Stem Cells and Bodybuilding- My Take and Experience

[bbxtreme]

You flatter me with your kind words mate, keep this up and…

In all sincerity I like to be upfront and honest I have a decent understanding of quite a bit but at and eighth grade level.

I have utilized the following

Regenexx (PRP only, 4x)
ConciergeMD (Los Angeles)
Dallas Center for Pain Management (Fort Worth Location)
Texas Orthopedics Association (Exosomes 6 administrations)
BioXcellerator
Ways2Well (both the Houston and Austin locations)


Regenexx did nothing for me. ConciergeMD and BioXcellerator I only did IV administration and to be honest I didn’t notice anything really. My wife had fantastic results with her knee from Bio.

TOA - all I’m going to say is don’t waste your money on Exosomes.

Best success I have had is with intra-articulat injections. Pain management center literally saved me a fairly massive surgery. I’ve done Ways2Well now 2x in the past 12 months at both locations and did one IV administration and the second time I did both knees and both shoulders. I can officially say I can leave the gym after a leg day and actually walk down the stairs with no pain.

Ways2Well is usually 3,500 per joint or 5,000 for bi-lateral joints.

From my understanding and I may be wrong here - so please do chime in everyone. The major difference is that in the states they cannot expand the cells (culture them and grow more) but the use of whartons jelly is completely ok?

I’ll add to that my 5th grader difference.

What you had done in Texas is essentially whartons jelly PRP, meaning blood from the donors. So will be rich in growth factors and have “potential” stem cells in it, but isn’t verified as that’s not legal in the U.S.

This is to me allows for them to use the grey area to do the same thing.

My only concern (as I’m sure you will agree) is how do we determine the source and quality. Meaning generic screening (maybe they do this), but also what’s the % of viability.

I spoke in depth with them as I wanted to have an option to send guys to and would suggest them, as long as guys go into it eyes wide open.

That’s my perception and understanding of the difference. Feel free to add by all means.

All I want to know is “does this shit last” which is where I’m sure many guys would be on a basic level. we all want to be 21 again.

 

[danieltx]

@bbxtreme one thing it doesn't look like you've mentioned - how old are you and how many years of legitimate, hardcore bodybuilding training does your body have?

 

[bbxtreme]

@bbxtreme one thing it doesn't look like you've mentioned - how old are you and how many years of legitimate, hardcore bodybuilding training does your body have?

I have, but gets lost in the threads on here. Great reference point!

I’ll be 35 in a few weeks.

Have been bodybuilding since I was 15 years old.

BUT to be fair and to your point- I got back into competing at 30 as I stepped back to build my life and business (no regrets).

At 30 and in 2020 I was training hard and tore my right lat as I was back on a “real” cycle and training for this level of bodybuilding.

However many of my injuries (like my left hip) came from semi pro college football.

But committed to going for a pro card has been my focus since I turned 30.

 

[pesty4077]

@bbxtreme , keep posting and giving updates. Some great information here.

 

[Eguz22]

I don’t know where Ramy is going and didn’t dig for that reason. Lol

Iris Kyle is going where Ronnie does and they are milking her just as much as they are him. I’ll say it again- NOT cool. And told their “owner” that as he was not the expert at all in stem cells.

Flex Lewis has gone to BioXellerator and hasn’t been back which is how it should be as he is retired. I also know several WWE guys and other pro athletes that I spoke to beforehand.

This is NOT something you should cut corners on. It’s cells going into your body to code. Source matters!

I didn't know Iris had serious injuries, in any case, it's interesting what's going on with Ramy, they said the stem cells would miraculously restore his destroyed muscles.

I don't think that's possible and I don't think they are selling the treatment for aesthetic purposes, I mean, Ronnie is looking for general health and wellness, not for his muscles to look good.

 

[bbxtreme]

I didn't know Iris had serious injuries, in any case, it's interesting what's going on with Ramy, they said the stem cells would miraculously restore his destroyed muscles.

I don't think that's possible and I don't think they are selling the treatment for aesthetic purposes, I mean, Ronnie is looking for general health and wellness, not for his muscles to look good.

People like Ronnie and Iris are just trying to get some level of quality of life back. For Coleman that could mean not being in a wheel chair 24/7 or just being able to enjoy the cruises he does with his family each year.

People like them deserve to have that. What bothers me is clinics and groups like them who milk the money and don’t give the best level of care. They just keep having them come back like a badge of honor. When I spoke to the owner he was bragging about how Ronnie as in every 3 months for treatment and that he could arrange for us to be there at the same time if it helped my decision.

I told him absolutely not and wanted to know why the hell Ronnie was having to go there every 3 months as this was going to be almost $20k with them to start. LOL he had no real answer. He said guys like Ronnie who have bone and spine damage won’t respond as well so will likely need more cells to stimulate healing.

Well let’s be real- stem cells do not repair bone issues or alter bone density (not to my knowledge and what I’ve been taught). Stem cells are for muscle and soft tissue only. They will not repair a fully torn muscle either, but can aid in healing a partial tear or inflammation. BioXellerator led with this from their lead doctor down. “It may not work for everyone and do not recommend treatment for bone damage or full muscle tears.”

in regards to Ramy- stem cells also won’t regrow a hole in your quad. It won’t fill in your lower lats after years of brutal rowing.

I think having realistic expectations is good going into this level of care as many guys think- I’ll go in and come out with no muscle tear anymore.

My left bicep and pec minor are the perfect example. The look and shape from the partial tears will always be there. BUT what is gone now is the pain and inflammation which allows me to now train the muscle fully, do PT and rebuild best I can without the same level of risk. For me just erasing the pain and inflammation on the left pec and bicep has allowed me to move weights that I haven’t touched in years.

All comes down to realistic expectations IMO.

 

[BLKGUY2006]

I really appreciate you sharing all this bbxtreme. Hopefully one day it will become more affordable.

 

[275bills]

I have, but gets lost in the threads on here. Great reference point!

I’ll be 35 in a few weeks.

Have been bodybuilding since I was 15 years old.

BUT to be fair and to your point- I got back into competing at 30 as I stepped back to build my life and business (no regrets).

At 30 and in 2020 I was training hard and tore my right lat as I was back on a “real” cycle and training for this level of bodybuilding.

However many of my injuries (like my left hip) came from semi pro college football.

But committed to going for a pro card has been my focus since I turned 30.

How did you tear your lat training?

 

[bbxtreme]

How did you tear your lat training?

LOL it’s embarrassing and funny now. It wasn’t actually “during training”, apologies as I should have clarified. I always warm up each muscle group with a superset of two movements of 3 rounds each set to get blood flowing. Nonstop. As I have gotten older this has proven to be invaluable.

BUT when I’m not training smart such as during COVID, I tear my lat.

I had been training hard bodybuilding level since end of December 2019. Was my start back towards a pro card. COVID hit in February and while I’m in GA it finally shut all gyms down.

I decided I would train from home as I was committed so went to put my pull up bar over the door frame, you have to put it in at an angle then pull down hard to anchor it. Well when I did that my right lat sounded like somebody had just sliced a thick stack of paper. My wife heard it behind me. It was my teres major on the right side.

My back has always been my best bodypart so immediately thought it was all over. It turned into a softball sized bruise from the blood in the area. I had imaging to confirm it which was a pain in COVID. There was nothing I could do but ice and let it rest.

I found my deep tissue guy because of this tear. Cosmetically you could see the tear. Function wise it was forcing over use of my right shoulder. I spent 6 months going in once a week for deep tissue work in the area to break up the scar tissue and trying to regain the cosmetic balance. Most would never know I tore it now looking at it. But took 6-12 months of work and rebuilding with training and still have to be mindful of it on back day.

We found the tear with ultra sound while in Columbia and put 10mil stem cells in the area. I’ve been able to engage lats a bit deeper since having it done as it’s been a constant battle training around it. Fingers crossed this last.

Long ass answer, but hopefully covered all questions that might stem from how it happened and what I did.

 

[275bills]

LOL it’s embarrassing and funny now. It wasn’t actually “during training”, apologies as I should have clarified. I always warm up each muscle group with a superset of two movements of 3 rounds each set to get blood flowing. Nonstop. As I have gotten older this has proven to be invaluable.

Appreciate the response as always bro.

Care to elaborate abit more about this and what exercise you do for each bodypart ?

Kind of like wenning warm up style? If you know what that is lol

 

[bbxtreme]

Appreciate the response as always bro.

Care to elaborate abit more about this and what exercise you do for each bodypart ?

Kind of like wenning warm up style? If you know what that is lol

Never heard of it, but did a quick google search and seems to be similar and a warm up style for powerlifters. May be wrong.

Great question as everyone wants to talk about gear and dosages on here lately and forgets the importance of training and diet and all we put into it.

But I don’t over complicate it and these are NOT working sets. They should not be heavy and only be focused on moving the muscle and activating blood flow. Sets are back to back with no rest so pick your weight accordingly.

Movements can be changed based on your area of focus for each workout. Below are just examples and what I use based on my weak areas I’m focusing on this phase.

Legs (Quad Day): Bike for 5-10 min. Once you get veins and a pump in the quads you’re good. Don’t push it.

Hip Flexor Activation: can do these with a band- wide step side to side. 5 minutes activation. You can also do these on the abductor machine if you don’t want to look like a fitness chick. LOL 3 light sets of 15 reps to activate. 30 seconds rest between sets.

Legs (hamstrings): warm up on bike 5-10 min same as above.

Chest and Bi’s: pec dec fly into machine preacher curls. 3 sets 15-20 reps. Focus on pushing blood into the biceps to be primed for chest.

Delts: Side lat raises (dumbbells) into front lat raises with rope. 3 sets 15-20 reps to push blood deep into the delts. If you’re gym allows for it you can add a machine press here for a third movement same reps and count. This is hard in most gym.

Biceps: Rope curls, straight bar curls, preacher curls (optional if needed) for 15-20 reps 3 sets. I train bis with chest so am already pretty primed.

Triceps: Rope push downs, v bar push downs, over head cable extensions (optional) 15-20 reps for 3 sets. I train tris with back to am primed by this time and don’t do the third movement.

Back: Cable straight arm pullovers superset with dumbbell pullovers off a bench. Do NOT go heavy here. Feel the negative and stretch fully on both moments. On dumbbell- don’t come beyond eye level and contract hard and feel the negative as the goal is to activate and stretch the lower lats. 3 sets 15-20 reps.

 

[Reload]

What day are you now post procedure?
Sorry if you mentioned your tx date above.

 

[275bills]

Never heard of it, but did a quick google search and seems to be similar and a warm up style for powerlifters. May be wrong.

Great question as everyone wants to talk about gear and dosages on here lately and forgets the importance of training and diet and all we put into it.

But I don’t over complicate it and these are NOT working sets. They should not be heavy and only be focused on moving the muscle and activating blood flow. Sets are back to back with no rest so pick your weight accordingly.

Movements can be changed based on your area of focus for each workout. Below are just examples and what I use based on my weak areas I’m focusing on this phase.

Legs (Quad Day): Bike for 5-10 min. Once you get veins and a pump in the quads you’re good. Don’t push it.

Hip Flexor Activation: can do these with a band- wide step side to side. 5 minutes activation. You can also do these on the abductor machine if you don’t want to look like a fitness chick. LOL 3 light sets of 15 reps to activate. 30 seconds rest between sets.

Legs (hamstrings): warm up on bike 5-10 min same as above.

Chest and Bi’s: pec dec fly into machine preacher curls. 3 sets 15-20 reps. Focus on pushing blood into the biceps to be primed for chest.

Delts: Side lat raises (dumbbells) into front lat raises with rope. 3 sets 15-20 reps to push blood deep into the delts. If you’re gym allows for it you can add a machine press here for a third movement same reps and count. This is hard in most gym.

Biceps: Rope curls, straight bar curls, preacher curls (optional if needed) for 15-20 reps 3 sets. I train bis with chest so am already pretty primed.

Triceps: Rope push downs, v bar push downs, over head cable extensions (optional) 15-20 reps for 3 sets. I train tris with back to am primed by this time and don’t do the third movement.

Back: Cable straight arm pullovers superset with dumbbell pullovers off a bench. Do NOT go heavy here. Feel the negative and stretch fully on both moments. On dumbbell- don’t come beyond eye level and contract hard and feel the negative as the goal is to activate and stretch the lower lats. 3 sets 15-20 reps.

Awesome thanks for sharing bro

 

[bbxtreme]

What day are you now post procedure?
Sorry if you mentioned your tx date above.

I’m going into my third week since the procedure now. Was down for treatment the week of January 8th.

So far the areas have continued to feel strong and no pain. Just still working through the left rotator cuff issues in terms of mobility.

 

[Ruhlfreak55]

Damnit. I thought this was closer to 10k and was starting to plan on doing it. I'm not sure I can do 30. Being alone and running a household yourself takes a lot of fundies.

At this point both my hips are even starting to hurt, in addition to all kind of other shit that's been around longer.

 

[jstrong20]

I don't have the cash for that. But Intrested in your results. Your post are always well detailed.

 

[Knight9]

I’m going into my third week since the procedure now. Was down for treatment the week of January 8th.

So far the areas have continued to feel strong and no pain. Just still working through the left rotator cuff issues in terms of mobility.

Does the transaction have to be cash/wire or does the clinic you went to accept all or part of it on credit?

 

[Reload]

BB do you have baseline labs of your inflammatory markers (C-reactive protein, homocysteine and plasma viscosity etc.) prior to your procedure? I would think the trend would be going down correct?

 

[bbxtreme]

Does the transaction have to be cash/wire or does the clinic you went to accept all or part of it on credit?

I put all of mine on a credit card with 0% interest for 12 months. I had it open so why not. But you can pay however you want- cash, card, wire. They don’t offer financing though. Most people like care credit won’t allow it.

 

[bbxtreme]

Update: tomorrow marks 5 weeks since having stem cells done.

At my PT appointment last Thursday we rechecked my measurements and ROM and he was shocked. Even the small amount tightness in my left shoulder is gone now.

I’ve also come off my Nebilivol as it was dripping my vitals too low and causing issues.

I had bloodwork done last week and my numbers are beyond perfect. LDL 40, HDL 25, HSCRP 1, all other markers in range. E2 is 20.

I’ve dropped any orals from my cycles (minus Aromasin). We’ve increased calories significantly- up 15 pounds in 2 weeks roughly from rebound. We have added more insulin.

What is most noticeable is still my consistent energy and feeling like I’m 10 years younger, but also my digestion as usually when eating 800g of carbs on a high day I struggle. My body is just churning along.

Again, the key is does this keep lasting? Time will tell and hope so.

For all the guys asking me about starting a log. I have permission to share “most” of what I do from my coach. But I am about to be moving, run a business and know I wouldn’t stay consistent with a log on here with all I have going and coming up.

So instead, if there is enough demand OR can be done here- I can start a thread or open to an “Ask Me” thread and I’m happy to answer what I can and commit as much time to it as possible as I know over the next few months I won’t have as much time to post on here.

So like my other threads- if guys want it, I’ll make one or do it here.

I only post to share my opinion, experiences and help pay it forward with others in the sport as this place has done for me since I was a teenager.