Using Yohimbine HCL on a Bulk

[Flocci]

My understanding has always been any kind of stimulant will inhibit muscle gaining (size) Old school guys wouldn't even do any cardio for 8-12 weeks while bulking. Personally, I always continue with a low amount of cardio while bulking. Everyone is different, keep us posted.

they also rave about how they used to slam OTC ephedrine in the offseason so which one is it :') You also had mike mentzer and several others frequently using meth as a preworkout but they seem to have made pretty good gains.

Im not saying stimulants are a good thing in the offseason though. Just playing devils advocate here.

 

[qbkilla]

In theory it would keep you from getting as fat as you would without. But in practice I bet you will look 0 percent different. Your not going from 7 percent to 6. Your basically pissing in the wind

 

[Sectør]

It could be good for keeping your insulin sensitivity high/higher when you really start ppushing the carbs in the later bulk, as long as you’re still able to hit your calories

 

[3BILLS]

Touche, but if it slightly prevents me from getting fatter if I slip up a little or lets me bulk longer, that would be pretty cool. Honestly, I am just curious if my theory has some possible value to it.

On top of that, it would be a pretty sick recomp tool if you can stay at maintenance and lose body fat

I understand how your thinking because I've been there before

Change your mindset. Control your diet and you can save these little tools for when you really need them when you diet.

It's not gonna do shit if you cheat on your diet. Instead of bulking longer do a mini diet then start over.

 

[massephase]

If it didnt make me feel like garbage for 6 hours and stress my CNS so bad i'd give it a shot but the fatigue that it accumulates is just not worth it imo.

But if you tolerate it, have at it and report back what your results are.


Has anyone here ran rauwolscine and yohimbine hcl? im wondering if rauwolscine is more tolerable in terms of the side effects like anxiety, jitters, fatigue, brainfog and tense muscles, jaw clenching etc?


What about a stack like: 200-300mg caffeine, 2-4mg nicotine, 1-2mg albuterol, 5-20mg methylene blue, 500mg carnitine and maybe 250-500mcg slu-pp-332 before fasted cardio in the morning? Adding yohimbine if you can tolerate it.

I would never recommend nicotine to anyone not yet addicted to it unless they have superhuman self control.

 

[KingOfSushi]

I too remember it being discussed before, but I could not dig up anything. Most individuals have a pretty strong reaction to it, but I feel totally fine running 25mg with a cup of black coffee in the morning.

I agree though, as always, if something feels like a bigger burden than aid, one should remove it from their protocol.

You can go for it if you’d like, but I wouldn’t expect any noticeable difference than without tbh. I’d focus more on the big picture things. Keeping your diet controlled, keeping cardio and neat, good macro setup etc

 

[Flocci]

It could be good for keeping your insulin sensitivity high/higher when you really start ppushing the carbs in the later bulk, as long as you’re still able to hit your calories

How would it improve your insulin sensitivity? i would think the increased stress response, cortisol/catecholamines and general fatigue it can cause would be detrimental in that regard and for recovery in general. I could see you indirectly staying a bit more insulin sensitive over time if it kept yourself leaner but i dont think that would be significant enough or possible to measure or notice.

 

[Sectør]

How would it improve your insulin sensitivity? i would think the increased stress response, cortisol/catecholamines and general fatigue it can cause would be detrimental in that regard and for recovery in general. I could see you indirectly staying a bit more insulin sensitive over time if it kept yourself leaner but i dont think that would be significant enough or possible to measure or notice.

I’m thinking of you’re doing fasted cardio with it you’d be burning through blood sugar faster which could be on the higher side if you’re late into a bulk Pushing 600g+ carbs with hgh (and not using insulin). If your blood sugar is under control your pancreas won’t need to produce as much insulin, which could lead to better insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance over time—compared to your blood sugar being high and your pancreas constantly having to pump out insulin(which would increase insulin resistance)

That’s the theory anyways. I haven’t tried yohimbine yet but I just ordered some and will be incorporating it fasted and doing some frequent blood sugar checks so I’ll probably have better data within a few weeks

 

[DecaForDessert]

I understand how your thinking because I've been there before

Change your mindset. Control your diet and you can save these little tools for when you really need them when you diet.

It's not gonna do shit if you cheat on your diet. Instead of bulking longer do a mini diet then start over.

I appreciate the input and completely agree there is no tool that will beat out a cheating diet (besides high dose tren I guess?).

I guess by cheating on my diet I mean my once a week Sunday dinner with my mom. Polish food is hard to throw into macrofactor lol, but it's just healthy home cooked stuff.

 

[DecaForDessert]

I would never recommend nicotine to anyone not yet addicted to it unless they have superhuman self control.

Yep lol, started with zyns for the feel good effect and it took me 2 years to drop it. Stay the fuuuuck away

 

[DecaForDessert]

How would it improve your insulin sensitivity? i would think the increased stress response, cortisol/catecholamines and general fatigue it can cause would be detrimental in that regard and for recovery in general. I could see you indirectly staying a bit more insulin sensitive over time if it kept yourself leaner but i dont think that would be significant enough or possible to measure or notice.

"some studies show yohimbine can improve insulin secretion in individuals with a specific ADRA2A variant, others show no significant effect on insulin sensitivity in healthy individuals or those with a different ADRA2A variant"

 

[DecaForDessert]

awesome, pleas

I’m thinking of you’re doing fasted cardio with it you’d be burning through blood sugar faster which could be on the higher side if you’re late into a bulk Pushing 600g+ carbs with hgh (and not using insulin). If your blood sugar is under control your pancreas won’t need to produce as much insulin, which could lead to better insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance over time—compared to your blood sugar being high and your pancreas constantly having to pump out insulin(which would increase insulin resistance)

That’s the theory anyways. I haven’t tried yohimbine yet but I just ordered some and will be incorporating it fasted and doing some frequent blood sugar checks so I’ll probably have better data within a few weeks

Awesome, please report back your findings!

 

[DecaForDessert]

Honestly guys, it is so cheap that im going to do it for shits and giggles (I already have like a years worth stockpiled, I accidentally left my amazon subscription on for too long and kept forgetting to turn it off) and just document the results. I am very curious more so on its possible "recomp" effect than anything else now.

Referencing this study: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17214405/

21 days for a 2% decrease in body fat just by doing the same routine and adding in yohimbine. We shall see.

I am in my maintenance phase now basically, so I will just keep calories the same and see if fat in the abdominal area deports itself. Next will be the incorporation of using it on a bulk.

 

[Sectør]

Honestly guys, it is so cheap that im going to do it for shits and giggles (I already have like a years worth stockpiled, I accidentally left my amazon subscription on for too long and kept forgetting to turn it off) and just document the results. I am very curious more so on its possible "recomp" effect than anything else now.

Referencing this study: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17214405/

21 days for a 2% decrease in body fat just by doing the same routine and adding in yohimbine. We shall see.

I am in my maintenance phase now basically, so I will just keep calories the same and see if fat in the abdominal area deports itself. Next will be the incorporation of using it on a bulk.

Gh+ l carnitine + yohimbine would honestly be wicked in a fasted state. That’s what I’ll be trying.

I probably need to get a CGM for blood sugar readings to do it properly, just heard they can be pretty inaccurate, maybe moreso than the strips?

 

[DecaForDessert]

Gh+ l carnitine + yohimbine would honestly be wicked in a fasted state. That’s what I’ll be trying.

I probably need to get a CGM for blood sugar readings to do it properly, just heard they can be pretty inaccurate, maybe moreso than the strips?

Are you trying to ensure that you are indeed "fasted" with the blood sugar readings?

L-carnitine can be taken whenever you are eating a heavy carb meal, it does not do much good when there is no insulin present in the blood (insulin is what shuttles it into the muscles). Once an individual is saturated with L carnitine is when the body will start transporting fatty acids into the mitochondria to be used for energy, it will be a 24/7 mechanism of action if you stay saturated. You can also incorporate Lucine pre workout with carbs to trigger a higher insulin spike or take ~2iu insulin post L carnitine injection.

Take 5mg (try to work up to 25mg, there is a certain formula for dosing for bodyweight, but I do not remember it) Yohimbine with either a caffeine pill (try 100mg first, titrate to 200mg if possible) or black coffee while fasted. Within ~20 minutes or so you will feel a hypo like effect and feel stimulated. Bust out minimum 30 minutes of LISS cardio and try and stay fasted for the next ~2-4 hours, depending on tolerance and schedule.

If you have any adverse effects to it, drink a gatorade or any carbs and it will quickly cease all side effects.

 

[DecaForDessert]

I’m thinking of you’re doing fasted cardio with it you’d be burning through blood sugar faster which could be on the higher side if you’re late into a bulk Pushing 600g+ carbs with hgh (and not using insulin). If your blood sugar is under control your pancreas won’t need to produce as much insulin, which could lead to better insulin sensitivity and reduced insulin resistance over time—compared to your blood sugar being high and your pancreas constantly having to pump out insulin(which would increase insulin resistance)

That’s the theory anyways. I haven’t tried yohimbine yet but I just ordered some and will be incorporating it fasted and doing some frequent blood sugar checks so I’ll probably have better data within a few weeks

This is interesting. Would be difficult to differentiate the positive effects of fasted cardio to the yohimbine, but your theory does make sense. Thanks for throwing that out there, it could be a cool secondary benefit.

 

[Sectør]

Are you trying to ensure that you are indeed "fasted" with the blood sugar readings?

L-carnitine can be taken whenever you are eating a heavy carb meal, it does not do much good when there is no insulin present in the blood (insulin is what shuttles it into the muscles). Once an individual is saturated with L carnitine is when the body will start transporting fatty acids into the mitochondria to be used for energy, it will be a 24/7 mechanism of action if you stay saturated. You can also incorporate Lucine pre workout with carbs to trigger a higher insulin spike or take ~2iu insulin post L carnitine injection.

Take 5mg (try to work up to 25mg, there is a certain formula for dosing for bodyweight, but I do not remember it) Yohimbine with either a caffeine pill (try 100mg first, titrate to 200mg if possible) or black coffee while fasted. Within ~20 minutes or so you will feel a hypo like effect and feel stimulated. Bust out minimum 30 minutes of LISS cardio and try and stay fasted for the next ~2-4 hours, depending on tolerance and schedule.

If you have any adverse effects to it, drink a gatorade or any carbs and it will quickly cease all side effects.

I mean ideally I’d like to do a blood sugar check upon waking (fasted), A blood sugar check post cardio. Then periodically throughout the day to see how high it peaks after meals and to see how fast it comes back down. I think that’s why a CGM would probably be more ideal so I’m not having to stick myself 10x a day

I’ll probably leave the gh out of the fasted cardio initially since that’ll cause a blood sugar spike and skew results but I think once I get my readings down I’ll add the gh in just for the synergy in fat loss. Gh also triggers lipolysis and the mobilization and usage of FFA so I think the l carnitine will still be Beneficial, even in a truly fasted state (I agree it’s probably better with insulin for nutrient shuttling, but insulin also triggers lipogenesis and halts the fat burning to a degree), so for the purposes I’m using it for, it would be truly fasted cardio

Just thinking it could be a fun little experiment. I enjoy doing weird shit like this

 

[DecaForDessert]

I mean ideally I’d like to do a blood sugar check upon waking (fasted), A blood sugar check post cardio. Then periodically throughout the day to see how high it peaks after meals and to see how fast it comes back down. I think that’s why a CGM would probably be more ideal so I’m not having to stick myself 10x a day

I’ll probably leave the gh out of the fasted cardio initially since that’ll cause a blood sugar spike and skew results but I think once I get my readings down I’ll add the gh in just for the synergy in fat loss. Gh also triggers lipolysis and the mobilization and usage of FFA so I think the l carnitine will still be Beneficial, even in a truly fasted state (I agree it’s probably better with insulin for nutrient shuttling, but insulin also triggers lipogenesis and halts the fat burning to a degree), so for the purposes I’m using it for, it would be truly fasted cardio

Just thinking it could be a fun little experiment. I enjoy doing weird shit like this

Totally agree with the last line, it is interesting to run these experiments, otherwise it will always be speculation.

For the gh use, if you pin it before bed it should still be active when you wake up in the morning for your fasted cardio. Its pharmacokinetic profile shows that it peaks in your system ~4 hours after administration.

I have never understood the guys that utilize gh right before fasted cardio, it has incorrectly been given as advice on forums for years.

Don't eat 1-2 hours before bed, pin the gh before bed, do fasted cardio when you wake up.

 

[luki7788]

So had kind of an interesting idea about using yohimbine on a bulk. I keep fasted cardio in the mix year-round to keep blood pressure and heart rate down, and have always tolerated Yohimbine very well (20+ mg).

Since it is an alpha 2 receptor antagonist (which aids target fat loss in the stomach and lower back), would incorporating it on a bulk inhibit some portion of fat gain in those stubborn areas?

It would be awesome to be able to stay leaner in the midsection so I don't feel like a bloated walrus at the end of every bulk (I like to end them at around 16% bodyfat).

From my understanding, its main action is blocking these receptors, and secondarily, it promotes lipolysis. So if the receptors are being blocked, the body should be slightly deterred from depositing fat in these areas, no?

Gearing up to end a cut, then maintain, and then do a slow bulk (I am thinking .5 pounds a week on 250mg test), so I will be giving this a shot either way, but I thought it would be fun to see some discussion about it.

This whole concept of yours, paradoxically despite many people opposing it makes sense. I wouldn't recommend it to a competitor because such a person wants to maximize each stage of preparation, so we use those things that will help us achieve the best result in a given phase, but if you don't compete and just want to look good all year round and basically your "mass" periods are a small calorie surplus I think it can be quite helpful in your goal.

However, I would personally use cadarin instead of yohibin during the carolic plus - it would have more additional benefits in this period

 

[Sectør]

Totally agree with the last line, it is interesting to run these experiments, otherwise it will always be speculation.

For the gh use, if you pin it before bed it should still be active when you wake up in the morning for your fasted cardio. Its pharmacokinetic profile shows that it peaks in your system ~4 hours after administration.

I have never understood the guys that utilize gh right before fasted cardio, it has incorrectly been given as advice on forums for years.

Don't eat 1-2 hours before bed, pin the gh before bed, do fasted cardio when you wake up.

Depends how you administer it. Sc and IM have completely different profiles.

IM serum levels rise pretty rapidly within an hour