AmpK activates Myostatin

[Bamm]

I would hate to drop my ALA - it really helps keeping my liver healthy.
Maybe switch to NAC then?

 

[littlefoot]

I would hate to drop my ALA - it really helps keeping my liver healthy.
Maybe switch to NAC then?

Which form of ALA do you take? I'm curious because I've read (possibly bro-science) that the ALA (S&R Isomers) isn't very effective, and that a more stabilized form of R-ALA (such as NA-R-ALA or K-R-ALA) is a much better choice.

I would hate to give up my glycobol for the GDA purposes and the antioxidant purposes, but I will if that's what the data suggests.

I have used it on oral cycles before with success, but I can't compare that success to cycles without it.

 

[Bamm]

Which form of ALA do you take? I'm curious because I've read (possibly bro-science) that the ALA (S&R Isomers) isn't very effective, and that a more stabilized form of R-ALA (such as NA-R-ALA or K-R-ALA) is a much better choice.

I would hate to give up my glycobol for the GDA purposes and the antioxidant purposes, but I will if that's what the data suggests.

I have used it on oral cycles before with success, but I can't compare that success to cycles without it.

Just used ALA. The cheap kind. Been very effective agains raised liver values. Would hate to stop using it.

 

[warrenpeace]

Which form of ALA do you take? I'm curious because I've read (possibly bro-science) that the ALA (S&R Isomers) isn't very effective, and that a more stabilized form of R-ALA (such as NA-R-ALA or K-R-ALA) is a much better choice.

I would hate to give up my glycobol for the GDA purposes and the antioxidant purposes, but I will if that's what the data suggests.

I have used it on oral cycles before with success, but I can't compare that success to cycles without it.

You just need to take more ALA if you choose that version.

 

[warrenpeace]

Do these products work more effectively on a moderate carb diet or would one better achieve fat loss in ketosis? It seems to me carbs would be necessary at times, especially around workouts, otherwise performance / blood sugar levels would be compromised and muscle wasting may occur. Does that make sense?

 

[Mad Scientist]

I wouldn't worry too much about the fear of ALA increasing myostatin (via AMPK). The effect is likely mediocre at best, and in the grand scheme of muscle building probably won't slow you down at all. The possible benefits outweigh this risk.

Just remember, moderation is key. Take this as a reason not to go nuts on the ALA supps, not as a reason to stop taking it altogether.


And just to throw in as another thought, in a biological system, transient increases in certain pathways/molecules aren't always the same as chronic elevations. For all we know, the transient activation of AMPK by ALA might be good for muscle growth. Examples: reactive oxygen species increases from exercise signal the muscle to adapt to exercise, but chronic elevations in ROS are very bad. Parathyroid hormone normally serves to cause bone loss in the body (in order to elevate calcium in the blood), but when given intermittently, it is very bone anabolic (see teriparatide).

 

[Mad Scientist]

Something else to consider: tren also activates AMPK. Here's the link to the article that I got the data from:
Trenbolone enhances myogenic differen... [Domest Anim Endocrinol. 2011] - PubMed - NCBI.

 

[dannyd]

Something else to consider: tren also activates AMPK. Here's the link to the article that I got the data from:
Trenbolone enhances myogenic differen... [Domest Anim Endocrinol. 2011] - PubMed - NCBI.

so are you saying that tren works against us when trying to feast (bulk)?

 

[ryanbCXG]

Fully inactivated myostatin is not something that you really want. Sure your muscle will grow uncontrolably but they will be come very non functional to the poiint where you don't look right and cannot function normally. Some myostatin is needed.

Question.....even if your are taking compounds that antagonize AMPK weight lifting/eating will swing switch more towards mTOR than AMPK? So the elevation of AMPK will be transient and good since it will signal the body to use fat for fuel? Then you train and feast and mTOR is on and you grow

 

[Bamm]

Would be nice with some more info about how this affect gains. I mean it don't seams to affect teen gains! You grow the more tren is there!

 

[Mad Scientist]

so are you saying that tren works against us when trying to feast (bulk)?

Not in the least. All I'm saying is that the original article that was quoted as saying that AMPK activation increases myostatin should not concern anyone as far as making gains. Lots of things activate AMPK (as mentioned, ALA, tren, just to name a few), and if myostatin goes up a little bit as a result, no worries. Tren definitely won't "work against you" when trying to bulk.

 

[aphextwin]

I would hate to drop my ALA - it really helps keeping my liver healthy.
Maybe switch to NAC then?

I don't have any research to back this up, but from personal experience you will be just fine running ALA, while gaining muscle. I believe John Meadows uses ALA year round and he's not shrinking. However, I wouldn't recommend GW while bulking.

 

[thehazzle]

That's what I am suggesting, yes. I don't know that I'd even use a small dose of it. If you're going to try this for yourself, and I encourage everyone to do just that, then I think it would be best to use a ton of it during the fasting period and then completely eliminate it during a feasting period. The only exception might be Alpha Lipoic acid, since it's simply one of the best anti-oxidants I know of.

I will be expanding on this thread in a short while, where I will suggest using a different kind of insulin sensitizing agent, one which does not affect AmpK. I gotta dig into the research before I start running my mouth off though, so hold tight.

Hey disco did you have any further thoughts on this? I use a GDA pretty much year round and have kind of stalled in progress. What other insulin sensitisers would you recommend instead? Igf1-lr3 maybe?

 

[fstr03svtcobra]

I would have to see something pretty substantial to give up berberine hcl just for its overall health benefits.