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what do you do when you don't want to dose any higher?

You can't keep growing forever! I think bulking "in the traditional sense" is the stupidest fucking thing EVER anyways so let me get that out of the way first.

When trying to gain size, going by the scale alone is a disaster waiting to happen, you must visually analyze what is going on with your body composition, it is also wise to track your fasted morning BG levels. When BG levels start getting high it's time to back off and reset! You can either go low carb higher fat for a while or simply do a bit of fasting. I like fasting better as not only does it increase insulin sensitivity but also gives your digestive system a much needed break, so when you go back to your higher calorie/carbohydrate diet you are partitioning a lot more toward muscle and less to adipose tissue.

Just my 2 cents. Once again choose the red pill or the blue (Morpheus)
sound advise. Appreciate it
 
You can't keep growing forever! I think bulking "in the traditional sense" is the stupidest fucking thing EVER anyways so let me get that out of the way first.

When trying to gain size, going by the scale alone is a disaster waiting to happen, you must visually analyze what is going on with your body composition, it is also wise to track your fasted morning BG levels. When BG levels start getting high it's time to back off and reset! You can either go low carb higher fat for a while or simply do a bit of fasting. I like fasting better as not only does it increase insulin sensitivity but also gives your digestive system a much needed break, so when you go back to your higher calorie/carbohydrate diet you are partitioning a lot more toward muscle and less to adipose tissue.

Just my 2 cents. Once again choose the red pill or the blue (Morpheus)

Good posts, this one in particular, your approach is similar to what I have always thought and I should track my morning blood glucose. Some questions for you, or anyone really

1. Does carb cycling, or fasting, really increase insulin sensitivity? I always thought it did, but on another board where the guys are pretty sharp, they told me that the only thing that actually affects insulin sensitivity is body fat levels. meaning if your eating 4k calories at 70% carbs, then switch to 30% carbs (increase fats to keep calories the same) this will not actually increase insulin sensitivity. Only a decrease in body fat changes insulin sensitivity. Any thoughts on this? I have always thought carb cycling could help but what do I know.

2. In order to control carb intake, how high in fats do you go before you think its too high? Right now I eat 4500 calories. yesterday was 302 protein, 569 carbs, 135 fat. Would it be wise to go higher in fat, 150, 160, 170? Is there an upper limit to where it is more likely to be stored as fat, or all the fat slows down digestion too much?

3. It seems like most here would like mini diets based on the posts. I'm a big fan of mini diets, seems like this is something that would help progress and keep insulin sensitivity in check. And we can probably be more aggressive in cutting calories on a short term diet than we would on a Long diet where muscle loss might be an issue.
 
The one thing I didn't see you mention was training. Add some weight to every lift. Stay there till you can get it for 12. Add some more weight.
 
I liked the provider black tops better than serostim. Serostim didn’t give me the full 3D look of the provider black tops. The black tops were my favorite. I haven’t used HGH in a long time though. It makes my blood pressure go up, and my bp is extremely high right now. I’m on several meds but it’s still terrible. I need to drop weight but I love being big and strong.
In the same boat, man. Love love love GH. My muscles respond so well to it. Unfortunately, heart issues prevent me from using it now.
 
transition off, plan my last week, then go down to trt doses.
 
periodic caloric restriction puts the body back into an anabolic-state. You can't perma-bulk, you just end up being a fat fuck. In my experience transitioning the focus between getting leaner and adding muscle is where the best changes occur. There may be a sweet-spot for younger guys working in the middle. But I always grew bigger after every prep.

Absolutely! I'm glad more people are realizing that 'bulk and cut' is such a silly concept. Guys rationalize eating until their blood pressure goes through the roof and they look like a water buffalo, then spend six months in a teeny, tiny deficit and say bye bye to any gains in the interim. Fuck that. Eat at a reasonable surplus while still staying on top of things, train your ass off and grow. Notice a little fat? Keep your protein intake up, take a couple weeks and drop into a mini cut. Cut back on volume a little. Doing this for a week or two (or four) should put you right where you want to be unless you're just a fat pig. Increase calories again and get right back to growing. With the improved insulin sensitivity, you're going to fuckin rock it in the gym. And guess what? You get to look good year round instead of having to to reach for those fat pants you keep in the back of the closet.
 
There is nothing to cheat yourself - on a certain dose of androgens you will reach a certain level of muscle mass that you will not skip or change in training or diet and you will simply have to increase the dose aas to further progression and become larger. Just like with calories, let's say you have 220 pounds for 5000 kcal so you probably have to reach 240 pounds to eat 5500 or 6000 kcal - no miracles are a simple rule
 
Absolutely! I'm glad more people are realizing that 'bulk and cut' is such a silly concept. Guys rationalize eating until their blood pressure goes through the roof and they look like a water buffalo, then spend six months in a teeny, tiny deficit and say bye bye to any gains in the interim. Fuck that. Eat at a reasonable surplus while still staying on top of things, train your ass off and grow. Notice a little fat? Keep your protein intake up, take a couple weeks and drop into a mini cut. Cut back on volume a little. Doing this for a week or two (or four) should put you right where you want to be unless you're just a fat pig. Increase calories again and get right back to growing. With the improved insulin sensitivity, you're going to fuckin rock it in the gym. And guess what? You get to look good year round instead of having to to reach for those fat pants you keep in the back of the closet.

Agreed.

Question, when you come off a mini cut, how do you go about increasing calories from there? Do you slowly build them up again or do you go right back to where you were before the mini cut?
 
This is my approach as well. During those mini cuts and low points, I drop the heaviest weights and use whatever feels comfortable, get a good pump, and get my workouts in fast. I find this has been the best way to put on lean muscle tissue.

I tried keeping the heavy training going during calorie deficits and low doses and find that I can still move the weight, but recovery is nowhere near where it needs to be to actually move the weight in a way that benefits me.


Absolutely! I'm glad more people are realizing that 'bulk and cut' is such a silly concept. Guys rationalize eating until their blood pressure goes through the roof and they look like a water buffalo, then spend six months in a teeny, tiny deficit and say bye bye to any gains in the interim. Fuck that. Eat at a reasonable surplus while still staying on top of things, train your ass off and grow. Notice a little fat? Keep your protein intake up, take a couple weeks and drop into a mini cut. Cut back on volume a little. Doing this for a week or two (or four) should put you right where you want to be unless you're just a fat pig. Increase calories again and get right back to growing. With the improved insulin sensitivity, you're going to fuckin rock it in the gym. And guess what? You get to look good year round instead of having to to reach for those fat pants you keep in the back of the closet.
 
Agreed.

Question, when you come off a mini cut, how do you go about increasing calories from there? Do you slowly build them up again or do you go right back to where you were before the mini cut?

I go straight back to the calories I was eating before. My body just eats it up and adjusts back quickly.
 
Training and eating are it.
If it were just a gear game, Pros would have to go higher and higher each cycle—well that seems partially true anyways haha.
I just mean that this is a Dante lesson. You can blast 1g of test, train 4 days a week and eat 5000 cals. That will work for awhile. THEN you will have to adjust those 3 variables accordingly. The average gym-bro wants to just up it to 1.5g and the smart guys will realize that fine-tuning their diet and training can still work well.

And not to derail the thread, but bulking and cutting DOES work for the majority of competitive bodybuilders. Saying anything different is ignorant. The guys who do the "eh, just small surplus/deficit" usually aren't competitors or they have silly genetics.
Yeah, if you're a gym rat and want to look good in the summer hell yeah that works. If you're goal is to throw 10lbs onto your stage weight? Nah, gonna have to bulk dude.
 
There is nothing to cheat yourself - on a certain dose of androgens you will reach a certain level of muscle mass that you will not skip or change in training or diet and you will simply have to increase the dose aas to further progression and become larger. Just like with calories, let's say you have 220 pounds for 5000 kcal so you probably have to reach 240 pounds to eat 5500 or 6000 kcal - no miracles are a simple rule

This is really all that needs to be said about this matter imo.
 

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