Phil Heath “over 10g of oils in a week”

[Fit2Serve]

"don't be an asshole... take your blood pressure meds" - Justin Harris

holy face bloat

 

[Fit2Serve]

i dont believe very many (if any) guys are banging 10gms of gear.
at my peak of competing and i was at highest dose i wasnt even to 5gms and i was kinda maxed out w the injections.
one of my best friends and who i did drug protocols for is an IFBB pro. i know EXACTLY what he was taking to become pro and what he takes now. Its not near 10gms lol he would laugh at you. i can hear him saying "if u need that much u should quit right now"
he also said pros do chat about what they use. just not very specific terms.

 

[IntenseVolume]

I watch your tone around here. These threads are useless. You can take 3 different pros and one can take 2 grams, one can take 5 grams and one can take 10 grams to get to the same level. So, your point is mute. THERE IS NO CONSISTENCY. To think Phil's amounts for some upcoming kid to achieve what he did, is ridiculous.

Addressing everyone else, who cares what Phil Heath takes, no one will do what he did in bodybuilding.

Hey, but I am sure we will see some new thread on the EXACT same thing at least a dozen times more.

I gave the same tone i received.
I didn’t say anything about some kid taking Phil’s doses. I said it would open a kids eyes to what even the genetic elite really take. My point was it would probably be a deterrent a lesson.

I agree with you 100%.

 

[Eguz22]

But stand them next to each other with clothes off, and at least on video, Ramy doesn't really look much bigger, or at all really better.

Ohh, come on man, Ramy has made all the open BB's look like babies next to him.

A good example would be Clarida, he does look a lot bigger when he stands on stage.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

I worked with Matt for about 2 1/2 years and for me didn't push the dosages too crazy. Nothing beyond what other coaches I have worked with recommended. I think it really depends on what year(s) you talked to him as far as his dosages. He definitely pushed higher in the earlier years.

After his dad died when he got back home he and Rachel were trying to have a baby so he stayed off. He started training again but he weight never dropped below like 218-220. The muscle had just been there too long. The after Rachel got pregnant he added some gear back in but it was very minimal so 500 Test and 200 Deca wouldn't surprise me. Although those were NOT the dosages that got him to a lean 265. He and I were pretty close during this time because we still would chat about business and such and I would see him when I'd be in Vegas. So essentially I trust what he would share with me.




I still chat with Rachel every so often but she has never shared. I believe it was something related to a "spot" on his lung. I speculate that it was a pulmonary embolism. I don't know the medical details of how that would work but if the clot got to the heart it could be an instant MI.

As far his health at the time, he was very health conscious. As said above, his BB dosages were dropped way down and he was basically doing TRT + or BB TRT or whatever you want to call it. Working with him, we were doing labs every 4-8 weeks and he was into using natural supplements for health purposes. My time with Matt was before Telmisartan became popular and low dose Cialis, micro dosing Statins, etc. I'm sure he would have been all into that if he hadn't passed.

I absolutely 100% agree with everything you have said here. Matt was driven when he was younger and got to a couple plateaus and wanted to get past them and he pushed the envelope in his younger years to go past those plateaus...no doubt about it and he admitted to such. When his dad had prostate cancer and was dying Matt went into heart failure and was in a very bad position in that time frame, so he had already somewhat damaged himself pretty badly prior to his dads death. He had a real "awakening moment" when his father died and it took a huge toll on him stress wise and "what am i doing" wise. Just as you said above those dosages and virtually every detail you said above is what he told me also. Rachel decided not to get the autopsy but i was also told about a scan previous and a rather distinctive spot in his lungs that needed to be explained. Matt and I texted back and forth or online pmed back and forth a lot the last 3 years before he died. He was on the couch looking at his phone and rachel was nearby and he said "Rachel!!!" and he knew something was definitively wrong at that moment.....and he collapsed and floor/resuscitation attempts the whole nine yards was done. Ive told rachel this previously and you are also spot on, everything screams pulmonary embolism (and with his prior weakened heart) probably not much of a fighting chance. 10% of lung pulmonary embolism sufferers die suddenly and the death rate (sudden or non sudden) can be up to 30%. The spot on the scan pretty much tells the story for me.

 

[BigNJ]

I just want to know a couple questions of you and others on this board. There have been guys on this board who have blasted to the high heavens, 2005, 2010, 2015, 2020 and even today. Just bombing away with juice gh insulin. Why dont you or they look like this below? WHY? Why does that 7 inch wrist go into a 22.5 inch arm and everything is so monstrous? But not yours? It seems like its a simple equation of just have the balls to use enough juice gh insulin and it will happen. A long time ago a guy very respected guy came into this forum who was helping this cat compete his first couple shows....it went from nothing (cleaned house onstage) in his first two shows or something like that where he took light heavy and overall in his state show and then in his second year of competing he went to something like 400mg deca if i remember right (cleaned house again) and won overall as heavyweight in his state show. And then won junior nats on (cant remember exactly) but i want to say 2 compounds used that wasnt far removed from the 400mg deca usage and then won same years USA champs on virtually the same. I want to know why none of you guys have done that even juicing to the freaking gills?! Tell me why? And then with higher doses and vitamin G he transformed into a super freak and then went on an Olympia run. He won his first pro show THREE YEARS AFTER FIRST COMPETING!!! Three years!! How come none of you guys have done that? Did you guys jack 3 grams of test and 20 ius of gh and 1000mg of tren in your first few years of bbing and competing? I dont know anyone who does/did...so why do you think Phil Heath did?

I dont know phil heath and im not advocating for him. A lot of people that i have met thru the years dont particularly think highly of the guy....so thats where I stand. But damn could it be as simple as this guys genetic makeup allowed him to use EXACTLY what you did and most people do the first few years and he just explodes because he is a genetic marvel? I dont care what your juicing dosages are NOBODY wins pro shows 3 years after starting....so obviously there is a genetic component to all this that allows this dude to take what everyone else does and make them look like shit physically and make them feel like shit mentally (threads like this one).

The 10 grams of oil guy.....that guy is known....some of you guys know who it is...i dont want to talk about it either. Does phil downplay his later olympia usage...probably...but cmon if you think this guy as a beginner newbie was jacking 7 grams total plus a week and 20 plus ius of gh....cmon....nobody does that.

And to this day with every single great bber who has been on this board and with the guys who have injected the turkey baster with no regard for living dying or whatever....nobody still has looked like this below. I want the people that think its all about juice to tell me why nobody has gotten remotely close to this on this board in proportions with some of the grams amounts we have seen over the years on here.

So it's either you are genetically gifted and you can grow on little gear or nothing at all? What about people who are not genetically gifted? You're going to need to push the gear eventually to keep gaining. Not everyone will be or want to be a pro bodybuilder. Not everyone who has crossed the 250lbs plus lean is genetically gifted either. I have a lot of respect for you Dante, but some people do need to push the gear to get where they want to be.
Long ago in the early 2000s a close friend of mine was doing 4grams plus of gear per week and he was lean 280ish. He said he tried to get to that weight with lower dosage but he couldn't. everyone is different I suppose, very few will build amazing and massive bodies on moderate juice, but the majority will need to push the envelope to get there.

Either way, no one is going to get to 280 plus on 750 test and 250 deca. Not to mention the different body types. You can have a mesomorph who is already above 220 natural and then you will have an ectomorph who's 160. That ectomorph is going to have to push the gear over the years to keep on gaining. Yes nutrition is a big factor as well, you can feed yourself to death but without the gear, you will get so far.

 

[bbxtreme]

So it's either you are genetically gifted and you can grow on little gear or nothing at all? What about people who are not genetically gifted? You're going to need to push the gear eventually to keep gaining. Not everyone will be or want to be a pro bodybuilder. Not everyone who has crossed the 250lbs plus lean is genetically gifted either. I have a lot of respect for you Dante, but some people do need to push the gear to get where they want to be.
Long ago in the early 2000s a close friend of mine was doing 4grams plus of gear per week and he was lean 280ish. He said he tried to get to that weight with lower dosage but he couldn't. everyone is different I suppose, very few will build amazing and massive bodies on moderate juice, but the majority will need to push the envelope to get there.

Either way, no one is going to get to 280 plus on 750 test and 250 deca. Not to mention the different body types. You can have a mesomorph who is already above 220 natural and then you will have an ectomorph who's 160. That ectomorph is going to have to push the gear over the years to keep on gaining. Yes nutrition is a big factor as well, you can feed yourself to death but without the gear, you will get so far.

Jay Cutler said it best- “bodybuilding is about maximizing my body’s genetics.”

That will be different for everyone. Phil Heath to Joe Blow.

There will be 10 more damn threads about this in the weeks ahead I’m sure as Phil is hitting PR hard with his movie coming out.

At the end of the day- who cares… you’re never going to be Phil and he’s never going to be you.

Just my generalized opinion on the subject. Not fully directed at you.

 

[Biggerp73]

Ohh, come on man, Ramy has made all the open BB's look like babies next to him.

A good example would be Clarida, he does look a lot bigger when he stands on stage.

 

[b-boy]

Don't really give a fuck what Phil Heath or any other pro takes....all I know is this
I competed at the 2005 Jr nationals with Phil Heath and seen that fucker backstage and looked at his arms and was like WTF!! LOL I was sitting on a bench beside him and put my arm next to his (I had decent size arms back then) he looked over at me and put his arm up next to mine and flexed! Man that shit was crazy, his whole physique had these round bubbly muscles everywhere and the kicker is as crazy as he looked then he wasn't even on the same planet of the later on version of Phil that won the Olympia. So back in 2005 if someone asked my what I thought Phil Heath was running gear wise I would honestly answer not much in my opinion, not much at all. He just fucking mutated years later and became the king of bodybuilding at that time.

 

[aHarness]

Maybe this is a mid Atlantic thing, but cycle size is often determined by Financials, not any thought out drug philosophy.

Are you saying now, or in the past?

 

[275bills]

Don't really give a fuck what Phil Heath or any other pro takes....all I know is this
I competed at the 2005 Jr nationals with Phil Heath and seen that fucker backstage and looked at his arms and was like WTF!! LOL I was sitting on a bench beside him and put my arm next to his (I had decent size arms back then) he looked over at me and put his arm up next to mine and flexed! Man that shit was crazy, his whole physique had these round bubbly muscles everywhere and the kicker is as crazy as he looked then he wasn't even on the same planet of the later on version of Phil that won the Olympia. So back in 2005 if someone asked my what I thought Phil Heath was running gear wise I would honestly answer not much in my opinion, not much at all. He just fucking mutated years later and became the king of bodybuilding at that time.

And this is how I felt next to paulo and why I still have a day job

 

[Fa Seeshus]

Are you saying now, or in the past?

2000's Era.

We had some pros not the most disciplined with spending.

 

[DOGGCRAPP]

So it's either you are genetically gifted and you can grow on little gear or nothing at all? What about people who are not genetically gifted? You're going to need to push the gear eventually to keep gaining. Not everyone will be or want to be a pro bodybuilder. Not everyone who has crossed the 250lbs plus lean is genetically gifted either. I have a lot of respect for you Dante, but some people do need to push the gear to get where they want to be.
Long ago in the early 2000s a close friend of mine was doing 4grams plus of gear per week and he was lean 280ish. He said he tried to get to that weight with lower dosage but he couldn't. everyone is different I suppose, very few will build amazing and massive bodies on moderate juice, but the majority will need to push the envelope to get there.

Either way, no one is going to get to 280 plus on 750 test and 250 deca. Not to mention the different body types. You can have a mesomorph who is already above 220 natural and then you will have an ectomorph who's 160. That ectomorph is going to have to push the gear over the years to keep on gaining. Yes nutrition is a big factor as well, you can feed yourself to death but without the gear, you will get so far.

I dont understand where i said differently? I was just talking about Phil Heath. Whatever someone wants to do with their own personal journey is up to them. My post wasnt about "everyone can use low dosages" at all. The common thought in bodybuilding is "that guys bigger and better than me and my ego cannot take it and my mind cant contemplate it so he must be using everything and the kitchen sink"....maybe he is or maybe he isnt but when a guy is winning pro shows 3 years after he has started...obviously he is a human anomaly. If someone wants to crush grams of juice to catch the genetic elite that is their choice to do so. I find it weird that so many people go right to the "well he is using boatloads more than me" anytime a bodybuilder is bigger or better than themselves. Here I will go first: "I could take 5x as much gear as phil heath, Ronnie Coleman, Paul Dillett or Ramy at his best and I would not compare." It just is what it is. My arm would never come down like Phils in a most muscular and look that insanely crazy.... but back to your point. If a guy wants to bomb away to try to get as close as he can to the genetic elite...thats his choice to do so. I've never understood peoples reasoning of the risk to benefit ratio but again it comes down to personal choice.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Don't really give a fuck what Phil Heath or any other pro takes....all I know is this
I competed at the 2005 Jr nationals with Phil Heath and seen that fucker backstage and looked at his arms and was like WTF!! LOL I was sitting on a bench beside him and put my arm next to his (I had decent size arms back then) he looked over at me and put his arm up next to mine and flexed! Man that shit was crazy, his whole physique had these round bubbly muscles everywhere and the kicker is as crazy as he looked then he wasn't even on the same planet of the later on version of Phil that won the Olympia. So back in 2005 if someone asked my what I thought Phil Heath was running gear wise I would honestly answer not much in my opinion, not much at all. He just fucking mutated years later and became the king of bodybuilding at that time.

Yea, Chris Perticari was in that same contest and did well, but he mentioned that Phil was from another planet. Chris had some really good genetics, and for him and some others he was with at the time (and others like yourself) to say that, holds a lot of weight.

 

[AlexDavis43]

guys now start out at 3g of test and go from there...

Who is starting out at 3g of test??

 

[aHarness]

Who is starting out at 3g of test??

No one

 

[specter]

So it's either you are genetically gifted and you can grow on little gear or nothing at all? What about people who are not genetically gifted? You're going to need to push the gear eventually to keep gaining. Not everyone will be or want to be a pro bodybuilder. Not everyone who has crossed the 250lbs plus lean is genetically gifted either. I have a lot of respect for you Dante, but some people do need to push the gear to get where they want to be.
Long ago in the early 2000s a close friend of mine was doing 4grams plus of gear per week and he was lean 280ish. He said he tried to get to that weight with lower dosage but he couldn't. everyone is different I suppose, very few will build amazing and massive bodies on moderate juice, but the majority will need to push the envelope to get there.

Either way, no one is going to get to 280 plus on 750 test and 250 deca. Not to mention the different body types. You can have a mesomorph who is already above 220 natural and then you will have an ectomorph who's 160. That ectomorph is going to have to push the gear over the years to keep on gaining. Yes nutrition is a big factor as well, you can feed yourself to death but without the gear, you will get so far.

There was a short study done very small sample etc and im damned i cant find it anymore but the result was as follows..
a small portion of young men was shot with 500mg test e and a blood test was done 14 days after the shot.. the test levels in the young men was from 1500 to 3000 this shows us that there is a wide range of how we react to roids imo.

 

[Massive G]

Recent interview with Phil Heath that was actually a real good watch start to finish

Around the 50 minute mark or so talking about gear he mentions people he was around using over 10g of gear per week which isn’t a huge surprise in general but to hear someone at the top be that open about it is interesting

He's probably talking about Kai. Back when Kai was winning shows it was rumored he was taking insane amounts of AAS in grams.

 

[Massive G]

Does not surprise me one bit. I’ve met Jay and Ronnie many times- both are so humble and good guys. I have hung with Derek a few times at shows- he tries really hard too and is ALWAYS filming.

As well know many former top pro’s. But I can honestly say that Phil is in a class of his own… in terms of arrogance. I met him once and it was not like meeting Jay or Ronnie. Dude borders the line of confidence and arrogance IMO.

But this is bodybuilding- the most self absorbed and selfish sport on this planet.

Shawn Ray was the Phil Heath of the 80s and 90s. One of my early mentors promoted a lot of contests on the east coast and he had a lot of top pros booked for guest postings. He had a lot of BB clothing shops and one day I was in there and he asked me to watch the shop while he went out to get some food. I go to sit down and he had a page from. Muscle and Fitness with a Full picture of Shawn Ray doing seated rows taped th his stool with KISS MY ASS Shawn! written in big bold black letters. LOL. He told me Shawn was the most difficult pro to book with what we now call DIVA requests. Both Shawn and Phil were annotated way before they were top pros and I always felt they thought they were owed everything before accomplishing what other pros has achieved.

 

[b-boy]

Yea, Chris Perticari was in that same contest and did well, but he mentioned that Phil was from another planet. Chris had some really good genetics, and for him and some others he was with at the time (and others like yourself) to say that, holds a lot of weight.

Chris was coached by Justin Harris also (as was I) he got 2nd place to Phil in the heavyweight class, he had some huge legs.
SUPER nice guy.