Talk Live To IFBB Professional BodyBuilders And Athletes About Steroids, Nutrition And Training
©ALL CONTENT OF THIS WEBSITE IS COPYRIGHTED AND CANNOT BE REPRODUCED WITHOUT THE ADMINISTRATORS CONSENT 2002-2019
Automatic Translations (Powered by Google, Microsoft& Apertium):
Arabic Bulgarian Catalan Chinese Czech Danish Dutch English Estonian Finnish French German Greek Haitian Creole Hebrew Hindi Hungarian Indonesian Italian Japanese Korean Latvian Lithuanian Norwegian Polish Portuguese Romanian Russian Slovak Slovenian Spanish Swedish Taiwanese Thai Turkish Ukrainian Vietnamese

Talk Live To IFBB Professional BodyBuilders And Athletes About Steroids, Nutrition And Training  

Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products
Cheapest Supplements Guaranteed         Synthetek Muscle Building And Fat Loss Products


©ALL CONTENT OF THIS WEBSITE IS COPYRIGHTED AND CANNOT BE REPRODUCED WITHOUT THE ADMINISTRATORS CONSENT 2002-2019
Go Back   Professional Muscle > Peptide and Growth Factor Forum > Peptides and Growth Factors
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription           Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription           Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription
         
CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS           CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS
CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS           CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS
CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS           CHEAP and PURE BULK SUPPLEMENTS
PM
Facebook
PM
Youtube
PM Mobile App
(Android)
PM
Pinterest
PM
Twitter
Like Tree79Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 04-14-2019, 01:55 AM
Landmonster's Avatar
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 963
Question T-nation is against MK-677? Do you agree?

Hi guys.

So I was reading a recent article by Christian Thibideaux. Surprisingly, is against the use of Mk-677. Here is his quote, verbatim.

"What About MK-667?

While it's not a SARM Ė it's an orally effective peptide Ė it's often put in the same boat because it's sold at the same places and is taken orally (most other peptides are taken by injection).

MK is by far one of the worst products you can take, at least in "normal" doses. It works mostly by increasing growth hormone production, but it increases it for too long, giving you tons of pulses over a 20-24 hour period. As such, it decreases insulin sensitivity really quickly and it will also bloat the f**k out of you. You'll gain 10 pounds of water overnight and look like a water buffalo.

It'll make your blood pressure skyrocket too, and it can inhibit your natural growth hormone production because of its super long action."



Do you agree with this? I thought this was still one of the most popular hGH peptide tools on the market.


link: https://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-...th-about-sarms
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 02:52 AM
Featured Member / Kilo Klub
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by Landmonster View Post
Hi guys.

So I was reading a recent article by Christian Thibideaux. Surprisingly, is against the use of Mk-677. Here is his quote, verbatim.

"What About MK-667?

While it's not a SARM ¬– it's an orally effective peptide ¬– it's often put in the same boat because it's sold at the same places and is taken orally (most other peptides are taken by injection).

MK is by far one of the worst products you can take, at least in "normal" doses. It works mostly by increasing growth hormone production, but it increases it for too long, giving you tons of pulses over a 20-24 hour period.
This is a good thing...and the main reason it works so well. The more pulses we get, the more GH that is released. This is not harmful. If he is referring to GH "bleed", well, that concern has been invaliadated long ago. For the record, injectable GH causes causes a much greater degree of GH "bleed" than MK-677, as a single injection is continuously released into the bloodstream over an 8-10 hour period...and twice daily injections maintain GH "bleed" almost 24 hours per day. Bodybuilders have been doing this for years with great results and minimal side effects 9assuming does remain reasinable).

As such, it decreases insulin sensitivity
All GH peptides/secretagogies, as well as exogneous GH itself, decrease insulin senstivity. This has been common knowledge for years. High-dose exog. GH is WAY more injurious in this regard, while MK-677 only moderately decreases insulin senstivity. For those who are worried about it, the simple use of berberine or metformin can completely offset any decrease in senstivity that may occur. In other words, it is completely avoidable.

Regardless, most bodybuilders already have excelent insulin sensitivity due to weight training, cardio, clean eating, and having low bodyfat levels. The only bodybuilders who really need to be concerned with this are those who abuse exo. GH and/or high-dose insulin.


really quickly and it will also bloat the f**k out of you. You'll gain 10 pounds of water overnight and look like a water buffalo.
This is a side effect of elevated GH levels, regardless of whether one is using MK-677 or exo. GH.

Most bodybuilders want to use GH because of the benefits it provides, so if Christian thinks MK shouldn't be used, then I expect him to take the same stance on exo. GH. Cearly, many disagree with him.

For those who don't want any water retention, don't use MK or exo. GH, but this is a personal choice. Furthermore, and of great relevance to this discussion is that nearly all of the water retention associated with MK-677 dissipates after about 4-6 week of use, so it is a relatovely short-term side effect.


It'll make your blood pressure skyrocket too
Not necessarily. MY BP doesn't go up more than a few points..and after 4-6 weeks of use, it goes back down to normal. One thing I don't like is that Christian is speaking in absolutes--never a wise choice when dealing with personal response to drugs. Even if one's BP does go up moderately, it will still go back down after the water starts to fall off at the 4-6 week point.

The fact of the matter is that many drugs can potentially increase BP, so once again, I expect Christian to take the same stance against steroids and exo. GH, as both of these categories of drugs can potentially elevate BP much more than MK-677.

, and it can inhibit your natural growth hormone production because of its super long action."

Now this is really ignorant...and shows that he doesn't even understand MK-677's basic mechanism of action. MK-677 does the exact opposite of decrease natural production. All GH peptides/secretagogies specifically INCREASE natural production. It is the primary mechanism through which it works! We're not dealing with exogenous GH here. Were dealing with a GH "secretagogue"! Once the bodybuilder goes off of MK-677, production simply goes back down to what it was prior to using the substance. There is absolutely ZERO suppression of endogneous GH production.


Do you agree with this?
No.

I thought this was still one of the most popular hGH peptide tools on the market.
Yes, it is...because it is both highly effective and safe (i.e. no serious side effects).

link: https://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-...th-about-sarms
I like Chirstian, but his statements on MK-677 are riddled with both inaccuracy and personal opinion.
__________________

https://www.masupps.com/


MA Labs 20% OFF Code:
arnold20


http://maresearchchems.com/


MA Research 15% OFF Code: pm15

Last edited by Mike Arnold; 04-15-2019 at 03:01 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 04:32 AM
Registered Member
 
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Arnold View Post
I like Chirstian, but his statements on MK-677 are riddled with both inaccuracy and personal opinion.
great post mike. i saw this a week ago and was surprised how it seemed like christian had no idea about what he was talking about when it comes to mk.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 05:51 AM
Newbie Registered Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Arnold View Post
I like Chirstian, but his statements on MK-677 are riddled with both inaccuracy and personal opinion.


How do you know thereís no suppression of endogenous GH production after pushing the pituitary for hrs on end for a whole month, that just doesnít go along with common sense. I love MK, and I understand the pros and cons to enhancement. But we canít be fools and say your body just goes back to how it was functioning after itís been given such enormous stimuli. Unless you have scientific evidence, I believe the latter in that one, across the board with all enhancements, period.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 07:42 AM
Dog-Slime's Avatar
Verified Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTrailerTrash View Post
How do you know there’s no suppression of endogenous GH production after pushing the pituitary for hrs on end for a whole month, that just doesn’t go along with common sense. I love MK, and I understand the pros and cons to enhancement. But we can’t be fools and say your body just goes back to how it was functioning after it’s been given such enormous stimuli. Unless you have scientific evidence, I believe the latter in that one, across the board with all enhancements, period.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757071/

Most important quote as to what you said. As restoring function vs damaging function as you imply it would do is right here for ya:

"The promise of MK-677 is that it appears to restore endogenous GH levels in a physiological secretory pattern, unlike the single high-amplitude pulse observed after exogenous GH administration"

Oh and some people used it for 2 years straight not just a month and that was still the observation....

Last edited by Dog-Slime; 04-15-2019 at 07:46 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 07:52 AM
pickapeck's Avatar
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog-Slime View Post
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757071/

Most important quote as to what you said. As restoring function vs damaging function as you imply it would do is right here for ya:

"The promise of MK-677 is that it appears to restore endogenous GH levels in a physiological secretory pattern, unlike the single high-amplitude pulse observed after exogenous GH administration"

Oh and some people used it for 2 years straight not just a month and that was still the observation....
To address his question one would ahve to measure before use and afterward subsequent to a washout period and do it for number of people. I've been using peptides for probably 6-7 years on and off. Not much Mk but all others and one stint with MK. My IGF-1 base use to be 180s. Now it's 130s to 140s but I am in my late 50s so could be from aging.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 08:00 AM
Dog-Slime's Avatar
Verified Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by pickapeck View Post
To address his question one would ahve to measure before use and afterward subsequent to a washout period and do it for number of people. I've been using peptides for probably 6-7 years on and off. Not much Mk but all others and one stint with MK. My IGF-1 base use to be 180s. Now it's 130s to 140s but I am in my late 50s so could be from aging.
I'd bet BIG money that your igf dropping 20 points over 7 years while in your 50's is 100% natural..

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK279163/

But I somewhat agree about and am looking for any follow up studies proving what I think/say about the mk actually being good for or non detrimental to production...

Last edited by Dog-Slime; 04-15-2019 at 08:04 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 09:38 AM
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 944
I have used mk many times. I will never do it again. It destoys your insulin sensitivity and in this game insulin sensitivity is one of the most important factors.bulking or dieting.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 04-15-2019, 09:55 AM
Dog-Slime's Avatar
Verified Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by need4tren View Post
I have used mk many times. I will never do it again. It destoys your insulin sensitivity and in this game insulin sensitivity is one of the most important factors.bulking or dieting.
Did you miss Mike's response above?
" For those who are worried about it, the simple use of berberine or metformin can completely offset any decrease in senstivity that may occur. In other words, it is completely avoidable. "
Not the first time I've seen that said either....
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2019, 02:16 AM
Newbie Registered Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog-Slime View Post
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2757071/

Most important quote as to what you said. As restoring function vs damaging function as you imply it would do is right here for ya:

"The promise of MK-677 is that it appears to restore endogenous GH levels in a physiological secretory pattern, unlike the single high-amplitude pulse observed after exogenous GH administration"

Oh and some people used it for 2 years straight not just a month and that was still the observation....

The test subjects were all over the age of 60yrs old, thereís pretty much no GH secretion going on at that age, so the restoration of endogenous GH would likely occur in someone not producing or if any GH. Iíd like to see a study based on young adults, those with proper GH function and going on the MK and off and seeing restoration or degradation..



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2019, 04:33 AM
Dog-Slime's Avatar
Verified Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasTrailerTrash View Post
The test subjects were all over the age of 60yrs old, thereís pretty much no GH secretion going on at that age, so the restoration of endogenous GH would likely occur in someone not producing or if any GH. Iíd like to see a study based on young adults, those with proper GH function and going on the MK and off and seeing restoration or degradation..



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
So you assume it may help someone that needs it but hurt someone that doesn't need it? Would like to see a study showing that as well but really curious about your logic there....
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2019, 06:52 AM
Kilo Klub Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 3,292
I could care less what Christian or anyone else has to say about MK. I've used it a lot, and had fantastic results. For me, there really wasn't all that much water retention. My muscles look full and skin looks even better.
concreter and 11111 like this.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2019, 09:37 AM
sciroxx-lab's Avatar
Verified Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,382
My remarks -

- MK does cause much sharper and much rapid water retention then exogenous GH, which clearly lead me to suspect direct interaction with aldosterone which is responsible on mineral balance, the bloat is certainly more noticeable, at least compared to low/moderate dosage of GH. GH itself indirectly increases aldosterone activity, but this phenomena is much more pronounced with MK

- I'm intrigued like you how MK effects endogenous GH secretion after halting its usage. MK triggers endogenous secretion of GH so it "uses" the body natural axis to produce GH,however it'll certainly increase sharply Somatostatin serum levels (possibly with some longer run effect). Somatostain inhibits GH secretion, and counter the effect of GHRH, higher serum GH levels triggers directly Somatostation secretion

- Insulin sensitivity is also easily and favorably restored with low dosage IGF1 application
romo likes this.
__________________

[email protected]
Guaranteed quality by any test or money back
Somastim and Somedin (proven pharma quality western made GH and IGF1
)

Last edited by sciroxx-lab; 04-16-2019 at 09:40 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 04-16-2019, 11:17 AM
Kilo Klub Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by sciroxx-lab View Post
My remarks -

- MK does cause much sharper and much rapid water retention then exogenous GH, which clearly lead me to suspect direct interaction with aldosterone which is responsible on mineral balance, the bloat is certainly more noticeable, at least compared to low/moderate dosage of GH. GH itself indirectly increases aldosterone activity, but this phenomena is much more pronounced with MK

- I'm intrigued like you how MK effects endogenous GH secretion after halting its usage. MK triggers endogenous secretion of GH so it "uses" the body natural axis to produce GH,however it'll certainly increase sharply Somatostatin serum levels (possibly with some longer run effect). Somatostain inhibits GH secretion, and counter the effect of GHRH, higher serum GH levels triggers directly Somatostation secretion

- Insulin sensitivity is also easily and favorably restored with low dosage IGF1 application

How low of a dosage would you say IGF-1 should be for this purpose?
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2019, 01:49 AM
sciroxx-lab's Avatar
Verified Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,382
Quote:
Originally Posted by warlock View Post
How low of a dosage would you say IGF-1 should be for this purpose?
20-30 mcg will do the trick, but simple serum glucose level will give a good indication
warlock likes this.
__________________

[email protected]
Guaranteed quality by any test or money back
Somastim and Somedin (proven pharma quality western made GH and IGF1
)
Reply With Quote
  #16 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2019, 02:35 AM
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 239
I disagree with every statement t-nation said about mk677 in the 1st post.

As a 49 year old bodybuilder and scientist, I believe in lab work and how my body feels as opposed to hearsay (t-nation).

I have over 8 labs below to prove that mk677 works without side effects on your natural gh and igf-1, insulin sensitivity, and liver values, and bloat is easily controlled (see my tips below, it has to do with keto diet).

* Mk677 does NOT raise my bloodpressure, pharm grade hgh injections from China do raise my bloodpressure however.
My bloodpressure while on mk677 is only 120/70. My bloodpressure varies from 110 to 127. I am on test cypionate replacement therpay. I use 175mg a week (one 50mg shot every other day with 1/2 mg of arimidex with every shot).

* MK677 does NOT bloat me, as I am on a ketogenic diet year round, with extra carbs (1/2 cup oatmeal) preworkout (extra carbs on workout days) to fuel my workout for performance. If you consume lots of carbs everyday, then yes, you will get some bloat with mk677. On a keto diet, mk677 does not bloat me, what does bloat me is using above 200mg of testosterone a week without arimidex.

I will post my testosterone and E2 bloods in 3 days, as I just had levels tested this morning.

* MK677 does NOT ruin your natural gh and igf-1 levels after you come off it, that is a complete lie. See my bloodwork
below. On my 2nd year on mk677, my bloods once again reached the levels of 3.4 iu pharm grade hgh from china with just 25mg of mk677, just like the 1st year I was on. Inbetwen my time off on mk677, my bloods were normal 227 ng/ml igf-1.

* MK677 does not over stimuate your gh and igf-1 levesl, it mearly returns them to the level you once had when you were
a very young adult, the body puts a regulatory system in place once you start taking mk677, that allows it to raise no higher than the high level of around an 18 year old. A system of checks and balances is imposed naturally by the body to keep it in range, this was proven by the beagles study on mk677, and my own many labs on mk667 prove the same (see below).

* I do not get lethargy at all while on mk677, but if you are one of the unlucky ones that do, I would suggest dropping the mk677 or switching to real hgh injections. I only use mk677 for 7 months of the year, then take 5 months off.

----------------------my original post in the mk677 thread:----------------------------------

I will not repost all my labs here (just some), you can go back and see my labs attached as pics to original thread.

Just got results back a few weeks ago for new year 2019 on mk677 after 1 month on.

Results came back on the high end for a 18 year old, and I'm age 49, very impressed.

IGF-1 range for my age group of 48 ----------- 67 to 205 ng/ml igf-1
IGF-1 range for older adults ----------------- 59 to 225 ng/ml igf-1
IGF-1 range for young adults is -------------- 116 to 358 ng/ml igf-1

4-6-18, baseline igf -1 = 227 ng/ml------------------------------------------ baseline
4-11-18, 2 days on 4iu of Chinese pharm grade HGH = 380 ng/ml-----------------increase of 153 points
4-25-18, 2 weeks on mk677 only = 372 ng/ml------------------------------------increase of 145 points (nearly 150 point increase only lasts 2 weeks)
9-7-18, 6 months on mk677 only = 322 ng/ml------------------------------------increase of 95 points
11-2-18, 8 months on mk677 only = 304 ng/ml-----------------------------------increase of 75 points (levels start to fall after 6 months on mk677)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
new year:
3-18-19, 4 weeks on mk677 only = 327 ng/ml-------------------------------------increase of 100 points, (2-22-19 thru 3-18-19 thus far)

Year 2018 = 322 ng/ml igf-1 (average level during 1st 6 months on 25mg mk677 in morning) is equivalent of 3.4 iu pharm grade GH from China, as 95 point raise per each 1iu of hgh for me.

Year 2019 = 327 ng/ml igf-1 (after 1 month on 25mg mk677 in the am) is equivalent to 3.4 iu pharm grade GH from China, as 95 point raise per each 1iu of hgh
for me.

Comments:

I like to take mk677 for 7 months of the year, then take 5 months off, then repeat, as you start to get diminishing returns after the 6th month on it, it is then good to take a break from it, as even the mk677 studies on older adults showed after the 6th month, levels begin to drop from the peak.

It's nice to see the m677 is still kicking strong. I feel it working as usual, great workouts + recuperation + enhanced exercise tolerance, no lethargy or anxiety whatsoever, fantastic mood, love the stuff. If you get tired or lethargy when using mk677, maybe suggest switching to real hgh injections instead? or just don't use anything. Studies show a 20% increase in strength in older adults, have noticed 30% increase over time, as a good responder.

1) Mk677 bloating is minimized as I stay on a ketogenic diet year round except for extra carbs on workout days,

2) Mk677 minor insulin desensitivity (this happens with hgh as well) is counteracted by using 300mg of +R ALA before meals.

3) MK677 does not burn fat like hgh but it has increased nitrogen retention in place of this drawback. To help lose fat fast while on mk677, use keto diet + intermittent fasting (eat only 8 hours during day), cardio + CLA + betaine (TMG): read the studies at ergo-log on cla + betaine super stack.

4) Liver values bloodwork was performed last year after 7 months on it, and they were completely normal.

5) Mk677 hunger pains die down after about 4 weeks on the cycle.

6) Got powder directly from China (comes out to $25 a gram) and use a really good 1mg electronic scale (example: AWS gpr-20 20g x 0.001g). There is usually a min order of $200 and shipping is around $20. Powder should have a really nasty lingering taste and not just a weak acidic taste that dies out early. It is hard to synthesize, so insist on good quality.
------------------------------------------------

For those concerned about insulin sensitivity:

n 2018, I took 25mg in the morning from March till November (8 months), though now I only take it 7 months straight, then take a 5 month break off.

My levels after 4 months on it this year measure 327 ng/ml, up from my baseline of 227, so a 100 point increase, I read at the high end for an 18 year old on my GH and igf-1 levels while on it, and I am age 49 bodybuilder, so more than happy.

30% greater strength gains over time, good nootropic energy during day, sleep great at night, keeps joins lubricated, and enhanced exercise tolerance in the gym and on treadmill. No lethargy at all here during the day, unlike many I have read about. A few pages about the mk677 in the book "grow young with hgh" by Klatz too.

7 months in while taking it, I had labs done, mk677 had NO detrimental effects on my insulin, glucose, A1c, etc.

Labs from Sept 26, 2018:

Insulin 8.2 uU/ml , normal, low =2.6, high = 24.9
Glucose: 89.0 mg/dl, normal, low = 70, high = 99
HbA1c: 5.1%, normal, low = 4.0, high = 5.6

I recommend you take 300mg of +R-ALA (Dr. Danielle Alpha Lipoic Acid, RALA, Extremely High Quality Alpha R Lipoic Acid (R-ALA)R- ALA 120 Capsules) before every meal x 3 times a day to help counteract and even improve insulin sensitivity while on either HGH or mk677, as yes, both will lower insulin sensitivity a bit, but this can be improved considerably with +R alpha lipoic acid, p.s. I get no hearburn from the above formula, best I have tried, and I have tried 3 different brands.

You can also take berberine along with +R-ALA, as berberine in studies has proven just as effective as metformin, +R-ALA in studies has proven even more effective then metformin.

I was not taking +R-ALA during the months the lab was taken above, but have since added it this year during my 7 month of the year mk677 25mg a day cycle.

Liver values also normal after 7 months of use:

ALT 26.0 u/L, normal, low =7, high =56.0
AST 21.0 u/L normal, low = 5, high = 35

MK677 is also not expensive, try xian Lyphar biotech in China, around twenty bucks a gram, don't pay the ridiculous prices charged for it here in the USA, as they are but the middleman who get it from China anyways.
--------------------------------

thoughts on anabolics:

As far as anabolics on a 12 week cycle once to twice a year, I prefer high dose 500 to 800mg primobolan (basically side effect free) along with my normal 175mg a week test cyp dosage, and around 4 weeks of 20mg a day dianabol. It does not raise my blood pressure, no bad blood lipid results, does not mess with my sleep, feel great on it, and since I keep my test dose low and primo high, it does not mess with my hairline, whereas it will mess with your hairline if you keep your test high and the primo high (I have tried it both ways). Primobolan at high dose it like a side effect free trenbolone. It gives slow steady gains with no water retention. Like Masteron but better. Full, round, hard, veiny. It was Arnold's favorite along with d-ball, and I agree, those two are my favorites too.

I do not respond well to trenbolone, as the one side effect it gives me annoys me bad: I get terrible sleep on it, as it wakes me once a night early, or causes me to wake up too early, it has stimulation wich messes with my sleep, otherwise it would be fine. And this is even at 150mg a week (20mg a day everyday injection using an insulin syringe). Perhaps 10mg a day would be different, but I believe any amount in my system can be a problem with the sleep disturbance side effect.

I do not like deca durabolin only because of the possibiliy of deca dick and libido problems in some, not all, see the reason it causes deca dick in the on-line article at muscular development, it messes with nitric acid badly, and studies show it also can be damaging to blood vessels. If it weren't for those 2 problems, it would be awesome.

I do like d-ball at 20mg a day for 4 weeks. Anavar however causes me to be wired and thus messes with my sleep, just like trenbolone. This wired feeling happens with some other people as well, but not all.
Name:  mk study graph.jpg
Views: 391
Size:  27.5 KB

Name:  mk677 2018 lab 1.jpg
Views: 396
Size:  146.9 KB

Name:  mk677 2018 lab 2.jpg
Views: 399
Size:  135.3 KB

Name:  mk677 lab march 2019.jpg
Views: 398
Size:  111.0 KB
concreter, 11111 and Delt123 like this.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2019, 02:37 AM
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 192
How would IGF-1 injections increase insulin sensitivity? IGF-1 is the whole reason HGH causes insulin resistance. IGF-1 binds to the same receptors as insulin but only has about 10% of the glucose absorbition activity that insulin does. Hence the insulin resistance.
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2019, 03:43 AM
Dog-Slime's Avatar
Verified Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 923
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22374641
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old 04-17-2019, 08:03 AM
sciroxx-lab's Avatar
Verified Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,382
Quote:
Originally Posted by liquid_c View Post
How would IGF-1 injections increase insulin sensitivity? IGF-1 is the whole reason HGH causes insulin resistance. IGF-1 binds to the same receptors as insulin but only has about 10% of the glucose absorbition activity that insulin does. Hence the insulin resistance.
This scientific article below explains on the GH and IGF different anabolic, anti catabolic and metabolic different impacts - among them their opposite effects on insulin sensitivity. IT of course supports the synergistic effect they posses when combined

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8853443 GH may exert metabolic effects either directly or indirectly through increased production of IGF-I. GH administration increases circulating IGF-I levels via stimulation of hepatic synthesis and secretion of IGF-I; it may also enhance local IGF-I synthesis, which exerts paracrine or autocrine effects. Figure 2 summarizes the metabolic effects of GH and IGF-I. Administration of GH and IGF-I in adult humans has been demonstrated to enhance protein anabolism. Combined administration of GH and IGF-I was observed to be more anabolic than either IGF-I or GH alone. Evidence is presented that protein accretion results mainly from direct effects of GH on tissues; additional indirect effects via IGF-I production are also likely. Administration of GH has been reported to produce carbohydrate intolerance with elevated plasma insulin levels, resulting from insulin resistance. in contrast, insulin sensitivity increased during administration of IGF-I, which exerts hypoglycaemic effects even with concomitant suppression of insulin secretion. A major direct metabolic effect of GH is to increase fat mobilization and oxidation, and thereby to reduce total body fat; there is no evidence that IGF-I acts directly on adipose tissue in vivo. GH administration results in sodium retention via stimulation of Na-K-ATPase. It is suggested that part of the effects of GH on tubular function (e.g. phosphate reabsorption) are mediated via IGF-I. Energy expenditure may be increased by administration of either GH or relatively high doses of IGF-I. One of the reasons for this phenomenon is an increase in lean body mass; GH may increase energy expenditure additionally be enhancing the production of T3 and by increasing lipid oxidation
__________________

[email protected]
Guaranteed quality by any test or money back
Somastim and Somedin (proven pharma quality western made GH and IGF1
)
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old 04-18-2019, 12:43 AM
Newbie Registered Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dog-Slime View Post
So you assume it may help someone that needs it but hurt someone that doesn't need it? Would like to see a study showing that as well but really curious about your logic there....


Uhhhhhhhhh yea thatís kinda how all medicines especially hormone replacement works buttttty LMAO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 3 (0 members and 3 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


           

   Buy Needles And Syringes With No Prescription     How To Do Injections, Injection Instructions     

            

           

           

           

           

           

           

           

All times are GMT +10. The time now is 07:48 PM.

 
Languages translations made by vBET 3.10.1
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1 Copyright ProfessionalMuscle.com 2002-2018

©ALL CONTENT OF THIS WEBSITE IS COPYRIGHTED AND CANNOT BE REPRODUCED WITHOUT THE ADMINISTRATORS CONSENT 2002-2019
How To Use Synthol How To Do Injections
Buy Synthol Buy Synthol
Buy steroids at Ivitamins Steroids discussion board
How To Use Steroids
vbPLUS