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What would you add to my summer cut cycle?

qbkilla

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Will be running the following:

Test E 500/wk 1-20
Primo E 400/wk 1-20
GH 4ius/ed
IGF-1 lr3 2x4 week cycles at 50mcg ed one in August one in Sept/Oct.

Debating adding:
winstrol 50mg ed for six weeks
anavar 50mg ed for 10 weeks
or cut mix Tren A/Test A/ DrostP 50mg each eod for 6 weeks
or TrenA/TestA 50mg each eod x 6 wks
or a combination of the above but not at the same time for example Winstrol wks 2-8 + Cut Mix wks 10-16, etc.

What do you recommend?

Currently 220lbs BF11% been cycling for 30 years, blood work done 2 wks ago, lipids & everything are good to go.
Goal is to look ripped and full for the next 20 wks until the end of October.
I was always under the impression that increlex was the only real igf available, is the stuff peptide companies sell real igf? Maybe I'm out of the loop?
 

OuchThatHurts

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I was always under the impression that increlex was the only real igf available, is the stuff peptide companies sell real igf? Maybe I'm out of the loop?
Not outside any loop. Just need to go to the FDA site and look it up. In this case, Tercica, Inc manufacturers rhIGF-1 (recombinant human Insulin-like Growth Factor 1) under the brand name Increlex and has FDA approval to manufacture rhIGF-1 of rDNA origin. Not all that different from recombinant forms of insulin and rhGH.

But the two forms of IGF we commonly see are Long aRginine 3-IGF-1 (also referred to as LR3-IGF-1) and has an arginine at the 3rd position and an additional 13 aminos at the N terminus to increase it's half-life while IGF-1 DES is a fraction of IGF missing proteins 1-3 which allegedly increases its potency. Both LR3IGF-1 and IGF-1 DES are for research purposes only and not FDA approved (last time I checked).

They may be approved for use in other countries.

Anecdote: I've tried all three and Increlex is very expensive but very short-lived (1-2 hours) while LR3IGF-1 lasts for 6-12 hours and is very potent. IGF-1 DES did not appear to have the purported 10x potency and was short-lived similar to Increlex. LR3 lights me up for hours while DES is more 1-2 hours. You have to eat a lot. Hypoglycemia is very real and I don't combine with insulin, MET or BRB (any GDA's). Bad policy.
 

qbkilla

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Not outside any loop. Just need to go to the FDA site and look it up. In this case, Tercica, Inc manufacturers rhIGF-1 (recombinant human Insulin-like Growth Factor 1) under the brand name Increlex and has FDA approval to manufacture rhIGF-1 of rDNA origin. Not all that different from recombinant forms of insulin and rhGH.

But the two forms of IGF we commonly see are Long aRginine 3-IGF-1 (also referred to as LR3-IGF-1) and has an arginine at the 3rd position and an additional 13 aminos at the N terminus to increase it's half-life while IGF-1 DES is a fraction of IGF missing proteins 1-3 which allegedly increases its potency. Both LR3IGF-1 and IGF-1 DES are for research purposes only and not FDA approved (last time I checked).

They may be approved for use in other countries.

Anecdote: I've tried all three and Increlex is very expensive but very short-lived (1-2 hours) while LR3IGF-1 lasts for 6-12 hours and is very potent. IGF-1 DES did not appear to have the purported 10x potency and was short-lived similar to Increlex. LR3 lights me up for hours while DES is more 1-2 hours. You have to eat a lot. Hypoglycemia is very real and I don't combine with insulin, MET or BRB (any GDA's). Bad policy.
Thank you for the info. I remember about 2003 (if I'm right) companies started coming out with igf products it was the next big thing. I bought a few vials didn't see much then the board consensus seemed like it was bunk, snake oil, innefective, it never cought on. I'd see random posts on forums about it but typically it's just aas, gh, slin. Then you have a certain group on the forums who are into taking every peptide ( datbtrue followers) but I didn't think most people bothered with them or igf over the years.
 

OuchThatHurts

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Thank you for the info. I remember about 2003 (if I'm right) companies started coming out with igf products it was the next big thing. I bought a few vials didn't see much then the board consensus seemed like it was bunk, snake oil, innefective, it never cought on. I'd see random posts on forums about it but typically it's just aas, gh, slin. Then you have a certain group on the forums who are into taking every peptide ( datbtrue followers) but I didn't think most people bothered with them or igf over the years.
Real LR3IGF-1 I love. But where I get it, it's $200/1mg. It's awesome post-workout. Morning workouts. I'm lit up all day. The caloric uptake is huge. But I don't use it when cutting. It's a major growth factor. Maybe the most potent of all.
 

warlock

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Metformin is cheap and will help with leaning out as well as with health/longevity.

If you tolerate low doses of DNP well then I would stay on a low dose of DNP until a week before the first event in October, to let the water/bloat subside. Then stick with your low calorie diet throughout the 4 events, and maybe use some mild diuretics before each event to dry out and offset any weight gain you may have experienced from the previous events.

Once you've been cycling for a while packing on extra size takes a long time. Most of us are near our genetic limit/set point and find it very difficult to add a couple pounds a year, even with high doses. If you've been on cycle for a while it's unlikely you'll be able to make drastic size gains at this point. But you can make some awesome improvements in conditioning being at 14% now and having 4 months to diet down from there.

Just my two cents.

Do you mean low dose DNP from now until a week before the event in October?
 

Gunsmith

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You could probably just cut your fat back to 60-70g and carbs back to 250g in training days , none on off days and make some pretty drastic changes pretty fast.
 

Nike22

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You could probably just cut your fat back to 60-70g and carbs back to 250g in training days , none on off days and make some pretty drastic changes pretty fast.
Dude, it's funny you mention that. I ate exactly 248g of carbs today and cut my fat to keep total cals at 3000.

I think after all the great feedback I've gotten so far I'm going to focus on diet, keep the high volume training and cardio where it is. Slowly dial the calories back by cutting carbs and fat.

As for AAS I'm going to prob run med-low dose Tren E for the last 12 wks of the cycle and do short 2-3 week blasts of oral winstrol before the events where I want to look my best.

Thanks for all the great advice! I'll keep you posted on how it goes. (y)
 

11sh11

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diet is the last thing I really have to dial in.
Diet should be the first thing. Build the foundation. Healthy gut, liver, and kidneys... then the supplements. I'm attaching a pic of my nutrition client. The only gear he uses is some test for TRT. I program his nutrition and training...
 

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warlock

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Diet should be the first thing. Build the foundation. Healthy gut, liver, and kidneys... then the supplements. I'm attaching a pic of my nutrition client. The only gear he uses is some test for TRT. I program his nutrition and training...
He looks great. No GH? What's his TRT dose?

Great work!
 

11sh11

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He looks great. No GH? What's his TRT dose?

Great work!
Thank you! He does Test E , at 250mg/ml. 1 shot a week, at 1.5ml. Keeps his test levels in his bw around 700. No GH... I have him on some herbal supplements, and his nutritional program. Hes 100% with nutrition and training. 5'11" 183#, 38yo
 

beastmode121

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Don’t add anything.

it’s not about the gear you run; it’s only going to maintain your muscle mass while you shed the fat..

If you even know how to diet ?
 

qbkilla

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Dude, it's funny you mention that. I ate exactly 248g of carbs today and cut my fat to keep total cals at 3000.

I think after all the great feedback I've gotten so far I'm going to focus on diet, keep the high volume training and cardio where it is. Slowly dial the calories back by cutting carbs and fat.

As for AAS I'm going to prob run med-low dose Tren E for the last 12 wks of the cycle and do short 2-3 week blasts of oral winstrol before the events where I want to look my best.

Thanks for all the great advice! I'll keep you posted on how it goes. (y)
High volume is one way, me when I cut calories I usually use a low volume high intensity routine. Less sets so you can focus on each one and make sure strength stays the same. You also spend less time in the gym so can do more cardio if needed. Not sure what is best on a cut but a vet on another board would do this so I copied it, makes sense on paper. Less food means less ability to recover from high volume
 

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