LBA's

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

Therefore looking back Phil, although you won ( which may make it difficult to answer ) and knowing what you do now, would you of also had eaten food meals too??

Oh yes

 

[homonunculus]

You are good at research I believe......its easy to find...........you found one on gelatin.

Actually, that was just a wikipedia article. I haven't found any studies in medline such as what you seem be be suggesting exist. I figured since you were asking if someone had read the most recent studies that you had done so yourself.

Do you have citations for such and have you read studies supporting the use of LBA's (or their protein component) clinically?...

Processing......can you ask the processor.....I own a gym, I compete........I think you can find a more qualified person to ask.

Will do.

No. I haven't seen a reason to (this is just me), as of yet. Why....not competing anymore?

No, not at all. I can buy higher quality proteins at a cheaper price and combine them with glycerol and have, what I consider to be a higher quality protein source, in and of itself. (See below.)

ask Dante please.

Will do.

-What percentage of you protein was from LBA's back then when you won the USA's (and how many grams of protein from LBA's)? What percentage of your current protein intake is from LBA's?... 100% then.......50% now.-

I think you mean here that 100% of your non-food protein was in the form of an LBA supplement back when you prepped to win the USA's(?). Do you recall what percentage of your total protein intake was from LBA's and what your total protein intake was during that time?...

Do you know if the LBA's from then (when you won the USA's) are produced in the same way now (e.g., what sells on trueprotein's site?...)? I.e., are the protein sources and methods of hydrolysis / preparation the same?... Are the LBA's from then the same as those of today?...According to DAnte and according to my results yes, most definately.

OK - cool. Sounds like I might not have to check with Dante about processing, etc.

Randy.....I am baffled as to why you would not experiment with these on yourself.....honestly I would think you of all people would be curious after seeing such great real world results...but again, you have no reason to and I accept that answer......to me its just a little odd..........science is about experimenting

Indeed. I my experience, a good experiment is based upon a well-justified hypothesis, which is grounded in the scientific evidence (the current a state of the pertinent literature) preceding the formation of said hypothesis.

I haven't been able to formulate a reason LBA's, a sweetened mixture of glycerol and the protein source of LBA's (which I have thought to this point to be essentially equivalent to gelatin, an incomplete protein) would have a physiological advantage over say mixing a high quality whey protein isolate with glycerol in stimulating a positive protein balance. In other words, as a scientist as well as a consumer, I don't see a strong justification to perform such a study (at least as of yet).

If the only difference is the protein source, I'd rather go for buying a WPI at say $10 for 454 grams (a pound) and mix in glycerol at say $30 / gallon ($40 total) than spend $100 for a gallon of LBA's (with only 160 grams of protein).

A better experiment in my mind might be to evaluate the effect of three supplements against a kind :
***A standard diet for all groups containing a mixture of animal and vegetable proteins as, say 50% of dietary protein.

GROUP 1: Glycerol alone, with food protein mixture (from the same sources as the background diet for all groups) to make up the rest of the diet.

GROUP 2: LBA's to make up the rest of the of dietary protein (50%).

GROUP 3: Glycerol mixed with WPI to match Group 2.

GROUP 4 - PSEUDO-PLACEBO: Glycerol like sweetened substance, with equivalent food protein to that in other group (from the same sources as the background diet for all groups). Essentially Group 1 without the glycerol.

I think there is most certainly a convenience factor associated with LBA's for some folks and they're useful in this regard. Additionally, the notion that many folks have used the LBA's with success creates a placebo effect, which is in and of itself extremely powerful.

-S

 

[T TOTAL]

Quote:
-What percentage of you protein was from LBA's back then when you won the USA's (and how many grams of protein from LBA's)? What percentage of your current protein intake is from LBA's?... 100% then.......50% now.-

I think you mean here that 100% of your non-food protein was in the form of an LBA supplement back when you prepped to win the USA's(?). Do you recall what percentage of your total protein intake was from LBA's and what your total protein intake was during that time?...


I think Phil was saying, back when he prepped for his USA win he used LBA'S only for his protein source. Whereas now he uses both food and LBA'S.

I presume this as further back i asked him if what he knows now would he of added food to his USA prep as opposed to just LBA's and he said he would of.

I can't see why your so resistent to try them and find the answers for yourself as opposed to interpreting other findings to suit your belief.

On a side note i assume as a bodybuilder that you yake a variet of supplement......Do you only take them because clinical studies show you should??

Just about every person i know takes a whey protein supplement of some kind and it isn't because their going to gain a load of weight doing so. Its because its a supplement that can benefit them. Aren't LBA's the same, some may benefit greatly and some may not.

You can't always rely on clinical studies to be the reason to use or indeed not to use a supplement. After all don't some studies show that steroids don't or shouldn't work? Don't some people benefit from GH and some don't?

What im basically saying is isnt it atleast worth trying??

 

[PHIL HERNON]

GOOD POINTS

I think its great....use what you wish.....I know what I did and do....I have used all powders............all foods.............glycerine by itself...........glycerine with whey....glyucerine with milk.......I know how I got to 250 lean at 5-7 while being 135 as a freshman in High School. I know what I use and I know what my clients use......thst is really all I can tell you.........we can postulate all day long while time passes us by but until you try these for yourself I really think you are missing a huge factor in your equation.....but I would contact Dante and maybe speak to members who have seen similar results from the LBAs......I really do not know what else to say

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Yes

Quote:
-What percentage of you protein was from LBA's back then when you won the USA's (and how many grams of protein from LBA's)? What percentage of your current protein intake is from LBA's?... 100% then.......50% now.-

I think you mean here that 100% of your non-food protein was in the form of an LBA supplement back when you prepped to win the USA's(?). Do you recall what percentage of your total protein intake was from LBA's and what your total protein intake was during that time?...


I think Phil was saying, back when he prepped for his USA win he used LBA'S only for his protein source. Whereas now he uses both food and LBA'S.

I presume this as further back i asked him if what he knows now would he of added food to his USA prep as opposed to just LBA's and he said he would of.

I can't see why your so resistent to try them and find the answers for yourself as opposed to interpreting other findings to suit your belief.

On a side note i assume as a bodybuilder that you yake a variet of supplement......Do you only take them because clinical studies show you should??

Just about every person i know takes a whey protein supplement of some kind and it isn't because their going to gain a load of weight doing so. Its because its a supplement that can benefit them. Aren't LBA's the same, some may benefit greatly and some may not.

You can't always rely on clinical studies to be the reason to use or indeed not to use a supplement. After all don't some studies show that steroids don't or shouldn't work? Don't some people benefit from GH and some don't?

What im basically saying is isnt it atleast worth trying??

I agree..........and it is also what TKAV was saying.....its just common sense.....as far as clinical studies go, would a hospital burn unit using LBAs exclusively be a good example? I will have a member come on here who works in such a unit and tell his story........for anyone interested. Other than that........hey, use what you feel works.

 

[7_Deadly_Sins]

Just try LBAs for yourself, it's a complete protein source, taste fucking awsome and gives unreal results.
And, why is it always the people who dont use them are the first ones to say they dont work?
I was 195, I finaly got on them, and I'm now 178, I'm bigger, stronger, and look all around better while on these. Not to mention the 1000 veins that pop up out of now where.
If you doubt them, so much, please dont use them then, I'll buy them up.

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Well

Just try LBAs for yourself, it's a complete protein source, taste fucking awsome and gives unreal results.
And, why is it always the people who dont use them are the first ones to say they dont work?
I was 195, I finaly got on them, and I'm now 178, I'm bigger, stronger, and look all around better while on these. Not to mention the 1000 veins that pop up out of now where.
If you doubt them, so much, please dont use them then, I'll buy them up.

Yes, you my friend are doing great!! Trust yourself.....use what works......no way to save the world.....this is a taste of what I go through on a daily basis.......hahahahah

You know, not to sound like a dick but.........these guys tell me what they would do in place of the LBAs.........well, I do not want to look like you do so why would I do what you do? IF I wanted to look anything remotely similar like they do I would ask them and I for sure would folow their advice..........not post up various scenarios about what could possibly be an explanation as to why......

 

[Ali]

Veins popping??

Just try LBAs for yourself, it's a complete protein source, taste fucking awsome and gives unreal results.
And, why is it always the people who dont use them are the first ones to say they dont work?
I was 195, I finaly got on them, and I'm now 178, I'm bigger, stronger, and look all around better while on these. Not to mention the 1000 veins that pop up out of now where.
If you doubt them, so much, please dont use them then, I'll buy them up.

VEINS POPPING OUT? Now i'm jealous....Phil where are my viens..i need to get lean!!

 

[PHIL HERNON]

Hey!!

VEINS POPPING OUT? Now i'm jealous....Phil where are my viens..i need to get lean!!

You are lean!! You look great............veins do not mean much........they are not muscle tissue........they do not mean you are leaner.

 

[homonunculus]

I think its great....use what you wish.....I know what I did and do....I have used all powders............all foods.............glycerine by itself...........glycerine with whey....glyucerine with milk.......I know how I got to 250 lean at 5-7 while being 135 as a freshman in High School. I know what I use and I know what my clients use......thst is really all I can tell you.........we can postulate all day long while time passes us by but until you try these for yourself I really think you are missing a huge factor in your equation.....but I would contact Dante and maybe speak to members who have seen similar results from the LBAs......I really do not know what else to say

No worries, Phil. Thanks for your input.

If you would like to put up any of those studies you indirectly mentioned, I'd love to take a look at them personally.

Also, I'm still interested in knowing your total protein intake and % protein from LBA's when you prepped for the the USA's and got your card.

-Scott

 

[ScottMcD1]

Hey Scott, Phil has said in the past that he only used LBAs(in milk?), some vegetables, rice and fruit for his prep. So I guess... near 100% haha.

 

[Ali]

You are lean!! You look great............veins do not mean much........they are not muscle tissue........they do not mean you are leaner.

Thanks Phil. I still have some fat to shed but i appreicate the compliment. I will be shooting you some new pics this friday and tell me what you think.

Time for some Banana LBA in Fatfree milk and OO

 

[PHIL HERNON]

USA

For the USA I ate LBA....MCT....Broccoli......diet soda........1/2 cup rice...I cant give you a %........buy I think you can deduce from this that it was @ 90%?

 

[shawnkarbabacz]

For the USA I ate LBA....MCT....Broccoli......diet soda........1/2 cup rice...I cant give you a %........buy I think you can deduce from this that it was @ 90%?

wow....now that sounds like a rough diet

 

[PHIL HERNON]

One I just found

Special Dietary Uses – Gelatin in hydrolyzed form is used to protein fortify dietary foods. Dried, hydrolyzed gelatin contains over 92% protein. Typically it is blended with other hydrolyzed proteins to balance the nutritional aspects of the amino acids. Soups, shakes, and fruit drinks are common uses for gelatin hydrolysates.

Dietary concerns with collagen protein have been misunderstood for many years. While collagen has been described as an empty protein, or one having little nutritional value, it does in fact contain many essential amino acids, and is readily digested.

C. E. Bodwell reported that collagen can replace 30-40% of the protein in meat and still deliver a protein efficiency ratio greater than 2.0. He went on to state that in practice, the addition of collagen to meat products at levels of 25-30% would not be expected to have a significant effect on the protein nutritional status of individuals consuming meat products. In the U.S., an excess of protein is routinely consumed and marginal levels of tryptophan are probably not of serious concern, stated Dr. Bodwell.

The digestibility of collagen is very high. Laser-Reutersward et al. Demonstrated that in rats, over 90% of collagen was truly digestible, regardless of whether the collagen was heat treated or not.

Rogowski graphically showed that mixtures of beef muscle and gelatin actually increased the biological value by 7% when gelatin was added as 16% of the mixture. A 50/50 blend of gelatin/beef muscle had the same biological value as beef muscle alone. The point is that although humans should consume combinations of proteins from various sources for optimum utilization of the amino acids, collagen (gelatin) can comprise from 25 to 50 % of the protein and still meet or exceed adult nutritional needs.

 

[Mr.G]

I was very sceptical with this because of the amount of protein per serving but I feel great with the amount I have been taking. I bought it for my wife because she doesn't like shakes or eats enough & she loves it.
Good call Phill...

 

[BOOMSHAKER]

Phil, is there a big difference in the stuff you have versus the one that trueprotein now started to sell? Thanks.....

 

[ScottMcD1]

Phil, is there a big difference in the stuff you have versus the one that trueprotein now started to sell? Thanks.....

Those are the ones Phil recommends(TP).

 

[alan1973]

Those are the ones Phil recommends(TP).

True Protein sells the powder though, right?

 

[ScottMcD1]

They sell them exactly like Phil wants, so no not a powder form.