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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2012, 11:28 PM
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Exciting! GRF1-29/GHRP-2 serum GH test!

Well in continued effor to help as much as i can on this board i decided to do some serum tesing of GH levels post peptide administration. We have seen quite a bit on synthetic GH and there is a lot of speculation of how much peptide is equivalent to how many IUs of GH etc but no testing as far as i know has been done on this board at least to see how different combo of pepetides affect serum GH levels. Now this protocol is different than injectable GH because you definitely need to be fasting. Having carbs/fats within a 2hour time causes somatostatin to prevent or markedly reduce release of GH from the pituitary. Also, the timins is different. WHen you inject peptides most studies or research shows that serum GH peaks at 30-40min mark. This is because you are not waiting for the synthetic GH to spread from injection site evenly throughout the blood. Within minutues of pituitary receiving the signal from peptides it does pretty much dump the GH immediately into blood stream so testing time is different.

Some of this was also because of the Egrifta (tesamorelin) approval by FDA and the crazy high dosage of single compound they used (2mg daily) to achieve results. We know that single use of a GHRH without the use of a GHRP at the same time does not release nearly as much GH as a combo does hence why they had to use such as high dosage to get meaninful results. Even in aftermarket prices using 2mg daily of tesamorelin makes it more expensive than GH from one of our reputable sponsors such as Mexi or TP.

This test was NOT do determine which brand works or does not and I do not want to get in to that at this time. This was more as an investigation to see if we can see a marked GH serum rise with peptide administration that we can put our finger on. I am sure at some point memebers will start to test different brands/dosages and combinations and post them accordingly but this is not the purpose of this test so please do ask for source of peptide.

To make sure everyone is clear i have been off GH for 5 weeks now. I like to run GH for 3-4months and off approx 1 month. I am only on TRT dosage of testosterone along with folli and Myo HMP. I am not on any other hormones of any kinds and not taking any AIs. So this is how the test went:

1) Yesteday fasting since 11pm the night before
2) Inject 500mcg of Mod GRF1-29 and 250mcg of GHRP-2 SubQ
3) Draw serum GH exactly 40min after injection

I know traditionally most people use the 100mcg/100mcg method but i somehow dont buy into 100mcg being the max dose and maxing out the receptor theory. Hence why tesamorelin worked a hell of a lot better at 2mg than it does at quarter of a dose. And so everyone is clear GHRH is a 44 amino acid chain. We know that the last 15 amino acids are completely useless. This is why the last 15 amino acids were cleaved and we came up with Sermorelin. Of course sermorelin was too short acting so different companies did different amino acid substitutions to make the half life longer. In order for Merck to make their product branded and make money they added the 15 amino acid chain and added a hexonyl group to make it last 8 hours and bam money in pocket.

So i used a pretty high dose but still significantly less than 2mg of any peptide to see what we get. I am sure in the future i can use less or more to see if my response changes. To make a long story short i was quite shocked and pleased with the results. My serum GH came at 12.8!

That is pretty awesome. To keep things in check in the recent Mexi Blacktop test testers were injecting 10iu of GH and their levels were 16-21 amongst the tests i have seen so far. So to get a level of 12.8 with just 750mcg of total peptides this is more equivalent to 4-5iu of GH at least. The best part is that this is your own GH so there are no antibody formation. There are many questions that stil remain such as:

1) Would i get similar results using less dosage such as 100/100mg? I dont know but i will try that at some point
2) Would i get even higher results if i used 1mg of GRF1-29 with 500mcg of GHRP-2. I do have to add that at the 250mcg of GHRP-2, i ate everything in my kitchen after the blood draw lol
3) Because of the hunger side effect of GHRP-2, i would next like to try a combo of GRF1-29/Ipamorelin to see what king of results i get.


But no matter what i am super excited to get this level of GH rise with compounds that are pretty inexpensive and possibly even safer



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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-26-2012, 11:32 PM
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Excellent research and thank you!
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2012, 12:07 AM
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Can you prove that you wont get the same results using 100mcg? No!

I am more interested in what 100mcg can do than 500mcg - I am sure most people would agree.
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Old 06-27-2012, 12:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teewoods View Post
Can you prove that you wont get the same results using 100mcg? No!

I am more interested in what 100mcg can do than 500mcg - I am sure most people would agree.
Slow down soldier...

What do you mean "NO" You dont even make sense. I never said you wont get the same result if you use a lower dose. Of course it can be proven one way or the other. Inject 100/100 and repeat test if i get much lower result then YES i can prove that lower dosage wont give same results. And if the lower dosage gives same same rise in serum GH the whoopdy fucking doo great. It sounds like you have a little sand in your vagina you need to wash out.

I mentioned that in tesamorelin's case they had to use a pretty high dosage to get meaninful results. Do you think they got same results using 100mcg of Tesamorelin and decided to use 20x the dosage for shits and giggles? Hell no. It is very possible that the combo of GHRH/GHRP can achieve probably even better results than a single high dose of GHRH. But only way to now is to do it and test it.

What would actually be really cool is to repeat this test with just single injection of tesamorelin 2mg and see how much of a rise it gives you. If any sponsors want to send out tesamorelin for me to test and post results contact me. I wil post whatever the real world results is good or bad as long you can accept that let me know.
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Old 06-27-2012, 12:29 AM
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Thanks alpha great addition to our growing knowledge.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2012, 12:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teewoods View Post
Can you prove that you wont get the same results using 100mcg? No!

I am more interested in what 100mcg can do than 500mcg - I am sure most people would agree.
What a dumbass response to well thought out and articulate post. He clearly stated this is only the first stage of the learning process and there is much more to be found out. I you're interested in what 100 mcg can do then go get the damn test done yourself and share the info with the community
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:17 AM
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thanks for taking the time and effort Alpha, that is great info/news
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Old 06-27-2012, 01:42 AM
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How much was the test. Thanks for posting this btw!
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 06-27-2012, 01:47 AM
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Thanks for the tests, pretty intriguing results. I know you laid out what you did for this test but what is your protocol overall? Once a day same doses? Am or pm?
Thanks
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Old 06-27-2012, 02:15 AM
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Thanks Alpha!!! Much appreciated to a question we've all been wondering
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Old 06-27-2012, 02:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teewoods View Post
Can you prove that you wont get the same results using 100mcg? No!

I am more interested in what 100mcg can do than 500mcg - I am sure most people would agree.


Then why don't you test it yourself

Another positive response left on a peptide thread, compliments of Mr. Woods.
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Old 06-27-2012, 02:43 AM
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Thanks for sharing this information Alpha. I understand why the peptides are taken when no fats/carbs have been recently ingested; but, is true that Hgh should also be taken on an "empty stomach"?
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Old 06-27-2012, 03:49 AM
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So Alpha, you are saying Saturation Dose is a BS ?

Thanks for what you doing

and one more thing, you took that 750 totall at once ????

So no more injecting 3 times a day ! NICEEEEEEEE

Last edited by raw33man; 06-27-2012 at 03:56 AM.
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Old 06-27-2012, 04:01 AM
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By the way, you said 10ius of rips mexis was 16 - 21

12.8 to 21 is 6ius to 8ius woa thats awesome
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Old 06-27-2012, 04:20 AM
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Thanks for not only doing this but to also taking the time to type and post your test results.

I guess I gotta up my cjc with dac and GHRP-2 and see how the fat-loss will go with that.


I wonder if one could pin 500mcg or 1mg of cjc with dac and a day later or so pin the same dosage on GHRP-2 and see if the test results will change or not.
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Old 06-27-2012, 04:50 AM
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Calpoly,

I own my own private practice so it just gets charged to my office. But if you get it thru privatemdlabs.com i think it is around $60 if not mistaken.



armstrongmike,
I dont have a protocol of any kind. I have not been on peptides for over a year and a half. These peptides that i used for this test are close to two years old in the fridge. I really never got a great response from them and definitely no where near 5iu of GH a day when i did 100/100mcg twice a day. This testing and more will determine what kind of protocol i will use


GeauxDATY,
Effectiveness of GH has no bearing on if you have eaten or not cause you are injecting said synthetic GH in your system. You are not dependent on another hormone to block its release from the pituitary. The only reason GH and fasting even comes in question is that it just works a hell of a lot better for fat loss when you take GH in a fasting state and then you do cardio cause the fatty acids it releases your body can use for energy instead of the glycogen stored in your liver.


raw33man,
I never said saturation dose is B.S. Just saying that i may not think that saturation dose is 100mcg. I still may be wrong. Only way to check is for me to repeat this test at 100/100 and see if i get within 10% of 12.8. If it comes close then we can definitely say using more than 100/100 is worthless but if the number is much lower then we know saturation dose is much higher than initially thought. And yes i was conservative, but when i tested Mexis Green tops i got 12.6 with 10iu of GH so getting 12.8 with this is at least 4-5iu of GH being conservative. And yes, i took 500mcg of GRF1-29 WITHOUT DAC and 250mcg of GHRP-2 all at once. Going by the numbers we can definitely still pin twice a day to mimic how i normally use synthetic GH twice a day.

Google&Pubmed,

I highly recommend against CJC with DAC. It is well known and though of and Dat agrees that the DAC causes significant GH bleed and never gives you a spike as it should. IMHO, you should be using Mod GRF 1-29 that does not have DAC.
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Old 06-27-2012, 04:59 AM
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I would be very interested to see what the 100/100 protocol would achieve just to bring some clarity to the debate. It would be good to know where the most bang for buck lies. Either way very interesting post alpha

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sammy555 View Post
I would be very interested to see what the 100/100 protocol would achieve just to bring some clarity to the debate. It would be good to know where the most bang for buck lies. Either way very interesting post alpha

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

I will be heading out of town tomorrow for a Johnson and Johnson conference i have to give but i will re-do the test next Monday using same protocol and using 100/100 of same product and brand so we can see what we got. This will give us a very good indication of what dosage should be used.

I really do want to compare all of this though with a single 2mg of tesamorelin for comparison.
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Last edited by alpha6164; 06-27-2012 at 05:05 AM.
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha6164 View Post
Google&Pubmed,

I highly recommend against CJC with DAC. It is well known and though of and Dat agrees that the DAC causes significant GH bleed and never gives you a spike as it should. IMHO, you should be using Mod GRF 1-29 that does not have DAC.
Most would take CJC DAC w/a GHRP so they would still get spike along with a constant flow (bleed) of GH with the CJC. Are you familiar with Russianstar, Alpha? He's a phD that wrote about this a few years ago. Anyways, hope this helps. Sorry if it's too off-topic. I can't wait for your follow-up test(s)!
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Old 06-27-2012, 05:26 AM
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I seriously doubt 100/100 will have results like that !!

IF people are doing 100/100 three times a day, then that's like 12 15ius of GH ! They should blow up in no seconds lol
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