E1 levels high but E2 levels in range

[gorilla2015]

Hello...just got new bloodwork back and had E1 ( estrone ) levels at 210 where normal range is 15 and 65. My E2 ( estradiol) was 14 where normal levels are between 8 and 35...For all the literature I coukd read stating that e2 was the more important estrogen but high e1 makes you feel like crap which is how I have been feeling. So my question is for how can I get my e1 down ..if there is away as my e2 is good already . Taking 225 mg of test cyp weekly divided into 3 shots over the week (75 mg with skin pin m,w, f ) and taking .125 my of aromasin 2x week ..but just started trying 6.25 eod or as close as to it as possible cutting it into 1/4’s. My test serum was 1068 and free test was 38.6....my last months blood work was e2 at 29 and test serum was 990...just curious why e2 is low but e1 is high and woukd like to get it lower..thanks

 

[Stewie]

Are you taking any DHEA by chance or any old school "andro" prohormones?

I'd look at any and all of your supplements that may be precursors to androstenedione and or anything that may be inducing CYP19A activity (<--very unlikey).

For the sake of conversation, any testicular nodules?

May be worthwhile to retest to tease out lab error.

 

[Kaladryn]

I believe taking AIs is known to increase E1, correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Stewie]

I believe taking AIs is known to increase E1, correct me if I'm wrong.

Gotgame and I briefly talked about in this thread:
https://www.professionalmuscle.com/forums/lv/professional-muscle-forum/126226-blood-clots-aas.html

There's a couple different literature's looking at the subfractions of estrogens before and after the use of different A.I's.

 

[gorilla2015]

Not taking any supplements that would increase Andro...only take 225 mg of test cyp and 25 mg of aromasin...take a multi and vitamin c and d as well..but that’s it

 

[Stewie]

Not taking any supplements that would increase Andro...only take 225 mg of test cyp and 25 mg of aromasin...take a multi and vitamin c and d as well..but that&#146;s it

Any use of hCG?

 

[gorilla2015]

No use of hcg...I’m just curious as to why the e1 is so high whike e2 is low but in normal range. I have been trying to read up on as much info on the internet but no luck so far.

 

[Kaladryn]

This study has some good info in it, but not nothing too specific, I found some good info. I think E1 changes from AIs could be specific to sex

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3143915/

 

[Crazy_jay]

I believe taking AIs is known to increase E1, correct me if I'm wrong.

Aromasin does not raise estrone (e1) or at least not in normal people. It lowers it. https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/88/12/5951/2661508

I've also heard that arimedex is better at reducing e1 than aromasin.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[gorilla2015]

Bump

 

[pickapeck]

From the article above, androstenedione goes up with AI. Androstenedione is metabolized to estrone and that is inhibited by AI. Test is also metabolized by aromatase but mainly to estradiol. So you ahve a balance. Could be that the balance is shifted depending on your particular biology and the AI used etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steroid_hormone#/media/File:Steroidogenesis.svg

 

[MR. BMJ]

I remember macro saying that Aromasin would lower Estradiol (E2) more than Estrone (E1), which in part would be beneficial since the E1 stability would still keep sex drive up (etc) without Estro levels falling too low. Also remember reading that Arimidex was better at lowering Estrone levels. I know this is general with other factors involved, but I've usually kept this in mind and either used Aromasin or small doses of letro for my AI of choice. I don't think I've ever read anything on Aromasin increasing Estrone levels though...but heck, it's been forever since I've looked at any AI data.

 

[Stewie]

It could be from such a wide variety of things. Without further labs, it's all speculating here forward. It could be a counterregulatory response from stress, hypoglycemia, ect. DHEA opposes corticosteroid--catecholamines secretions. DHEA further metabolizes to anadrostendione-->estrone--<>estradiol, basically sex hormones.

I asked if he was using hCG, this can stimulate intratesticular 17-hydroxyprogestrone-->androstenedione-->estrone<>estradiol. Testicular neoplasms can be a cause. It's why I asked if he has any nodules. Unlikely, tho it's best to tease this out.

Could it be from the use of an A.I? Yeah sure anything's possible, regardless of what or what not literature states.

He's asking what can he do to lower it

... figure out what's feeding it.

Retest with more specifics.

 

[Kaladryn]

From that study I posted above, somewhat unrelated but interesting:

Although aromatase inhibition by anastrozole and letrozole is reported to be close to 100%, administration of these inhibitors to men will not suppress plasma estradiol levels completely. In men third-generation aromatase inhibitors will decrease the mean plasma estradiol/testosterone ratio by 77% [28,29]. This finding probably relates to the high plasma concentrations of testosterone, a major precursor for estradiol synthesis in adult men. As aromatase inhibition is dose dependent it has been suggested that aromatase is less suppressed in the testis compared to adipose and muscle tissue, explaining the incomplete efficacy of aromatase inhibition in men. Aromatase activity is high in the testes and the molar ratio of testosterone to letrozole is much higher in the testes compared with adipose and muscle tissue. When testicular testosterone and estradiol synthesis are suppressed and testosterone is administered exogenously in combination with letrozole, however, the estradiol/testosterone ratio is suppressed by 81% [30], which is only marginally different from the suppression of this ratio in intact men after treatment with letrozole. This incomplete suppression may be regarded as advantageous for it prevents excessive reduction of estrogen levels in men and the possible associated adverse effects. In postmenopausal women with breast carcinoma, long-term use of potent aromatase inhibitors reduces circulating estradiol levels by 88% [31] and is associated with adverse effects on bone [2,3]. Due to the much higher estrogen levels in treated men it remains to be determined whether this also holds true for men.

 

[gorilla2015]

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone that chimed in on this...truly appreciated !

 

[SOUR DIESEL]

just to contribute some additional clarification to this discussion for those that may not know..

the 3 major endogenous ESTROGENs:
E1=estrone
E2=estradiol
E3=estriol



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