Boldenone and hair

[TheRoid]

In more than 20 years of AAS use I ran some high dose EQ only cycles.
Every damn time, my scalp hair got thicker.
And in every other cycle, hair loss was much less if EQ was in te mix.
I recently found this paper:

Metabolism of boldenone in man: gas chromatographic/mass spectrometric identification of urinary excreted metabolites and determination of excretion rates​

W Schänzer 1, M Donike
Affiliations expand

• PMID: 1591280
• DOI: 10.1002/bms.1200210104

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AbstractPubMedPMID

Abstract​

Urinary metabolites of boldenone (androsta-1,4-dien-17 beta-ol-3-one) following oral administration of boldenone (doses from 11 to 80 mg) to man were isolated from urine via XAD-2 adsorption and enzymatic hydrolysis with beta-glucuronidase from Escherichia coli. The isolated metabolites were derivatized with N-methyl-N-trimethylsilyltri- fluoroacetamide/trimethyliodosilane and analysed by gas chromatography/mass spectrometry with electron impact (EI) ionization at 70 eV. Boldenone (I) and four metabolites were identified after hydrolysis of the urine with beta-glucuronidase: 5 beta-androst-1-en-17 beta-ol-3-one (II), 5 beta-androst-1-ene-3 alpha, 17 beta-diol (III), 5 beta-androst-1-en-3 alpha-ol-17-one (IV) and 5 beta-androst-1-en-6 beta-ol-3,17-dione (V). Five further metabolites in low concentration were identified without enzymatic hydrolysis after treatment of the urine with potassium carbonate: 5 beta-androst-1-ene-3,17-dione (VI), 5 alpha-androst-1-ene-3,17-dione (VII), androsta-1,4-diene-3,17-dione (VIII), androsta-1,4-diene-6 beta,17 beta-diol-3-one (IX) and androsta-1,4-dien-6 beta-ol-3,17-dione (X). The identification of the metabolites is based on the gas chromatography retention index, high-performance liquid chromatography retention, EI mass spectrum, chemical reactions of the isolated metabolites, and synthesis of metabolites II, III, IV, VI and VII. The EI mass spectra of the bis-trimethylsilyl derivatives of boldenone and its metabolites display all intense molecular ions, M-15 ions and fragment ions originating from cleavage of the B-ring. The excreted metabolites can be separated in basic extractable labile conjugates and in stable conjugates. More than 95% of metabolites are excreted as stable conjugates.


So, ON PAPER, the more androgenic metabolite 1-test formation Is possible
In periphetal tissues like the scalp from its prodrug 5α-androst-1-ene-3,17-dione, but that's only in very low concentrations as boldenone is a very poor substrate for 5alpha reductase.
The bulk of its metabolites in peripheral tissues are 5BETA metabolites, pretty much void of any androgenic activity, and boldenone itself Is much less androgenic than Testosterone. This might create and environment beneficial for hair growth or at least hair loss minimization.

Just food for thought.

 

[01dragonslayer]

Pretty interesting.

 

[climber]

Yeah, pretty interested in this

 

[fisther69]

Might add some to my prescribed trt

 

[aphextwin]

Might add some to my prescribed trt

Bad idea long term

 

[pickapeck]

These are urine glucuronides. I'm not sure how these would imply any hair sparing action other than possible stateing that the 1-ene seems to be excreted. So I geuss you could argue that the DHB is lost but you would have to do plasma analysis to see what amount of the 1-ene is present in the circulation to really know anything. DHB is thought to be a stronger version of DHT.

 

[broza]

interesting on paper. I've ran boldenone but I try and stay away from it because there is some evidence that it may be toxic to the kidneys and that notable increase, more so than other AAS, on red blood cell production can stress the heart. It can also tank your e2, which can be an issue.

 

[TheOtherOne55]

Super interesting. Its a weird one though. People either love it or hate it.

 

[Type-IIx]

Boldenone (and androsta-1,4-diene-3-ones as a class) is indeed 5β-reduced, but this does not mean that it follows that EQ is particularly hair friendly. It could be, but if its structure is indeed particularly hair friendly, then this attribute should be shared by Dbol as well.

Perhaps the assumption that 5α-reductase is associated with hair loss comes from T's 5α-reductase product -- DHT? Yet, consider that 5α-reductase also catalyzes the production of DHN from nandrolone (a weakened androgen).

 

[TheRoid]

Boldenone (and androsta-1,4-diene-3-ones as a class) is indeed 5β-reduced, but this does not mean that it follows that EQ is particularly hair friendly. It could be, but if its structure is indeed particularly hair friendly, then this attribute should be shared by Dbol as well.

Perhaps the assumption that 5α-reductase is associated with hair loss comes from T's 5α-reductase product -- DHT? Yet, consider that 5α-reductase also catalyzes the production of DHN from nandrolone (a weakened androgen).

And just like nandrolone produces a weaker metabolite via 5alpha reduction, boldenone generates weaker metabolites via 5beta reduction (EQ's 5alpha reduction seems to be negligible)

 

[Type-IIx]

And just like nandrolone produces a weaker metabolite via 5alpha reduction, boldenone generates weaker metabolites via 5beta reduction (EQ's 5alpha reduction seems to be negligible)

It's true that EQ's 5β-reduced metabolites are likely relatively hair friendly, but we must also look at the parent compound. I think generally this class is likely to be relatively hair friendly when the parent compound is itself not particularly androgenic: case in point, oral turinabol. It both predominantly via A ring phase I metabolism catalyzes reduction of the C-4,5 double bond via 5β-reductase and the parent compound is of reduced andogenicity. Shit, the East Germans were practically using harm reduction in giving their women OT.

Of note in the metabolism of EQ is that its principal metabolite is itself a 17beta-conjugate that would be worthy of some modeling at least with SwissADME and a few free tools to really get an idea of its activity.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

I love EQ but it doesn't love me back. My BP, RBCs, HCT, Hgb go off the charts high when I use it. Same with Anadrol which I can also no longer handle well. Neither affected my hairline. Nandrolones and trenbolone do. But I probably have a kg of har on my head so it was never an issue.

 

[TheRoid]

I love EQ but it doesn't love me back. My BP, RBCs, HCT, Hgb go off the charts high when I use it. Same with Anadrol which I can also no longer handle well. Neither affected my hairline. Nandrolones and trenbolone do. But I probably have a kg of har on my head so it was never an issue.

Anadrol is another weird one IME.
Never lost a hair with It.

 

[Type-IIx]

I love EQ but it doesn't love me back. My BP, RBCs, HCT, Hgb go off the charts high when I use it. Same with Anadrol which I can also no longer handle well. Neither affected my hairline. Nandrolones and trenbolone do. But I probably have a kg of har on my head so it was never an issue.

How does nandrolone treat you in regard to erythrocytosis (effects on the RBCs, HCT, Hb)? Did you take all of them (EQ, Anadrol, nandrolone) under relatively the same conditions (i.e., age)?

The reason I ask is I've seen evidence that nandrolone > oxymetholone (Anadrol) > testosterone (propionate > cypionate > enanthate) as hematinic agents (Fe incorporation, reticulocyte count), i.e., as they directly augment erythropoiesis.

There is a paper I've been trying to get a hold of, but nobody, including Peter Bond, seem able to find it:
Molinari PF, Rosenkrantz H. Erythropoietic activity and androgenic implications of 29 testosterone derivatives in orchiectomized rats. J Lab Clin Med. 1971 Sep;78(3):399-410. PMID: 5092861.

I'm hoping that it analyzes EQ. If anyone can find this paper, I'd be very appreciative.

 

[OuchThatHurts]

How does nandrolone treat you in regard to erythrocytosis (effects on the RBCs, HCT, Hb)? Did you take all of them (EQ, Anadrol, nandrolone) under relatively the same conditions (i.e., age)?

The reason I ask is I've seen evidence that nandrolone > oxymetholone (Anadrol) > testosterone (propionate > cypionate > enanthate) as hematinic agents (Fe incorporation, reticulocyte count), i.e., as they directly augment erythropoiesis.

There is a paper I've been trying to get a hold of, but nobody, including Peter Bond, seem able to find it:
Molinari PF, Rosenkrantz H. Erythropoietic activity and androgenic implications of 29 testosterone derivatives in orchiectomized rats. J Lab Clin Med. 1971 Sep;78(3):399-410. PMID: 5092861.

I'm hoping that it analyzes EQ. If anyone can find this paper, I'd be very appreciative.

I did them all in my 30's. Increased erythrocytosis occurs with all AAS but when I could handle EQ without quite such unhealthy conditions as now, I would use it to avoid nandrolones because they gave me bacne. Testosterone has put more mass on me than any of the analogues with the exception of trenbolone. But of those analogues (and taking tren out of the equation), I would say nandrolone was definitely more anabolic and androgenic for me than boldenone or oxymetholone.

I have actually considered that it may be the increased erythrocytosis of EQ (and Anadrol) that actually causes the mass gain through increased reps, strength, and pumps (facia stretching) and increased oxygen uptake via increased blood mass rather than the anabolic or androgenic activity which is still present but not near nandrolone. At least for me.

 

[Cabron]

I love EQ but it doesn't love me back. My BP, RBCs, HCT, Hgb go off the charts high when I use it. Same with Anadrol which I can also no longer handle well. Neither affected my hairline. Nandrolones and trenbolone do. But I probably have a kg of har on my head so it was never an issue.

are you on any BP meds?

 

[Love_to_Bodybuild]

I've seemed to lose hair on eq before. I used a bunk batch of ru58841 ,which pure ru5884 seems to keep my hair on some of the lesser androgenic compounds like EQ and deca

 

[fisther69]

Bad idea long term

Just 16-18 weeks..normal EQ length for me..I won’t run EQ under 14 weeks

 

[TheRoid]

I did them all in my 30's. Increased erythrocytosis occurs with all AAS but when I could handle EQ without quite such unhealthy conditions as now, I would use it to avoid nandrolones because they gave me bacne. Testosterone has put more mass on me than any of the analogues with the exception of trenbolone. But of those analogues (and taking tren out of the equation), I would say nandrolone was definitely more anabolic and androgenic for me than boldenone or oxymetholone.

I have actually considered that it may be the increased erythrocytosis of EQ (and Anadrol) that actually causes the mass gain through increased reps, strength, and pumps (facia stretching) and increased oxygen uptake via increased blood mass rather than the anabolic or androgenic activity which is still present but not near nandrolone. At least for me.

You always had and still have a full head of hair, right?
How did you gauge their specific effect on hair loss if there was no apparent thinning in the mirror? Hair catcher in the sink?

 

[OuchThatHurts]

You always had and still have a full head of hair, right?
How did you gauge their specific effect on hair loss if there was no apparent thinning in the mirror? Hair catcher in the sink?

It's definitely noticable simply by the amount of hair clinging to my hands and covering the drain in the shower after I rinse my hair every day. I've just assumed based on my PSA numbers and lack of BPH and MPB that either a) I do not create high levels of DHT from testosterone or b) that I do have high levels of DHT but am genetically resistant to the secondary effects of DHT. The former seems more likely as I've taken very large amounts of T for extended periods with very little adverse side effects. Then again, it could also be a combination of both. I'm certainly no genetic marvel. So who knows.

But yes, certain analogues cause me to lose more hair than others - nandrolones and tren specifically. Is the amount a balding amount? Nah. The others like Turinabol, Masteron, Anavar, Proviron, etc I've never taken for long enough periods of time to notice any higher than normal hair loss. But I've never taken the 5 or 6 different compounds at once which works for a lot of guys. Just not how I roll.