Why you should NOT take estrogens (exogenous E2 ≠ T's aromatic product)

[Type-IIx]

I agree
I’m trying to hope I did that’s all. Cause if it’s not a crushed e2 issue than I permantley have ED.

I wouldn't be sure of that (do not despair). You blasted a vial of boldenone undecylenate, that's probably more than quadruple the 568.7 mg of EQ (mean) they administered to the horses (mean weight 567 kg) here:


It's going to take some time to clear.

 

[Cito33189]

Thank you for your help and positivity

 

[mexbeast]

We need to dig up some 90's literature! Estrogen may be the cause of a lot of cancers, such as, prostate, uterine, and definitely brest. But let the 18 year olds come up with all this stupid bull crap of today. Like trump used to say "there's a lot of stupid people"

 

[lynxeffect1]

Men on TRT shouldn't need estrogen at all. And those few that are hypogonadal *and* aromatase deficient? Cmon... If you have an argument make one, but don't just pull nonsense out of your ass.

And aromatase deficiency is extremely rare. In females with a mutation at the CYP19A1 gene who will experience ambiguous genitalia (46,XX) and similarly rare in males (46,XY) with very obvious growth abnormalities due to failure of epiphyseal plate closure.

I'm fucked with 6months due to all low estrogen symptoms lethargy daily .ed. no sex drive . Strength and pump gone to zero due to what I can only explain as androgen to estrogen I'm balance. Cant even train now the last 3months. At 900 test e I used always be about 85pgml. When got bloods done in sept due to the issues above my estrogen was at 33pgml still on 900 test e a week. Test is legit as testosterone levels were at 3500. I dont use AI's. I've tried 3 times to come down to trt dose but I'm stuck at 600 because when I try to ease down to 300 a week all my symptoms worsen including my bones/ligaments get sore. No idea how this has happened but waiting on estradiol valerate tablets which shud arrive next week or the week after , hoping that sorts it as it did for another person I know

 

[Type-IIx]

I'm fucked with 6months due to all low estrogen symptoms lethargy daily .ed. no sex drive . Strength and pump gone to zero due to what I can only explain as androgen to estrogen I'm balance. Cant even train now the last 3months. At 900 test e I used always be about 85pgml. When got bloods done in sept due to the issues above my estrogen was at 33pgml still on 900 test e a week. Test is legit as testosterone levels were at 3500. I dont use AI's. I've tried 3 times to come down to trt dose but I'm stuck at 600 because when I try to ease down to 300 a week all my symptoms worsen including my bones/ligaments get sore. No idea how this has happened but waiting on estradiol valerate tablets which shud arrive next week or the week after , hoping that sorts it as it did for another person I know

Supplemental DHEA is all you need here.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

I wouldn't be sure of that (do not despair). You blasted a vial of boldenone undecylenate, that's probably more than quadruple the 568.7 mg of EQ (mean) they administered to the horses (mean weight 567 kg) here:
View attachment 155626

It's going to take some time to clear.

That is a hellish first 72hr spike in plasma for EQ. this would be an ideal once weekly compound, twice at most. I wish it didn’t wreak havoc on my BP the way it does.

 

[lynxeffect1]

Supplemental DHEA is all you need here.

It didn't work. Or hcg which I blasted heavily. 2000iu every second day over 10 days pharma grade

 

[cmryan]

I wouldn't be sure of that (do not despair). You blasted a vial of boldenone undecylenate, that's probably more than quadruple the 568.7 mg of EQ (mean) they administered to the horses (mean weight 567 kg) here:
View attachment 155626

It's going to take some time to clear.

So the plasma concentration of even the undecylenate ester peaks in approximately 24 hours? Not too surprising considering enanthate and cypionate peak faster than propionate.

 

[Type-IIx]

It didn't work. Or hcg which I blasted heavily. 2000iu every second day over 10 days pharma grade

DHEA dose-dependently increases E2 in men, thus the more you take the more E2 you get. HCG's E2 synthesis is limited by Leydig cell aromatase density (quite low).

 

[mexbeast]

So this is what I did.
I was on absolutely nothing. Got all my bloods done. Test level came back a 3 E2 was less than 15 did not give me an exact number.
I started taking test cyp. For a couple weeks. Got my test scores up to around 650.
My sex drive was slowly coming back but I wanted to rush it. Only going off experience every time I take EQ I get a good sex drive. I took 1cc of eq and 1 cc of test cyp a week.
Test was 250 eq was 200 a week for about 3 weeks.
I didn’t want to take the EQ anymore I found an old bottle of eq dosed at 300mg per ml. I said fuck it and took it all in one shot. Then got ED bad. Then being even more stupid the following week I took 400mg of primo.
My hypothesis is I crushed my E2. I never had a problem but also I always ran higher test. Now I’m just using trt doseages not thinking I’m keeping my test levels at a natural state. So basically if I take steroids I’m just taking steroids because my test level would be that of someone natural.

I’m having a hard time. It’s a pyscological battle. I want to come off gear and just be healthy. Hormonally I don’t feel right. I’m making an appointment with an HRT clinic. My doctor is useless.
I’m rushing things and throwing the kitchen sink at myself being impatient.

I have dbol on hand but I really don’t want to take anymore steroids. I just want to take test and test alone.

Lots of guys forget that the anabolic to androgenic ratio plays a role in sex drive, both eq and primo are mainly anabolic, very mildly androgenic or none androgenic at all, so the eq and primo probably blocked most of your androgenic receptors thereby reducing your sex drive signals, but what the hell do i know, right?

 

[OuchThatHurts]

Lots of guys forget that the anabolic to androgenic ratio plays a role in sex drive, both eq and primo are mainly anabolic, very mildly androgenic or none androgenic at all, so the eq and primo probably blocked most of your androgenic receptors thereby reducing your sex drive signals, but what the hell do i know, right?

I agree. But remember they are all androgenic in that their action is at the AR. Some are more or less potent anabolically than T but there can be no anabolism without androgenicity. Some of those compounds also bind to estrogen receptors (ER) and progesterone (PR) but for now, today, genetic expression in musculoskeletal growth and myonuclear accretion is activated via the AR.

 

[TheRoid]

Speaking of estrogen, androgenicity and progesterone receptors... there's one thing I never figured out.
I can blast a boatload of Test+Tren+Masteron+Dbol/Drol/Winstrol and have perfect clear skin.
Then even a modest dose of Deca gives me oily skin and BAD acne.
Any clue?

 

[OuchThatHurts]

Speaking of estrogen, androgenicity and progesterone receptors... there's one thing I never figured out.
I can blast a boatload of Test+Tren+Masteron+Dbol/Drol/Winstrol and have perfect clear skin.
Then even a modest dose of Deca gives me oily skin and BAD acne.
Any clue?

Not really because that's the biggest single reason I stopped using them. My back was covered almost overnight. And I try to take care of my skin.

 

[TheRoid]

Not really because that's the biggest single reason I stopped using them. My back was covered almost overnight. And I try to take care of my skin.

Very interesting.
And very bizarre.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

Very interesting.
And very bizarre.

Just nandrolones though. Go figure.

 

[MR. BMJ]

I break out with nandrolones too, sucks! Dosage factors in, but even at 300mg/wk, I had some on my temples/forehead that would pop-up....not cool at like 40'ish years old, lol.

 

[gains4000]

You go through old threads and guys would run 200 test 700 primo or like 300 test 800 mast and now all the sudden everyone complains of crashed estrogen. i find it very strange. All i see now is people whining about "low e2".

do you guys seriously think you will have estrogen deficiency from other AAS?

i have estrogen vials and i never once thought about using it. Hell no.

 

[mexbeast]

I agree. But remember they are all androgenic in that their action is at the AR. Some are more or less potent anabolically than T but there can be no anabolism without androgenicity. Some of those compounds also bind to estrogen receptors (ER) and progesterone (PR) but for now, today, genetic expression in musculoskeletal growth and myonuclear accretion is activated via the AR.

Yes, i agree, but the signaling is different, for instance, the anabolic signal on your skin from primo could initiate collagen synthesis, but if primo caused a androgenic signal then it could activate the sebaceous glands to produce more oil, does that make sense? Same goes for your brain and for your junk, if the signal is anabolic it will not initiate sexual excitement, but the androgenic signal will

 

[lynxeffect1]

You will see the most dramatic SHBG spike from oral estradiol as it hits the liver very hard with an estrogen agonist effect due to first pass metabolism.


Exogenous Estradiol has a very important use for men on TRT who have aromatase enzyme deficiency.

We used to think this condition was extremely rare, but is not that uncommon. Adding exogenous but physiological levels of E2 restores libido, energy and mental/physical wellbeing in these patients.

Sent you a pm if you could take a look

 

[Black Beard]

Human males with aromatase mutations have decreased libido and reduced sexual behavior, despite high testosterone levels, and estrogen treatment enhances libido and sexual activity (35).

Role of oestrogen in male sexual behaviour: insights from the natural model of aromatase deficiency - PubMed

The study of the sexual behaviour in this man with aromatase deficiency suggests that oestrogens in humans do not affect gender-identity and sexual orientation but could have a role in male sexual activity.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov