What is built on higher doses is maintained on lower doses

ionian · Feb 15, 2015

To the experienced users out there, do you think that muscle that is built on higher doses can be maintained on lower doses? I know an old guy who used to juice quite heavily, but took something like 20 years off from lifting. Recently got into lifting again, and he's blown up on a low dose of test (something like 400mg a week). Would AAS muscle memory play a part here?

Shelby · Feb 15, 2015

ionian said:
To the experienced users out there, do you think that muscle that is built on higher doses can be maintained on lower doses? I know an old guy who used to juice quite heavily, but took something like 20 years off from lifting. Recently got into lifting again, and he's blown up on a low dose of test (something like 400mg a week). Would AAS muscle memory play a part here?

Yep

Serotonin · Feb 15, 2015

Lots of variables but I would say generally yes as far as size maintenance. You can maintain a lot of your size on a low to moderate dose of gear + GH. You will however lose conditioning. You'll look softer and sometimes hold more fat as well.

Strength maintenance is a lot different. Maintaining strength is much more difficult imo.

And no way you can maintain all of it. Strength or size. Especially if you are advanced.

It basically depends on how big or strong you wanna get. If you wanna get to the top, then no way you can maintian everything. If you wanna get to mid level potential then you can maintain a lot more, but still not everything.

Knight9 · Feb 15, 2015

ionian said:
To the experienced users out there, do you think that muscle that is built on higher doses can be maintained on lower doses? I know an old guy who used to juice quite heavily, but took something like 20 years off from lifting. Recently got into lifting again, and he's blown up on a low dose of test (something like 400mg a week). Would AAS muscle memory play a part here?

100% True. This is what so many are failing to realize...that you don't need to blast year round to keep the size. I do think more people are realizing this in the last 3 or so yrs than prior to that.

It's so hard to put a number on it...because it really depends on how much mass you are holding and your "newest" achieved "set points". I feel confident in saying that you can hold 90+ % of your mass with low doses and cruising once you have built it. This is assuming your training and nutrition is up to par.

b-boy · Feb 15, 2015

hmmm one of the first things I learned on this board from phil hernon was "you only as big as the dose your on" we are talking total amount of lean muscle tissue here.

Flex500 · Feb 15, 2015

b-boy said:
hmmm one of the first things I learned on this board from phil hernon was "you only as big as the dose your on" we are talking total amount of lean muscle tissue here.

Phil Hernon also tells everyone with a cough they are dying and need dialysis. All kidding aside I think for years someone else was using his screen name. Some of the things he said were outrageous.

That statement does have some merit though. It also depends what "low dose means" that used to mean 200mgs of test and 2-4 it's gh. Now people brag how they maintain on a low dowse of 250mgs tren and 250 test. Comparatively I guess that is a low dose but you can keep a hell of a physique that way.

Knowing ehat pj was on during his transformation people would shit their pants. He is national level stage ready shape just a tad smaller than he was when he competed on doses that an aggressive hormone doc would prescribe.

If you really diet hard and train hard it really amazing what a little drugs can do.

I also am close with a national level competitor utilizing mradows right now. He looks great over 240 pounds in his offseason taking 200mgs tren ace and 300 test a week. No gh just peptides.

Drugs work but the morale is a little bit of drugs can do a whole lot.

nothuman · Feb 15, 2015

I think for the recreational non-competitive bodybuilder, going on ONE HUGEEEE blast to gain all the size you want is the best way to go. Then you only have to use small doses every now and then to maintain it.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...tance-go-all-out-take-slow-2.html#post1576673

Knight9 · Feb 15, 2015

nothuman said:
I think for the recreational non-competitive bodybuilder, going on ONE HUGEEEE blast to gain all the size you want is the best way to go. Then you only have to use small doses every now and then to maintain it.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...tance-go-all-out-take-slow-2.html#post1576673

It takes a lot longer/more than one huge blast to accumulate what many want..in terms of tissue.

Kaladryn · Feb 15, 2015

b-boy said:
hmmm one of the first things I learned on this board from phil hernon was "you only as big as the dose your on" we are talking total amount of lean muscle tissue here.

When I read the original post, my first thought of a response was, "yes, but still you are only as big as your dose."

What bboy said was absolutely true. It is also true that you can grow much faster on lower amounts when muscle memory is involved, but your plateaus will remain unchanged. Ultimately, you are still only as big as your dose. For some reason this truth is hard for people to accept, it was for me.

bbg420 · Feb 15, 2015

Flex500 said:
Phil Hernon also tells everyone with a cough they are dying and need dialysis. All kidding aside I think for years someone else was using his screen name. Some of the things he said were outrageous.

That statement does have some merit though. It also depends what "low dose means" that used to mean 200mgs of test and 2-4 it's gh. Now people brag how they maintain on a low dowse of 250mgs tren and 250 test. Comparatively I guess that is a low dose but you can keep a hell of a physique that way.

Knowing ehat pj was on during his transformation people would shit their pants. He is national level stage ready shape just a tad smaller than he was when he competed on doses that an aggressive hormone doc would prescribe.

If you really diet hard and train hard it really amazing what a little drugs can do.

I also am close with a national level competitor utilizing mradows right now. He looks great over 240 pounds in his offseason taking 200mgs tren ace and 300 test a week. No gh just peptides.

Drugs work but the morale is a little bit of drugs can do a whole lot.

right, what is considered low dose ,i doubt you could do it with say 250mg test weekly on cruise, i see alot of guys throwing tren in on there cruises, i dont have the balls for that, yet

TrinityD · Feb 15, 2015

The answer to the title of the thread is: Yes
shelby said it

Damios · Feb 15, 2015

nothuman said:
I think for the recreational non-competitive bodybuilder, going on ONE HUGEEEE blast to gain all the size you want is the best way to go. Then you only have to use small doses every now and then to maintain it.

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/f...tance-go-all-out-take-slow-2.html#post1576673

What do You mean by "ONE HUGE BLAST"? 1 year, 5 years, 15 years blast without cruise or what?

Knight9 · Feb 15, 2015

Damios said:
What do You mean by "ONE HUGE BLAST"? 1 year, 5 years, 15 years blast without cruise or what?

It's a fantasy. Disregard it.

nothuman · Feb 15, 2015

Damios said:
What do You mean by "ONE HUGE BLAST"? 1 year, 5 years, 15 years blast without cruise or what?

Read the link

nothuman · Feb 15, 2015

Knight9 said:
It's a fantasy. Disregard it.

Whatever dude. It's obviously not for competitors.

Dezzy · Feb 15, 2015

I don't see how 300mg of AAS isn't enough to make gains if diet and training are on point. Now I don't think you can get to pro bodybuilder size and maintain that muscle on small doses. But to get a nice physique that is better then 90% of the population and maintain and gain muscle...yes. But to get huge and maintain 50-60lbs of lean mass...Naw gotta keep pushing the doses.

Flexpack215 · Feb 17, 2015

It is and your exactly right. 300 would be a good maintaining dose and help with lean muscle growth provided your nutrition is right

You have what it takes, but it will take all you got.

Cerberus777 · Feb 17, 2015

When I read someone got back to their original size on 500mg when they built it on 2000gr. I think that they didn't max out what 500mg could do.

If someone takes it down they may be able to hold more mass. But if you topped out 1500mg you're not going to keep it all at 300mg

nothuman · Feb 18, 2015

Cerberus777 said:
When I read someone got back to their original size on 500mg when they built it on 2000gr. I think that they didn't max out what 500mg could do.

If someone takes it down they may be able to hold more mass. But if you topped out 1500mg you're not going to keep it all at 300mg

True, but why not "sprint" to the desired goal on higher doses and then maintain on lower doses every so often? Why do we need to spend years building muscle when we can do it much faster, and then drop the doses?

I like to think outside the box

Vanilla Mandingo · Feb 18, 2015

Knight9 said:
100% True. This is what so many are failing to realize...that you don't need to blast year round to keep the size. I do think more people are realizing this in the last 3 or so yrs than prior to that.

It's so hard to put a number on it...because it really depends on how much mass you are holding and your "newest" achieved "set points". I feel confident in saying that you can hold 90+ % of your mass with low doses and cruising once you have built it. This is assuming your training and nutrition is up to par.

This is something that I would like to see discussed more with actual facts and numbers from people who are doing it.