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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 11-28-2008, 10:04 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 35
HCG vs. HMG

Hey guys,

I've been searching and searching but I cannot find quality information of HMG. I have heard it is far supperior to HCG but I can't get a good idea of why or what an effective dose would be.
I was hoping to see if anyone could give some imput on dose, duration and any other reccommended uses.

Thank you
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 11-28-2008, 01:15 PM
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Posts: 2,735
What are you exactly trying to accomplish....is where we should start.....because it looks like your talking about PCT and we could be talking about pregnancy....so what is the goal?
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 11-28-2008, 01:26 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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Dante,

I'm glad you brought this up. My question is two-fold perhaps. What is the primary use of HMG and when, where and how is it used? I am not using for fertility, but have heard it helps with long term use of TRT.

Is HMG better than HCG to keep testes functioning during longer runs of anabolics? If so, what is the dose and duration. Example, I know HCG has been proven at doses of 500iu's 2-3 times per week while or cycle or even on some TRT plans.

I'm seeing more and more discussion about HMG and it's also becoming more easily available. I just want to learn as much as I can before using a product.


Thank you
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 11-28-2008, 03:26 PM
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I personally dont think HMG is gonna help you recover any more than HCG if thats the goal, but I know what you mean. Im on HRT as well and use 250iu hcg 2x per week to keep testes full and to hope it will help in case one day I want kids. If I could afford it, I would also add HMG to my protocol and use 75iu 2x per week. Then if the wife and I ever plan on having kids and we are not having success i would up the hmg to 75iu 3x per week and add some clomid. All this is just expeirementation though, its best to see a dr, but I personally belive in self medicating at first and if no results occur then see a dr. Only for situations like this though, no self medication for serious shit.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 08:34 AM
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no offense but if you're asking this question it leads me to believe you don't have a good grasp of the endocrine system. If you understand the hormones, their functions, etc. you could answer your own questions.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 09:52 AM
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I have consulted endo's and I have been approved as a candidate for TRT. I currently use HCG 2x a week @ 500iu's along with 75mg test cyp (also 2x per week) as well as .25mg arimidex (twice per week).

I am not self medicating. I am simply asking a very logical and professional question on how to use HMG and if it can be substituted for HCG, with any pros or cons. I would like to come off TRT at some point or at least keep my system going for when it is time to have children.

I could go off on how I dont agree with a third of the threads on this first page due to their lack of professionalism, but I don't. I respect everyone's opinion to ask questions and read posts.

I do have a good grasp on what I am being prescribed but I also have questions for other guys who are more knowledgable than my doctor. I don't slam people for drinking a gallon of milk per day and posting of their 20lbs of lean mass. If you can't answer my question, then don't post in it at all.

This is my reproductive system I am asking about. I want to make sure my doctor and I are making the best decisions possible.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 10:20 AM
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take a trip over to pubmed there might be some research over there that can help you find the answer your looking for. my thinking is that if the 2 chemicals produce the same effect even if its through different mechanisms you could change drugs as long as the desired outcome is the same. I would just make sure that if you do just let your doctor know. im not sure if there would be anything your doc would need to look out for with hmg that doesnt occour with hcg.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 10:22 AM
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Unless you have been "banned" you could go back over on Elite and ask Nelson Montana. He is a big supporter of HMG vs HCG. Maybe he has some answers for you. Not tryin to promote another board here...just trying to help a brotha get some answers.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 10:49 AM
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Still Unsure

Great question ! I have wondered the same thing myself.
So I am still unsure what is better for a person doing PCT ?
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 12:19 PM
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Thanks guys.

Marshall, I remember you from years ago on EF. I posted over there 4-5 years ago when there was some substance going around the threads. Now I would take almost everything that comes out of there with a grain of salt.

I like this board. Good bros here. That's why I wanted to ask this before consulting with the doc. I like to have my own ideas of what to ask and expect before I consult with him. Just because they are "doctors" doesn't mean they know everything about a certain subject.

I have no problem with HCG. It seems like it is working fine. But with family planning a few years down the road. I want to make sure I am doing my body justice and not completely hindering my family goals.
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 04:20 PM
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i've done hcg and hmg before. Goal was to get the wife prego. Had done a long extended cycle(3 yrs) with short breaks here and there. Went to a low dose of test for a couple weeks while taking the hcg 500iux3 days week for 3 weeks. Then i did the hmg 75x3 times a week for about 2 months along with clomid, nolva, and aromasin.
Did not lose many gains during this time and got used to being off...eventually. After about 3 months of going clean i stopped all meds and went and got sperm tested. count was 20mil(borderline low) and motility was low and so was morphology. Started the clomid again at 100mg ed. After 1 month went back and everything was normal and count was 40million. Wife got pregnant 2 months later.
6months prego now and everything is going well, just finished a 10week cycle and am 5 weeks post-cycle and using just low dose clomid and feel pretty good.

If you're young i would avoid TRT, i've researched and found that men that take maintenance amounts of test actually have harder times recovering and reproducing than those that took 500mg+. I'm in my 20's and that's why i decided to totally clean out. I still want another kid so i will stick to cycles less than 10 weeks with a couple months between. Good luck, i would suggest getting a sperm test so you know where your baseline is and then start experimenting a little bit.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JuicedAthletics View Post
I have consulted endo's and I have been approved as a candidate for TRT. I currently use HCG 2x a week @ 500iu's along with 75mg test cyp (also 2x per week) as well as .25mg arimidex (twice per week).

I could go off on how I dont agree with a third of the threads on this first page due to their lack of professionalism, but I don't. I respect everyone's opinion to ask questions and read posts.

I do have a good grasp on what I am being prescribed but I also have questions for other guys who are more knowledgable than my doctor. I don't slam people for drinking a gallon of milk per day and posting of their 20lbs of lean mass. If you can't answer my question, then don't post in it at all.

This is my reproductive system I am asking about. I want to make sure my doctor and I are making the best decisions possible.
So you are coming to the board because here, on promuscle, you think we have more knowledge than your endocrinologist? Interesting. I also didn't slam you. I personally would research HCG, FSH and what they are comprised of. I would then figure out how these drugs effect the human body.My process would be to think critically, research, apply, and make some conclusions. You will get a lot further figuring things out on your own. Good Luck.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 11-29-2008, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellicose View Post
i've done hcg and hmg before. Goal was to get the wife prego. Had done a long extended cycle(3 yrs) with short breaks here and there. Went to a low dose of test for a couple weeks while taking the hcg 500iux3 days week for 3 weeks. Then i did the hmg 75x3 times a week for about 2 months along with clomid, nolva, and aromasin.
Did not lose many gains during this time and got used to being off...eventually. After about 3 months of going clean i stopped all meds and went and got sperm tested. count was 20mil(borderline low) and motility was low and so was morphology. Started the clomid again at 100mg ed. After 1 month went back and everything was normal and count was 40million. Wife got pregnant 2 months later.
6months prego now and everything is going well, just finished a 10week cycle and am 5 weeks post-cycle and using just low dose clomid and feel pretty good.

If you're young i would avoid TRT, i've researched and found that men that take maintenance amounts of test actually have harder times recovering and reproducing than those that took 500mg+. I'm in my 20's and that's why i decided to totally clean out. I still want another kid so i will stick to cycles less than 10 weeks with a couple months between. Good luck, i would suggest getting a sperm test so you know where your baseline is and then start experimenting a little bit.

So were you completely off test when using the clomid when you had success? I ask b/c I wonder if you could still stay on the test but up the hmg and clomid while still on test and get the same results.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 11-30-2008, 09:03 AM
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If you did a search you would find your answer.


http://www.professionalmuscle.com/fo...archid=1052180


Here are some search results of threads with studies.

It appears neither is better. It appears best results would be to run HCG and HNG together for a few months then HCG then can maintain by itself.

As for infertility the studies show the Lowest dose of HCG being 1500 iu 3 x week combined with at least 75-150iu of HMG.

Other studies have same dosages, but run HCG by itself for a while then add the HMG.


If neither work FSH and Pulsatile GnRH are options also.

Last edited by dragonfire101; 11-30-2008 at 09:07 AM.
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