken link removed** than women are with their partners’ **broken link removed** size. There are many reasons why men think their **broken link removed** is too small, and all of them have to do with comparing your **broken link removed** to someone else’s **broken link removed**, which, I would argue, is a fruitless exercise.

Early **broken link removed** Sightings

For many men the first time they see **broken link removed**es as adolescents will be seeing their father naked. If you’re very young seeing a naked parent’s **broken link removed** will likely seem big both because of the difference in body size between a child and an adult, and also because of the angle (seeing something from below can make it look bigger). In this way some of men’s earliest data on **broken link removed** size are skewed.

Fresh participant at this point just saying greetings. In case you ever would like to get to understand additional about what I do, check out my weblog at **broken link removed**. I look forward to having to learn every person.
**broken link removed**
**broken link removed**

 

[geoscockisita]

The Fundamentals of Playing Casino Online

From there, make sure that when you wager with an online casino that you know exactly what you are doing. The biggest mistake that you could possibly make would be to place bets on games that you are unsure of. For example, if you want to play blackjack at an online casino but do not know how, make sure you get some details first. If you do not, you are doing the equivalent of throwing your money out the window. The bottom line is that you can never win at an online casino if you do not know the rules of the games that you are going to play.
**broken link removed** **broken link removed** <a href="http://www.casinolesoleil.com">casino</a> The first thing to learn about is that there are three different types of casinos on the net; web-based, download-based, and live-based online casinos.
online betting Online Sports Betting | Bet Online at PulseBet.com Sportsbook | Free Bet <a href="http://www.pulsebet.com">bet online</a> **broken link removed** **broken link removed** <a href="http://www.redlotuscasino.com">casino</a> It is a whole new world in the internet. As with the real world, it has its good side, and its bad side. You have to be really careful when trying the online casinos, so you have the sole responsibility of protecting yourself from being cheated, and from fraud. **broken link removed** **broken link removed** <a href="http://www.triumphcasino.com">casino</a> **broken link removed** **broken link removed** On each one of these bingo cards, you will find 27 spaces grouped in 9 columns x 3 rows format. Each number is unduplicated; hence, it will not be repeated anywhere else in the sheet. bingo **broken link removed** <a href="http://www.bingokisses.com">bingo</a> <a href="http://www.bingoeuphoria.com">bingo</a> Bingo Kisses | Under Construction | Online Bingo **broken link removed** With online bingo your cards are randomly selected by the computer and you can play with a great number of cards sometimes as many as 100 or more. Ordinarily you will need no more than three or four cards. A display board or a caller will flash your bingo numbers and you will need to fill the pattern displayed to win the game. Some online games will have the computer automatically search and fill the numbers for you. Some people find this automation a kill-joy but some actually love the fact that all they have to do watch for the bingo flash!!!
**broken link removed** **broken link removed** **broken link removed** Bingo Kisses | Under Construction | Online Bingo **broken link removed** Online Sports Betting | Bet Online at PulseBet.com Sportsbook | Free Bet **broken link removed** **broken link removed**
**broken link removed** **broken link removed** Buy Levitra Online | Cheap Levitra | No RX Levitra <a href="http://www.buyphentermine1.com">buy phentermine</a>
Buy Levitra Online | Cheap Levitra | No RX Levitra viagra online <a href="http://www.norxbuy.com">buy viagra</a>

 

[Chipper Jones78]

It's refreshing to have threads such as these rather then, "I want blow up and do Anadrol 50 for 2 weeks"

Bump.

 

[Chipper Jones78]

Serious Growth newsletter from early 1990's. I forgot which issue. Bulgarian, Russian and East German research. It's possible new research has found this to be false ,BUT I'd rather be safe than sorry. They've been on the cutting edge about everything else so why doubt them now.

50% refers to total muscle loss relative to fat loss due to the catabolic effect of weight training past the point, 20 minutes or so, when all preferred fuel sources are no longer available, i.e. blood glucose, liver glycogen, muscle glycogen.

Hypothetically, if you lost one pound of bodyweight, I know nobody is going to lose a pound of weight from a 45 minute weight session, eight ounces would be comprised of muscle tissue.

Forgive me if I am not reading between the lines, however, I still consider when taking BCAA's is still training on a empty stomach.

I do this, I train in the morning, pop a thermo with a black coffee and some BCAA's then go train. Finish training, pop a few more BCAA's and have my protein shake with olive oil, uncooked oats & wheat bran. Feel freaking great after this

Have not noticed muscle loss, the only thing I can attest to, is I am not as strong as I would like to be.

I still dont see how I am muscle wasting.

I if Anabolics are in the mix and you train on a empty stomach, are we still muscle wasting?

I am just trying to understand the logic here.
Chip