Another effective training method to throw in your rotation: "just get that b*tch sore af"

[stackdizzy]

These are the threads I try not to post. I'm going to make a fairly provocative post...but most of this is pretty much settled science and I'll post some associated studies.


1. If you are an accustomed lifter, the repeated bout effect will protect your body from damage when training. This is important to keep us alive. Logically thinking if you went to the gym 5 days a week and caused muscle damage...you'd surely get rhabdo and likely be dead. The implication here is if you are going to the gym routinely and accustomed any hypertrophy you are getting is not from muscle damage, repair and regeneration. One single bout of a novel movement will activate the RBE effect for up to 24 weeks. IE...you are not protected from muscle damage https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24701128/

2. The myocytic androgen receptor controls the strength but not the mass of limb muscle. Meaning, getting a stronga does not get you a bigga, this is especially true once the RBE has kicked in. All adaptions for strength gain will be a chemical reaction at the androgen receptor.

3. After only 6 weeks of training almost all growth/hypertrophy is from sarcoplasmic hypertrophy. Fluid, essentially. They cycle of being a routine lifter, not getting sore, and getting bigger and full is just sarcoplasmic hypertrophy. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6550381/

3b. This is how generally how everyone is getting enormous (including me at one point). Sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (and fat) has no MND size limit. Unfortunately, real and actual tissue growth does have an MND size limit. This is what most people refer to as "newbie gains ending" or their genetic limit. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25464670/

4. Eccentric focused training that is new or unaccustomed is a great way to cause muscle damage, repair and remodel, and actual tissue growth https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10356650/


What I'm getting at is you can get huge and not really build any muscle. It's why so many get huge in the offseason (even when fat gain is kept under control) and so many lose it when dieting. There is no limit (especially with drugs and proper diet manipulation) to the amount of sarcoplasmic hypertrophy you can gain and your body literally has protective mechanisms to keep you from muscle damage if you are a routine trainer.

You can likely get around the MND size limit, RBE, and the bodies other protective mechanisms...but it's extremely hard to find that path to continue to cause damage and then you must stay in a well fed state.

Driving strength via the androgen receptor and growth via sarcoplasmic isn't "evil". It's what bodybuilding and powerlifting are based on....but it's also not actual tissue growth.

And finally...I'll leave you with this. This is EASY to test. Stop training, stop all carbs, and stop all drugs. If your growth is driven by real damage and remodel of tissue/myofibrillar growth, as long as you are not bedridden, you really should not strength OR lose strength.



All of this post is to make the point that getting DOMS can and likely is a decent sign that damage has occurred and you may have an opportunity for an actual adaption in real growth.

thanks for taking the time to put this together! Excellent post!

 

[stackdizzy]

Everyone is different, I suppose. I find that if I've allowed myself to get into a training rut, and then change things up, that first week on the new program I'll experience some soreness. A little bit of soreness is taken as a good sign, IMO, as I'm concluding that the muscle group is slightly confused, and getting stimulated in a slightly different way. More than that, and I'm thinking that I've injured myself and should be careful (important for us old farts).

For guys with fast metabolisms and only modest responders to AAS, I agree with all the posts above, you have to be hyper vigilant on the diet. Excess calories, and intelligent macro breakdown. The body can't grow without getting the proper fuel.

One other thing, for the guys that are really training intensively, I've experienced some benefit in taking a week off (maybe once a quarter or once every two quarters), and just doing cardio and some light full-body circuit work on the off week to give the CNS a respite. Upon returning to my tough training, I felt rested, recouped and mentally more ready to go. Maybe some people don't need this, but it's been helpful for me, and several others who had good results concurred.

Yea I have taken weeks off when I was younger and would always come back stronger.