TRT + Fertility Protocol, and Few Questions

[Flex500]

Sure, the main reason for dropping the Test dose was because I don't like using AI's and HCG spikes estrogen a good bit, so the goal was just enough Testosterone / Estrogen to feel good. Later introduced a little primo and raised Test back up. This was after being on TRT for 15+ years with no HCG.

For about 6 months:

70mg Test E
200iu HCG daily
HMG 75iu 2 x weekly (added in around month 4)



Wife became pregnant around month 5-6.

The main things that seemed to have the most impact was HCG to get things online and working and HMG added in later to really kick up spermatogenesis.

awesome thanks man!

 

[marssel]

I loaded up the syringe yesterday to start 10mgs EOD but didn't do it lol. I'm such a sissy.

I read about every thread from emeric and I know his stance is the 10mgs either ED or EOD is not going to shut down sperm production or impact motility. I just can't quite square that in my mind. Now that being said if I'm taking the HCG and HMG it's hard to imagine the low of a dose of test impacting what those drugs are doing (or actually any dose of test for that matter as those drugs should still "work"). I also theorize the enclomiphene may or should still have a positive impact on that low of a dose of test. The thing I find interesting about emerics comments he is saying you don't even need the fertility drugs and the humanafort is the key with the tribestan being the cherry on top. That, I really can't square. Even on a dose that low I'd have to think your body would reduce LH and FSH. The closest I could find was a study on a one shot of 100mgs of test which reduced LH and FSH output by over 30%

I did talk to my doctor and he basically said of course if you wanted a way to play it 100% safe just stay off the test but if I add in 40-70mgs of test a week it's not like I'm "starting over" persay if I'm continuing with the fertility drugs.

As I said before, this has nothing to do with muscle. I could not care less about that right now. This is about me trying to have sex each month with what is basically a cooked noodle lmao.

i wouldnt take shit but if you must go with anavar, i was off for 2 1/2 years and we r due in in spring. my test was 17 but i made myself train and drive thru, most important thing in your life why would you go with maybe, ALL MY DOCS SAID TAKE ABSOLUTELY NO DRUGS, i got a son coming so those tough years don't mean shit and coming out of it my body is exploding on 500 mgs a week.

 

[Flex500]

i wouldnt take shit but if you must go with anavar, i was off for 2 1/2 years and we r due in in spring. my test was 17 but i made myself train and drive thru, most important thing in your life why would you go with maybe, ALL MY DOCS SAID TAKE ABSOLUTELY NO DRUGS, i got a son coming so those tough years don't mean shit and coming out of it my body is exploding on 500 mgs a week.

Yeah I mean that is essentially why I held off. Again though, my concern is nothing to do with muscle it's libido. 100mgs of pharma viagara and we are barely...and I mean barely able to have sex three times in a month.

It would be irresponsible, I believe, for me to take anything until I have a semen analysis though. My wife should be ovulating around the 8th-10th so we will get through this one, I'll get my semen analysis next week and we will see what's what.

But my desire to take anything is solely to make myself functional.

 

[Flex500]

Just for logging purposes:

Estimated ovulation date is around the 9th so we are going to try to give it a good 4-5 times we are also using one of those digital more accurate ovulation monitors.

I took 10mgs of test today and will continue that EOD. I have HCG and HMG coming from Direct (great price) but also ordered more pharma HMG and HCG. HCG will be EOD in the morning with my 10mgs test at 1,000IU and HMG will be three times a week at 75IU.

After this ovulation period I will get my semen analysis done.

 

[Flex500]

Did speak with a urologist and he said this may help a bit with libido and as long as I'm taking fertility meds didn't think it would hurt. He actually said as an out of the box idea I could take this dose (if I feel it helps) the 20 days of the month and hit the HCG and HMG even harder the off week. He even said he could poke holes in that method (ie not perfect) but I feel like a bag of dog shit now so maybe that would help and although the half life is long with T.E. I'd be literally taking a total of ~100mgs spread out over two weeks in the entire month. I think his view overall is this low of test spread out won't really help or hurt but if it makes me mentally feel better then "ok". He did tell me to keep the EC in because on that low of a test dose he was optimistic it would still do something.

so full protocol:

1,000iu HCG EOD
75IU HMG 3x per week
12.5mgs - 18mgs EC / day
10mgs test EOD for only the first 20 days of the month (see above...yes...this is weird)
Humanofort 400mgs ED

 

[bad rad]

Did speak with a urologist and he said this may help a bit with libido and as long as I'm taking fertility meds didn't think it would hurt. He actually said as an out of the box idea I could take this dose (if I feel it helps) the 20 days of the month and hit the HCG and HMG even harder the off week. He even said he could poke holes in that method (ie not perfect) but I feel like a bag of dog shit now so maybe that would help and although the half life is long with T.E. I'd be literally taking a total of ~100mgs spread out over two weeks in the entire month. I think his view overall is this low of test spread out won't really help or hurt but if it makes me mentally feel better then "ok". He did tell me to keep the EC in because on that low of a test dose he was optimistic it would still do something.

so full protocol:

1,000iu HCG EOD
75IU HMG 3x per week
12.5mgs - 18mgs EC / day
10mgs test EOD for only the first 20 days of the month (see above...yes...this is weird)
Humanofort 400mgs ED

Send your doc this. I'd bump the Enclomiphene to 25mg daily minimum based on the protocol this clinic used. 50mg Clomid contains 25-33mgs enclomiphene depending on the source of info.

Acta Medica International

www.actamedicainternational.com

Weird question but bear with me. For the gents that have been using fertility protocols with hCG and/or hMG have you noticed increased testicle sensitivity? I don't mean the internal pressure feelings from restarting them after a long shutdown but the "I bumped my nuts and it dropped me to my knees" sensitivity. I ask because when I'm shutdown from lack of hCG inclusion my testicles aren't very sensitive but lately I've been using Tribestan 500mg x3 daily and wow, they're tender but in what feels like pre-TRT days. I found it interesting.

Another protocol I may try again in two weeks is below. It sky rocketed my libido but I tore my shoulder and couldn't work out so I dropped my doses way down. I'm traveling without a fridge available so I left my hCG behind.

Week 1: 200mg Test Cyp (nets me 600-800s serum test at trough)
Week 2: 200mg Test Cyp
Week 2/3: 250iu hCG/50mg enclomiphene daily each
Week 4: start over

The idea behind this is it staves off shutdown and adaption since you're never completely on one protocol over 2 weeks. It felt fairly effective for the few weeks I was able to try it. I think dropping the test down to 100mg week may help a little since lower dosed TRT guys tend to remain fertile longer anecdotally. Anyway, just a bunch of stuff to consider.

 

[Flex500]

Send your doc this. I'd bump the Enclomiphene to 25mg daily minimum based on the protocol this clinic used. 50mg Clomid contains 25-33mgs enclomiphene depending on the source of info.

Acta Medica International

www.actamedicainternational.com

Weird question but bear with me. For the gents that have been using fertility protocols with hCG and/or hMG have you noticed increased testicle sensitivity? I don't mean the internal pressure feelings from restarting them after a long shutdown but the "I bumped my nuts and it dropped me to my knees" sensitivity. I ask because when I'm shutdown from lack of hCG inclusion my testicles aren't very sensitive but lately I've been using Tribestan 500mg x3 daily and wow, they're tender but in what feels like pre-TRT days. I found it interesting.

Another protocol I may try again in two weeks is below. It sky rocketed my libido but I tore my shoulder and couldn't work out so I dropped my doses way down. I'm traveling without a fridge available so I left my hCG behind.

Week 1: 200mg Test Cyp (nets me 600-800s serum test at trough)
Week 2: 200mg Test Cyp
Week 2/3: 250iu hCG/50mg enclomiphene daily each
Week 4: start over

The idea behind this is it staves off shutdown and adaption since you're never completely on one protocol over 2 weeks. It felt fairly effective for the few weeks I was able to try it. I think dropping the test down to 100mg week may help a little since lower dosed TRT guys tend to remain fertile longer anecdotally. Anyway, just a bunch of stuff to consider.

Interesting! Cant help much on the testicle stuff but curious what others say. I’ve always noticed dramatic size changes but not a lot as far as sensitivity.

My dog did say up to 25 mgs would be fine and I think his theory was similar to yours on the test front. I mean my 10mgs EOD is almost nothing but his thought was if I thought it helped (even psychologically) to just take it 15-20 days of the month, then off.

I’ve said it a million times but for me is I just need a damn semen analysis which I am getting week after next. If it comes back good I’ll keep hitting the hcg and hmg and probably get back to my normal 10mgs/day.

 

[Delt123]

How is your wife responding to this? Is she mad that’s it has happened yet due to you using aas?

 

[Flex500]

How is your wife responding to this? Is she mad that’s it has happened yet due to you using aas?

Nah not at all. It happened right away with our first kid and we were talking about if we for sure wanted to try or not until October-ish so it sort of fills like we’ve actually tried only 1-2 months.

I also have a feeling when I get my semen analysis in two weeks it’s going to look good and it’s hopefully just a matter of time. The biggest frustration is me and the ED I have now. That is by far the worst stress and it’s not even close. I have the libido of a 4 years old girl at this point…100% non-existent. I’m more the anxious one.

We also are not spring chickens. Wife is 38 and will be 39 on 2/26. I think we will give it a good year of trying from here and if not look at adopting. I’m optimistic it will work out now. My balls are like nectarines and my count was always sky high before lol.

 

[marssel]

L

Yeah I mean that is essentially why I held off. Again though, my concern is nothing to do with muscle it's libido. 100mgs of pharma viagara and we are barely...and I mean barely able to have sex three times in a month.

It would be irresponsible, I believe, for me to take anything until I have a semen analysis though. My wife should be ovulating around the 8th-10th so we will get through this one, I'll get my semen analysis next week and we will see what's what.

But my desire to take anything is solely to make myself functional.

 

[marssel]

Yeah I mean that is essentially why I held off. Again though, my concern is nothing to do with muscle it's libido. 100mgs of pharma viagara and we are barely...and I mean barely able to have sex three times in a month.

It would be irresponsible, I believe, for me to take anything until I have a semen analysis though. My wife should be ovulating around the 8th-10th so we will get through this one, I'll get my semen analysis next week and we will see what's what.

But my desire to take anything is solely to make myself functional.

Ok so same thing with me I was jacking off with a limp dick and on game day you gotta perform so what I did was blast shit then clear out along with Melanotan which makes your dick hard as fuck. So MEL II daily, then on the week of get some legit prop take 100 mgs, I used my Jelfa test e 100-one of the best tests I’ve ever touched, then took Anadrol 100 mg Ed for like 3 days prior then pulled it all. It’s a blast not a steady low dose which will less affect your HPTA especially the orals. On those days I also took 5,000 iu HCG to make sure my LH stim of my nuts stayed on point but looking at my son on ultrasound even with the kidney scare, which would’ve been a simple fix if there had been a blockage, dims a total mind fuck. I think guys who have kids younger and/or on accident don’t realize how amazing it all is. I know the body like no other thing but pregnancy is a whole new world bro.

 

[bad rad]

Nah not at all. It happened right away with our first kid and we were talking about if we for sure wanted to try or not until October-ish so it sort of fills like we’ve actually tried only 1-2 months.

I also have a feeling when I get my semen analysis in two weeks it’s going to look good and it’s hopefully just a matter of time. The biggest frustration is me and the ED I have now. That is by far the worst stress and it’s not even close. I have the libido of a 4 years old girl at this point…100% non-existent. I’m more the anxious one.

We also are not spring chickens. Wife is 38 and will be 39 on 2/26. I think we will give it a good year of trying from here and if not look at adopting. I’m optimistic it will work out now. My balls are like nectarines and my count was always sky high before lol.

Don't stress over your age. My youngest was born when I was 37.

 

[Flex500]

Ok so same thing with me I was jacking off with a limp dick and on game day you gotta perform so what I did was blast shit then clear out along with Melanotan which makes your dick hard as fuck. So MEL II daily, then on the week of get some legit prop take 100 mgs, I used my Jelfa test e 100-one of the best tests I’ve ever touched, then took Anadrol 100 mg Ed for like 3 days prior then pulled it all. It’s a blast not a steady low dose which will less affect your HPTA especially the orals. On those days I also took 5,000 iu HCG to make sure my LH stim of my nuts stayed on point but looking at my son on ultrasound even with the kidney scare, which would’ve been a simple fix if there had been a blockage, dims a total mind fuck. I think guys who have kids younger and/or on accident don’t realize how amazing it all is. I know the body like no other thing but pregnancy is a whole new world bro.

You know that is super interesting. So basically when it was ovulation week you took prop and anadrol for a very short time, upped the hcg, and then pulled the prop and anadrol. That does seem logical because my biggest issue is my ED and no libido. I don’t even care about libido I just need to get a boner lol.

 

[Flex500]

Don't stress over your age. My youngest was born when I was 37.

Thanks brother! I appreciate that! My brother was also born when my step mom was 41 and my wife is exceptionally healthy. She turns 39 on feb 26th. It just gets in my head. Wish we would have started this even a year or so ago.

 

[bad rad]

My Nanny had my Mom at 44 back in the 50s. 40s are no longer the obstacle they used to be, heck, Janet Jackson was in her 50s.

 

[Flex500]

My Nanny had my Mom at 44 back in the 50s. 40s are no longer the obstacle they used to be, heck, Janet Jackson was in her 50s.

Hey let me ask a question…from all my research it sounds alike HCG will cease or radically slow endogenous LH production…and I’m obviously taking HCG.

My question is while I’m stressing about taking 10mgs of test EOD is my LH already shut down dude to taking 3,000-5,000iu of of hcg a week?

 

[bad rad]

Hey let me ask a question…from all my research it sounds alike HCG will cease or radically slow endogenous LH production…and I’m obviously taking HCG.

My question is while I’m stressing about taking 10mgs of test EOD is my LH already shut down dude to taking 3,000-5,000iu of of hcg a week?

I'd check blood work but Clomid is shown to prevent LH suppression while using hCG. I think you're probably alright since you're taking hMG too. It's also a source of LH. Realistically, your current protocol is bypassing any HPTA suppression.

Any chance you saw my PM?

 

[Flex500]

I'd check blood work but Clomid is shown to prevent LH suppression while using hCG. I think you're probably alright since you're taking hMG too. It's also a source of LH. Realistically, your current protocol is bypassing any HPTA suppression.

Any chance you saw my PM?

Ok cool…oh shoot I did not…I’m terrible at checking them I’ll take a look.

 

[bad rad]

Just for info, LH only has a 30(ish) minute active life so if you test your hMG you need to inject right before blood work.

 

[Flex500]

So tl;dr is

Enclomiphene instead of clomid

Hcg

Low dose test to maintain mental health / libido / hardness

Hmg

Anything im missing?

Also can u really produce enough sperm on a test cycle if u use those

Sounds crazy since then that also means u can produce sperm just fine on a full blast.

Yeah I think you got it down. As far as can you produce sperm I’d say if you are using legit hcg and hmg you have to remember it bypasses everything and, for lack of better words, shoots a signal to your nuts to “do stuff” ie produce testosterone and sperm.

Now, things get interesting when you talk about dose. I chose to come off for 5-6 months and suffer just because. Since I’m literally non functional I’ve opted for 10mgs of test EOD. The question I think you (and many of us are asking) is as long as you are on hmg and hcg does it matter if you take 500mgs of test or 50mgs of test a week?

I don’t know. But, logically, I feel like an absurdly low, but effective enough to function, dose would be best. I’d even argue the enclomiphene may still “work” on that low of a dose and I don’t think it would have a chance on higher test. Some of this is speculatory of course.