What's a high dose these days?

[pickapeck]

A lot of people were taken aback when Dallas autopsy found testosterone consnetration of 50000 ng/dL plus some amout of trenbolone. on average 100 mg a week gives 700 ng/dL. So that would be 7 g of test a week plus some tren. So if pros are taking that and 16 iu GH a week then that is probably the standard for a lot of gear these days. At least for Dallas, that led to his organs growing to 2-3 times normal size and eventual heart attack.

 

[MAGAoperator]

A lot of people were taken aback when Dallas autopsy found testosterone consnetration of 50000 ng/dL plus some amout of trenbolone. on average 100 mg a week gives 700 ng/dL. So that would be 7 g of test a week plus some tren. So if pros are taking that and 16 iu GH a week then that is probably the standard for a lot of gear these days. At least for Dallas, that led to his organs growing to 2-3 times normal size and eventual heart attack.

just that amount of oil a week is insane

 

[get it in ya]

A lot of people were taken aback when Dallas autopsy found testosterone consnetration of 50000 ng/dL plus some amout of trenbolone. on average 100 mg a week gives 700 ng/dL. So that would be 7 g of test a week plus some tren. So if pros are taking that and 16 iu GH a week then that is probably the standard for a lot of gear these days. At least for Dallas, that led to his organs growing to 2-3 times normal size and eventual heart attack.

Most pro’s don’t go over 1g of test bro, genetics are great

 

[RamboStallone]

Most pro’s don’t go over 1g of test bro, genetics are great

1g test is the minimum.

 

[little slice]

A lot of people were taken aback when Dallas autopsy found testosterone consnetration of 50000 ng/dL plus some amout of trenbolone. on average 100 mg a week gives 700 ng/dL. So that would be 7 g of test a week plus some tren. So if pros are taking that and 16 iu GH a week then that is probably the standard for a lot of gear these days. At least for Dallas, that led to his organs growing to 2-3 times normal size and eventual heart attack.

it doesnt work quite like that..


but the end message is essentially the same.

 

[pickapeck]

it doesnt work quite like that..


but the end message is essentially the same.

Are you saying the fit is more polynomial than linear? Explain your meaning. MAybe you are an expert in phamacokinetics? Mine was an estimate based on linear relationship and zero order kinetics.

 

[bg091593]

Are you saying the fit is more polynomial than linear? Explain your meaning. MAybe you are an expert in phamacokinetics? Mine was an estimate based on linear relationship and zero order kinetics.

The relationship is never linear with bodybuilding drugs and dosing. Wish it was though...

 

[Elvia1023]

Are you saying the fit is more polynomial than linear? Explain your meaning. MAybe you are an expert in phamacokinetics? Mine was an estimate based on linear relationship and zero order kinetics.

He is actually correct going on what text he bolded. We can estimate at times but it doesn't always work like that. Meaning it's wrong to think if 100mg scores x amount then 5g must score y amount. Some guys can get high/low amounts on the same amount of test. There are also many variables and who knows what else he was running. Although I am not stating Dallas was not on a lot... far from it. He was probably site injecting huge amounts of test all over to get that level. I am sure your guess is in the ball park and he was probably doing 1g+ per day. But it would not be impossible for a guy to be on say 3g and score what Dallas did.

 

[Swiper]

Are you saying the fit is more polynomial than linear? Explain your meaning. MAybe you are an expert in phamacokinetics? Mine was an estimate based on linear relationship and zero order kinetics.

androgen receptor‘s play a huge role here. the more and longer you’re on the more they can hold and/or more are created. so you could be on 1g a week for many years and your levels could be at 20,000 mike arnold can explain it better, but it’s something like that.

I don’t think Dallas was on 7g week, probably more like 3g a week of test.

 

[Kaladryn]

Does it really matter what the people at the edges of the bell curve are doing in these conversations? I mean there had to be at least one guy in the world who didn't give a fuck and did 3g back in the 70s, probably more.

The more interesting question is, what are the people with great genetics, good longevity in the sport, and a measurable degree of physique quality, doing on average, excluding the extremes?

My best guess, for people doing it right with decent to great genetics, I think this is a realistic HIGH dose for people doing it right:

Probably about 1g total different kinds of ASS/week for lower level amateur.

About 2g for national level amateur levels.

Around 3g total for pros.

GH usage jumps significantly at the pro level too.

I know a lot of people think it's way higher, but I believe that is a small percentage, there is also a small percentage that uses way less than the above amounts.

 

[SWOLNUTZ]

Does it really matter what the people at the edges of the bell curve are doing in these conversations? I mean there had to be at least one guy in the world who didn't give a fuck and did 3g back in the 70s, probably more.

The more interesting question is, what are the people with great genetics, good longevity in the sport, and a measurable degree of physique quality, doing on average, excluding the extremes?

My best guess, for people doing it right with decent to great genetics, I think this is a realistic HIGH dose for people doing it right:

Probably about 1g total different kinds of ASS/week for lower level amateur.

About 2g for national level amateur levels.

Around 3g total for pros.

GH usage jumps significantly at the pro level too.

I know a lot of people think it's way higher, but I believe that is a small percentage, there is also a small percentage that uses way less than the above amounts.

Well said!

 

[LK3]

while im all for being a drug monkey n what not

unless you are just trying to through your money into an essentially dumb idea why not just listen to the 98% of ppl hear who have played drug monkey and report back that it really isnt all that worth it. lol

in the end, save your money, save your body, save your health and get by on what you can and play in relatively "normal" ranges?

blasting g's worth of gear really isnt all that cool.

sorry to say. lol

 

[Swifto]

Does it really matter what the people at the edges of the bell curve are doing in these conversations? I mean there had to be at least one guy in the world who didn't give a fuck and did 3g back in the 70s, probably more.

The more interesting question is, what are the people with great genetics, good longevity in the sport, and a measurable degree of physique quality, doing on average, excluding the extremes?

My best guess, for people doing it right with decent to great genetics, I think this is a realistic HIGH dose for people doing it right:

Probably about 1g total different kinds of ASS/week for lower level amateur.

About 2g for national level amateur levels.

Around 3g total for pros.

GH usage jumps significantly at the pro level too.

I know a lot of people think it's way higher, but I believe that is a small percentage, there is also a small percentage that uses way less than the above amounts.

Is this during contest prep or offseason?

 

[snowpatrol]

Is this during contest prep or offseason?

Maybe I'm doing it wrong, and that's why I'm not a pro,,,but historically I've used less in the offseason than in the last 4-6 weeks of prep and even that isn't much more than 1g/wk

Maybe that has to change because two nationals later I've confirmed that I *still* need more size, well I knew after the first but took a run at it again for good measure

 

[jeroendebleser]

Back then you could do a cycle without test in and no one would lose their shit. These days if you say "deca only" or "deca +dbol +anavar" someone is going to say, "Bro, you gotta add some test in there"

Also, "Blast and Cruise" I never even heard of until about 5 years ago. I like the idea of cruise, but blast?

True dat, test is not necessary at all but it's been hyped up a lot in the past 10 years or so. I know 2 'old-timers' (old geezers who used during the 70's) and they never used testosterone and coincidence or not, these guys seem to have less health issues than the current crop of bodybuilders. (yet the 'you need to add testosterone for normal functioning' mantra is rampant and who knows, couldn't be less true in the end lol)

Also, when comparing dosages, you need to compare apples with apples and not with oranges because as said before:

1) I can only assume a lot of the gear going around is underdosed or complete bunk based on what I hear and see (People using quite a lot and not even looking like they train, how do you do this with REAL gear? Even if you don't train and eat a non-bb diet, on real gear you would see results, period.)

2) Comparing dosages across individuals is not a useful practice. You have people like my brother who blows up on the same dosages I get little effect from. Same gear, same training, same diet, same genetics, yet the difference in response is staggering.

Some people simply respond well to xxx(x) mg's, some people just don't and they need more of the chemical to get the same response. That's just how it is. It's the same for all kinds of prescription meds so why do people keep comparing apples to oranges I don't know.

 

[jeroendebleser]

Well it only stands to reason that we're now more educated as a whole due to the ease at which information passes compared to 20 years ago. Back then there wasn't as many resources for this sort of thing. Running Nandrolone without testosterone is provably idiotic behavior.

I do agree with your other point though. In the earlier 2000's I was too young to be running anything but old enough to start reading. People who ran 750mg worth of those Sustanon redi-jects along with D-bol on top of it were considered live wires.

Why?

 

[little slice]

Why?

Numerous studies have shown that DHT is the active androgen involved in maintenance of nitric oxide-mediated penile erections.

 

[jeroendebleser]

It was Ciba and they were 5 mg tablets. Blue in color. Good stuff. 25 mg /day was as high as we would go. Pyramid up to that too.

The good old days when pyramiding up dbol and when 25 mg of it was considered a high dosage :headbang:

Nowadays it's 40-50 mg MIN all while dbol is more than strong enough to elicit a response at even 1 5 mg tab.

Can you imagine the responses you would get when you post up your cycle plan with 5 mg dbol? 'You don't know what you're doing and have no business using gear!!!!' lol

 

[jeroendebleser]

Numerous studies have shown that DHT is the active androgen involved in maintenance of nitric oxide-mediated penile erections.

Dbol converts to DHT as well. Just to be clear, my why pertained to using testosterone with nandrolone. Not to a nandrolone-only cycle. The point being that the old dbol + deca stack was just fine and that there is no need to add testosterone to that stack.

 

[jeroendebleser]

Since I started using aas I have come across so many people who use high doses. Some look amazing and others look crap. Plus the gear is crap these days argument is not true. There are loads of good sources. Go check out the anasci forum who are testing random products from sources on here. Yes there is loads of crap but there is also loads of good stuff. We just had Jano test most of our oils and everything came back great. That includes 95% primo and 104% tren a. We are not the only source putting out good stuff either as there are many of them.

I have taken 40mg dbol back in the day and blew up and my mate would use 200mg of the same dbol and be fine (blew up but the amount was not needed). I know someone who used 10 grams of test. Another who used some much stuff he wouldn't even be able to tell you how much. He would inject 9ml (3ml x 3) whenever he felt like it which was a lot. Some guys don't respond like others either... some are almost non responders to some drugs.

Guys act like people can't take those doses but some can. High doses do work but they are also not magical. If you have a guy eating poorly with subpar genetics he won't look much different from 1g to 5g's. Sometimes people look even better at lower doses as it's less stress and they feel better (train and eat better etc).

I have posted this so many times on here but everyone blew up when they first starting using dbol, adrol, test etc. Plus our perceptions change and if we were to look back at what we looked like when we thought we "blew up" we would probably laugh... I know as I did it with myself. When you use dbol for the 20th time it doesn't have the same effect especially if you weigh 50 pounds more. What I am trying to say is the gear didn't suddenly just stop working or become impossible to find. Yes it was all pharm grade years ago but you can still get great gear.

Allround great post bro and I don't often find posts great but that's probably because I've always been a rather arrogant cunt