When people say strength doesnt matter?

[Darb77]

I have heard alot of people, pros also, say that strength doesnt matter and its all about form. I just dont see how you can make a muscle alot bigger without increasing the weight you use to work the muscle. I have just heard it ALOT that strength doesnt matter and that bodybuilding is not about strength, that is what powerlifting is for!

If I am not getting stronger by increasing the weight or reps on exercises I feel like I am repeating the same work out over and over. Am I wrong to think this way?

Just curious what others think about the subject.

 

[nickman1978]

You would be repeating the same workout over & over. You should almost always go up in either strength or reps. "just a little at a time" at least ...

 

[Ness]

Strength increase is a sign of progression and therefor a sign of increased LBM. I think it does matter. However, a complete bodybuilder is a lean bodybuilder and its easy to get stronger as you get fatter (leverage) which is not muscle gain. Getting leaner can lead to strength loss so you have to adjust per goals.

 

[Tom]

hard to say. i've seen guys that can bench 350 lbs and don't look like they could. and i've seen guys that can barely get 225 for 10 yet they carry a lot of hard muscle on thier frame.

 

[richiec]

I have heard alot of people, pros also, say that strength doesnt matter and its all about form. I just dont see how you can make a muscle alot bigger without increasing the weight you use to work the muscle. I have just heard it ALOT that strength doesnt matter and that bodybuilding is not about strength, that is what powerlifting is for!

If I am not getting stronger by increasing the weight or reps on exercises I feel like I am repeating the same work out over and over. Am I wrong to think this way?

Just curious what others think about the subject.

I've never heard this before. I have heard the importance of form, but also the importance of heavy weight

 

[sinfulimages]

Good form is important but if you dont lift heavy and tax the muscles they wont grow. Period.

 

[Johnny Smiles]

CORRECT

hard to say. i've seen guys that can bench 350 lbs and don't look like they could. and i've seen guys that can barely get 225 for 10 yet they carry a lot of hard muscle on thier frame.

i am much bigger than the weight i lift
don't look too strong but i got some size to me...
i am not sure strength ALWAYS has to go up. intensity MUST tho.

Ness, remember when we switched to that 2 day split? i wasn't using very heavy weight and was worried i was losing strength then when i went back to my 3 day split i was actually stronger
its all a bit relative i suppose....
-JS

 

[tkav1980]

Strength is a relative term. one thing that is a measureable constant is progression. a 5 lb increase in weight lifted is always a 5 lb increase. This is whats important. your ability to move more weight in essence defines the measure of progress. this constant progress is what has been shown to yield the greates results. whille form is important, work ( weight over distance), is where you get the results.

 

[muscle_n_blood]

I can get stronger without getting bigger. I cannot get bigger without getting stronger. If you do not gradually increase your training poundages (strength), eventually you are doing endurance training rather than hypertrophy/size training, no matter how intense you make it.

 

[Ness]

Ness, remember when we switched to that 2 day split? i wasn't using very heavy weight and was worried i was losing strength then when i went back to my 3 day split i was actually stronger
its all a bit relative i suppose....
-JS

Yeah, that workout was brutal! I went from 30 minute sessions to 2 hour sessions. When I did get back to the 3 day split I had a few weeks to adjust and then the strength skyrocketed.

 

[e6er]

Been using the same weight for the last 3 years, I still grow.

 

[Tom]

I can get stronger without getting bigger. I cannot get bigger without getting stronger. If you do not gradually increase your training poundages (strength), eventually you are doing endurance training rather than hypertrophy/size training, no matter how intense you make it.

that just doesen't apply to everone. i can do a very heavy (for me) set of 8 on the leg press but when i train light weight for 5 sets of 30 my legs grow quite well and are bigger than when i go heavier for low reps......but that's me.

 

[jalsmiley]

I have heard alot of people, pros also, say that strength doesnt matter and its all about form. I just dont see how you can make a muscle alot bigger without increasing the weight you use to work the muscle. I have just heard it ALOT that strength doesnt matter and that bodybuilding is not about strength, that is what powerlifting is for!

If I am not getting stronger by increasing the weight or reps on exercises I feel like I am repeating the same work out over and over. Am I wrong to think this way?

Just curious what others think about the subject.

i think you are taking the saying a little too literal....they dont mean strength doesnt matter 100percent..just that focus should be on form and feeling the weight not doing whatever you can to move more and more weight to the degree that you are sacrificing form and risk of injury etc...focusing on form and feeling a pump/burn and getting a real good workout

 

[buselmo]

the way i see it is you can force yourself to get bigger, and then strength will come...
forcing yourself to get stronger will only cause injury and won't result in muscle gain...

something like this... your heaviest set of incline presses last week was 315 x 6 and you hit failure at 6 reps... and your goal is 6 reps
this week, you still have the same goal of 6 reps with 315 lbs, but you didn't go to failure... next week, you can probably get 325 lbs or 335 lbs for 6 reps and you hit failure at 6 reps..

what i see a lot of people doing is failing at 6 reps... then they want to force themselves to get 6 reps with heavier weights the next week... this is probably very counter productive.

also... although i've preached staying on the same training protocol that "worked" and just increase cals-weights-dose and you will most likely find gains... i have changed this way of thought after reading some posts here about periodizing your training... always been a low volume guy... switched to high volume for 2 weeks now and i can handle the same weights and reps i could before without failing... same diet, less dose, and i've gained some noticable muscle mass...

I guess periodization is a missing key in gains of lbm... not forcing strength or cals or whatever...

but don't listen to me... i'm just a 'tard

 

[laduem88]

with a exercise like bench, your either built for it or not...my bench has always sucked, i have people thinking i could rep the hell out of 315 possibly hit 405 when really id be lucky to even max at 295. it sucks but hey id rather look like i could bench 405 then not look like it at all and be able to. just depends on what your goals are

 

[Johnny Smiles]

with a exercise like bench, your either built for it or not...my bench has always sucked, i have people thinking i could rep the hell out of 315 possibly hit 405 when really id be lucky to even max at 295. it sucks but hey id rather look like i could bench 405 then not look like it at all and be able to. just depends on what your goals are

touche
-JS

 

[Darb77]

great responses! I just wanted to start an interesting topic for discussion. I totally agree that in order to get bigger muscles you have to increase your training poundages for the most part.

But what if say for instance you are use to doing legs in the 8-10 rep range and you lower your weights and perform your reps in the 20-25 rep range. WIll you grow from this? I was forced to start doing higher reps for legs after a torn patellar tendon and have had awesome results doing 20 reps!


I think the mind muscle connection is very important as well. I can pick up say the 110s and do 10 very good reps on db bench, without thinking much about it or I can pick up the 90s and do 10 perfect reps with a slow constant tension motion really squeezing and really put my mind and muscle into it. Which is better for growing muscle purposes?

 

[FRKNHUGE]

i hate when people say ur built for it or your not, im 6'6.5 do u think i was builtfor benching, nope, but through time and dedication i was at one time i the mid 7's.
now to the thread topic, as a reforming PL'r i now realize all out weight isnt important, its the form/ time under tension of the muscle being worked, now mind you weight is a factor, but not the end all, if it were every PL'r who benched huge weights, pulled huge and squatted huge would have fully developed bodies, right? nope
frk

 

[laduem88]

i hate when people say ur built for it or your not, im 6'6.5 do u think i was builtfor benching, nope, but through time and dedication i was at one time i the mid 7's.
now to the thread topic, as a reforming PL'r i now realize all out weight isnt important, its the form/ time under tension of the muscle being worked, now mind you weight is a factor, but not the end all, if it were every PL'r who benched huge weights, pulled huge and squatted huge would have fully developed bodies, right? nope
frk

thats true as well, i always flare my elbows out which works the chest more but you loose out on so much power..i still think some people just wernt built for it though

 

[gettnlarge01]

Getting stronger is part of the process but its only one part of it.
Use the same weight for the same reps for the next year or two and see how much progress is made.