FOR the high volume guys

[HONGOGRIMES]

Suppose you doing a high volume of training ... for example 20-30 sets. in all your sets do you go to the failure? I always wonder if there is this distinction of high and low volume or if some count the warm-up series and others do not (I'm talking about people already with high weights, not someone who makes many series with a low weight)

 

[opietaylor]

try it and find out. im guessing after 3-4 sets of true failure on legs your other 26-27 sets fall short. you can train hard or you can train long.

 

[jeroendebleser]

Back when I was doing Scott Abel-programs, I used to go to failure on every working set for sometimes 20 or more sets per bodypart. But Abel has come around on this and so have I because as you'd expect, I made little progress training that way. It doesn't have any advantage over what I do now and it's counterproductive.

Nowadays I work up to 1 working set per exercise (with as many sets as I feel necessary, sometimes 4, sometimes 1) which I take to failure. Call it 'Yates HIT' or what you will but most people here will tell you they do the exact same thing. If you take it to failure, you really don't need more than 1 working set for optimal results. I know this is not in line with what the research mostly says (more working sets being better) but it is my experience.

 

[pickapeck]

One way that seems to work is to do your heavy stuff to failure like flat bench 4-5 sets. Then do 2-3 additional exercises 3-4 sets each and chase the pump fast paced higher reps 12-20 reps. There's probably 100 ways for it to work. The point is to push the muscle to a place it hasn't been before but not so much that you annilate the muscle to the point that it can't recover before the next bout.

 

[IronLion2]

Eccentric failure only for high volume

 

[tornquad201]

I don’t count warm ups one thing too remember that raising volume also increases work capacity and that is also a form of overload

 

[Dens228]

Suppose you doing a high volume of training ... for example 20-30 sets. in all your sets do you go to the failure? I always wonder if there is this distinction of high and low volume or if some count the warm-up series and others do not (I'm talking about people already with high weights, not someone who makes many series with a low weight)

Not looking into DC anymore? LOL

 

[Kaladryn]

There is a big difference between failure and maximum stimulation/adaptive response of the target muscle. Two people could "fail" at the same exercise, after the same number of reps, with the same weight, and one person could fully stimulate the target muscle to adapt and the other person could not stimulate adaptation at all. It's so much more than positive failure: mechanical stress, relative to range of motion, target muscle activation (both positive and negative), time under tension, nerve activation, mental will power, etc. Also, failure is a mental state, not a physical one.

 

[jeroendebleser]

There is a big difference between failure and maximum stimulation/adaptive response of the target muscle. Two people could "fail" at the same exercise, after the same number of reps, with the same weight, and one person could fully stimulate the target muscle to adapt and the other person could not stimulate adaptation at all. It's so much more than positive failure: mechanical stress, relative to range of motion, target muscle activation (both positive and negative), time under tension, nerve activation, mental will power, etc. Also, failure is a mental state, not a physical one.

True.

 

[Biggerp73]

I go by feel/intuition, and sometimes this means lots of volume. But whether I am doing high volume or low volume, I almost never go to failure. I train heavy and intense, have to amp myself up, etc. But I always stop a rep or two shy of failure.

 

[IronLion2]

Eccentric failure only for high volume

Typo you idiot, concentric failure only. Usually pyramid the load up so the first few arent true failure than one to two sets of concentric failure, for low volume it's reverse pyramid with all sets to eccentric or total failure.

 

[Fa Seeshus]

I just make allot of noise so people know that I am hardcore and taking every set "to failure." It is like veganism. You have to talk about "to failure" all the time.

 

[jayl19]

I thought 12 sets was high volume haha

I do 12 sets to failure, each body part once a week

Back a few more sets, biceps a few less, calf’s a few less

Guess I must be a moderate volume guy

 

[Elvia1023]

One way that seems to work is to do your heavy stuff to failure like flat bench 4-5 sets. Then do 2-3 additional exercises 3-4 sets each and chase the pump fast paced higher reps 12-20 reps. There's probably 100 ways for it to work. The point is to push the muscle to a place it hasn't been before but not so much that you annilate the muscle to the point that it can't recover before the next bout.

Yes this. Or simply doing 2-3 bodyparts and perhaps 4 exercises each so 8-12 in total. With warm ups/pump sets moving up then 1-2 working set for each exercise. Many ways to go about high volume without burning out. So OP when guys go on about high volume they are not taking every set to 100% as it would be impossible. For long periods I have trained 90-180 mins and performed many sets but only approx 10-15 are to what I would call true failure. Although the way I see many train my pump sets are their failure sets so everything is relative.

God help us when Hongogrimes gets into drugs and starts posting drug threads

 

[Pericles]

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STiUyA6TfRY"]Is Training Volume Overrated for Building Muscle? - YouTube[/ame]

 

[jayl19]

Slightly off topic but do any of you guys follow James hollinghead? He’s gained 20+ lb of muscle in under a year and his volume is the lowest Iv ever seen

Leg day
Squats 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Leg press 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Adductors machine 1 drop set
Rdl 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Lying leg curl 1 drop set
Calf’s 2 sets

So on 4 sets on quads, 3 hams!!

He does this every 5 days, so Monday, Friday, tue, thur, etc

It’s hard to believe to be honest but he films his workouts for Jordan peters website

I want to try it but I just can’t mentally get my volume that low, would feel like I done nothing

 

[FK86]

Slightly off topic but do any of you guys follow James hollinghead? He’s gained 20+ lb of muscle in under a year and his volume is the lowest Iv ever seen. I want to try it but I just can’t mentally get my volume that low, would feel like I done nothing

I train on the DC two-way split and the volume is even lower than that. It's one exercise per body part and either three failure points on the rest-pause exercises or two failure points on the straight set exercises. If you take your working sets to true failure, which I define as getting stuck under the bar for 2-5 seconds and then powering up through sheer force of will, the last thing you'll think is whether you did enough. Numbers don't lie.

 

[IronLion2]

Slightly off topic but do any of you guys follow James hollinghead? He’s gained 20+ lb of muscle in under a year and his volume is the lowest Iv ever seen

Leg day
Squats 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Leg press 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Adductors machine 1 drop set
Rdl 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Lying leg curl 1 drop set
Calf’s 2 sets

So on 4 sets on quads, 3 hams!!

He does this every 5 days, so Monday, Friday, tue, thur, etc

It’s hard to believe to be honest but he films his workouts for Jordan peters website

I want to try it but I just can’t mentally get my volume that low, would feel like I done nothing

It's a mindset change and the first few weeks are kind of frustrating but once you learn to shut off your brain and stop 'limiting' what you think you can do, things start to blossom.

 

[Kaladryn]

Slightly off topic but do any of you guys follow James hollinghead? He’s gained 20+ lb of muscle in under a year and his volume is the lowest Iv ever seen

Leg day
Squats 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Leg press 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Adductors machine 1 drop set
Rdl 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Lying leg curl 1 drop set
Calf’s 2 sets

So on 4 sets on quads, 3 hams!!

He does this every 5 days, so Monday, Friday, tue, thur, etc

It’s hard to believe to be honest but he films his workouts for Jordan peters website

I want to try it but I just can’t mentally get my volume that low, would feel like I done nothing

If you did that workout, you wouldn't feel you did nothing, you would barely be able to walk out of the gym, it would be the hardest workout you had ever done.

THAT is how hard he is going on these sets, I've done less than that and been completely destroyed.

 

[Elvia1023]

Slightly off topic but do any of you guys follow James hollinghead? He’s gained 20+ lb of muscle in under a year and his volume is the lowest Iv ever seen

Leg day
Squats 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Leg press 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Adductors machine 1 drop set
Rdl 1 heavy set, 1 back off set
Lying leg curl 1 drop set
Calf’s 2 sets

So on 4 sets on quads, 3 hams!!

He does this every 5 days, so Monday, Friday, tue, thur, etc

It’s hard to believe to be honest but he films his workouts for Jordan peters website

I want to try it but I just can’t mentally get my volume that low, would feel like I done nothing

But he warms up on everything so it's all relative. I know his volume is not high but an extreme example some may do 5-10 working sets but about 40 in total counting all the warming up. He trains fairly quickly but it's not like he isn't going to do approx 5 warm up sets when he ends up squatting 6 plates per side.

Sometimes I may only do about 8 working sets which can be loads. Even 4 working sets if you take them to the max on compound movements will take it out of you. It's not so much the volume more the intensity. Even if your warm up sets a fairly low and it's approx 20 sets total the intensity is what counts. I personally like to warm up slowly at the start of a bodypart and once it's warmed up can go through things quickly. But I would never go from say lat pulldown to a row and add loads of weight for my 1st set. Even if warm up sets are approx 5 reps and quick I will go up 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 pps etc. Now I am doing more working sets and have upped the volume but try to warm up quick after my 1st exercise is done.